Rambling 289: The Neighborhood of Paradise

Where is Paradise? What is the history of this mysterious place? What is the true purpose of this hidden Neighborhood Town? The duo finally deep dive into the most mysterious neighborhood in the United States. Nearly impossible to locate, almost no information about it and the strangest circumstances surrounding the area around the neighborhood. The truth about this place will be revealed.

+Episode Details

Topics Discussed:

  • West Milford New Jersey
  • Secret Dirt Road
  • Google Maps
  • Private Residency
  • Public Records
  • Personal Accounts
  • Resources and Food
  • Extremely Strange Details

Official Website - https://greythoughts.info/podcast

Twitter - https://twitter.com/JustConvoPod

Facebook - https://facebook.com/justconvopod

Instagram - https://instagram.com/justconvopod


+Transcript

Cristina: Warning. This program contains strong themes meant for a mature audience. Discretion is advised.

Jack: Going live in 5, 4.

Cristina: What does live mean?

Jack: Welcome to the Rambling Podcast. I'm your host, Jack.

Cristina: And I'm your host, Christina.

Jack: And this is the show where we ground humanity's most absurd and baffling ideas. And boy, oh, boy, our ideas can get quite, quite baffled today. There is so much baffling to happen, but this requires us to kind of unpack a little something that we've been dealing with lately. So in the previous episode, we were dealing with the Minotaur, a creature from Greek mythology, which turned out to just basically be some kind of freak show experiment.

Cristina: Two of them.

Jack: Two of them. The Toro Boban and the Minotaur, which are related and unrelated simultaneously, like they're brothers. Not the same thing. Although both creatures were discussed in mythology for God knows how long as one thing.

Cristina: That's pretty crazy.

Jack: Yes. Now, one of the things that we realized discussing these creatures was a pattern that we'd noticed before elsewhere, which was where these creatures were. The labyrinth.

Cristina: Labyrinth. Oh, yeah, yeah.

Jack: And the labyrinth is identical to a different location we're very familiar with, which is the house of this lady who was messing with ghosts and creating sort.

Cristina: Of made a labyrinth.

Jack: Yeah. Her house was a labyrinth. Slowly and meticulously built. She stopped contractors from coming in and assisting because she knew they couldn't figure it out. The way she needed it done was very specific. And so the labyrinth, although the construction of the labyrinth isn't specified, the purpose of the labyrinth is kind of clear. Opposite to the lady's house mansion, where the purpose of the labyrinth was not explained, but the construction. Yes. And we can assume one informs the other. We can assume that the labyrinth where the Toro Boban was was very meticulously built and that the purpose of the mansion being a maze was for the same reason that we're formed. The labyrinth is for that entrance, for the entrance at the center, the seance room and the entrance at the Minotaur Guards Y are one in the same, and, well, not literally one the same, but identical in use and purpose. And this was quite illuminating to find this pattern because it told us about the third location that we have maybe been looking in the wrong places this entire time.

Cristina: Somewhere in Clinton Road.

Jack: Somewhere in Clinton Road. Now, we've looked at the castle, we've brushed over Paradise Road. We've looked at the mines, we've looked at the woods, the bridge, the lake, and we just don't find what we're looking for.

Cristina: I mean, it could be in the mines. We have no idea.

Jack: It could totally be in the mines. But the mines are just connected to the castle.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So it's all one somehow. And then the surface level, because again, the mines in the bottom of the castle are connected underground. And then the top layer is a jumbled mess of. You pop it in here. Come over there. You can see this over here. You can see that over there, a weird mess that kind of feels like the maze, but not exactly, because you're not popping in and out. You're not getting lost in this space and popping up in that space. Literally, you're seeing them. But there is a place that behaves like that that, again, we've brushed over, but never really focused on in great detail because the lady in white doesn't seem to be there. The boy doesn't seem to be there. It doesn't seem to be any particular experiments taking place there.

Cristina: But you hear children there, or at least your experience children.

Jack: Yes. And there's reports of that. Yes.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: Which is not Paradise Road, but Paradise itself. The neighborhood town.

Cristina: An actual real town.

Jack: It's a neighborhood.

Cristina: Is. Yes. But, like, that's the. What you think is the hotspot. The.

Jack: I don't think it's a hotspot is what fits. Yeah, it fits the maze description. Because my personal experience in there was the roads were shifting. We took a straight line. We went on the dirt road named. We went on the road named paradise that became a dirt road and went into an indescript road that took us to Paradise. From paradise, we go in a straight line, no turns. We see houses to the left, woods to the right. We make it to what seems like the other end, do a K turn. So we're looking back where we started. Go in a straight line and don't find the exit.

Cristina: That is weird.

Jack: So a clean 180 back from where we came, except no longer was the dirt road. We came from there.

Cristina: That's such a crazy story, but has anyone experienced such a thing?

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: What? What? What? What?

Jack: Okay, Exactly. So let's unpack what we know about Paradise. So paradise is, as we know, located around Clinton Road in the West Milford, like, forest region.

Cristina: It's a small town in the forest.

Jack: It's a neighborhood that feels kind of like a town.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: And the. I looked at this on Google Maps to kind of, like, try to zone in, and it's way specific. Now, in the Google Maps overview, you can't actually get a street view all the way through Paradise. Now, it goes as Follows Clinton Road, goes up the right side. You're just looking. You're looking at Google Maps right now. You got a square screen in front of you. To your right, Clinton Road is just going straight up. We're zoomed in, only on Paradise Road. So Clinton Road starts, and it just goes through the whole screen and keeps going. You don't see it. It's just the piece that you do see. And the beginning and ending out of your sight. Okay, Now, a random in the script road connects to Paradise. You can enter Paradise Road from another street elsewhere. Okay, Perfectly fine. And Paradise Road just kind of winds, goes around. It takes a nice little kind of left loop and then connects to a different town. Perfectly fine.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Now, between the left entrance of the town of the Paradise Road, the first, whatever the f*** the name of that road is that connects, there's an immediate neighborhood there and the bottom entrance. So to the left of your screen, you would have one entrance. It goes right, winds down the exit to the bottom. It's very small road. The exit to the bottom connects to two roads. The one that connects to Clinton, and again, just another part of a main road somewhere. Mm, the left entrance. You cannot do a street view starting there. Now, you can see that whole neighborhood there from the Google Maps top. It's a visible neighborhood. And if you were to drop your pin on that road to the left, even if you can't get a street view going through the street into the neighborhood, you can see the neighborhood from the street. You can drop the pin perfectly fine. The other end at the bottom of the screen, you could drop the pin there, and you can go on Paradise Road about halfway up before, in Google Maps, on the street view, it just turns into a dirt road. Suddenly you're just moving, and it's paved, paved, paved. And then the pave just kind of ends and fizzles out. And now it's just a dirt road.

Cristina: And that's what you remember, a dirt road. Right.

Jack: It's not the dirt road I remember specifically, but I'll get to that. Okay, but this road just becomes a dirt road suddenly. And you can't go farther with the street view. It stops right there. You cannot move farther beyond that point. Now, this gives you a bit of a loop, begins loops, connects to the other side. The loop area starts at the neighborhood, goes, and then connects to where it becomes paved again, that loop area, you cannot see it on Google Maps from Street View. You can only see the road from Google Maps skyview from the top down. Okay? The road that's in the script that connects to paradise comes out of that side you cannot see on the street view. Additionally, the road that connects cannot be seen from the sky view because it's covered by the forest. Oh, I looked for it and I couldn't find it. It doesn't exist. It's there.

Cristina: It's there underneath.

Jack: Underneath the trees. It's such a literal dirt road. It doesn't exist from the sky view. And Google Maps literally doesn't allow you to explore it. To explore it.

Cristina: Maybe it doesn't see it as a road though, because you said it's trees.

Jack: It's trees. Yeah. It's covered by trees.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Very weird.

Cristina: That is weird.

Jack: Very strange. Who the h*** knows? Okay, okay, here's the literal view I'm talking about. So for reference, down here is Clinton Road.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: This is Clinton Road all going up. This is the road that connects the Paradise Road. There's many different ways you can connect. A little neighborhood down there. You can also see there's a little.

Cristina: Neighborhood over here, what's considered Paradise Road.

Jack: This entire thing is Paradise Road. Okay, now, weird fact right here. If I were to grab a little thingy. Oh, I can't. I gotta zoom in a little more. Let me go in a little deeper. But you see that neighborhood right up there, Right? It's visible right here.

Cristina: Okay. Yeah.

Jack: Okay, now you see what's happening here?

Cristina: I'm not sure what's happening.

Jack: Oh, my God. Yeah, I can't drop the pin in the neighborhood. I can't.

Cristina: The line is. It has to be blue for you to drop it in. Is that what's happening?

Jack: Okay, yes. And if I go down to the other end, I can again show you. Interesting.

Cristina: No? Yeah. There's specific, but it sees it as a road.

Jack: So I can definitely knows and it sees it as a road.

Cristina: Yeah, but you can't go into those towns. There's some towns there that looks like you can't look at the road.

Jack: Yeah, sure. That's totally fine. What we're looking at is paradise and specific. There's many locations you can't look at. It's. Why is this the specific location we can't look at? And you see how it was paved at some point. You can see that it's paved underneath it, but it's slowly getting more dirt focused as we go.

Cristina: Eventually it just be there.

Jack: Eventually it's just going to be dirt. It just kind of fizzles out deeper and deeper. And it doesn't matter the dark distance we go slowly but surely we hit this very point where it just completely becomes rocks.

Cristina: Oh, yeah.

Jack: Oh, it's just. It's just rocks now.

Cristina: It's just rocks. Yeah.

Jack: And now I can't even go. It just became totally rocks that the street fizzled out and I can't go farther.

Cristina: That's it. That is weird.

Jack: Yep.

Cristina: But that's still the road.

Jack: That's still Paradise Road. They could have easily just driven. It's still a road. It's a drivable road. It's clearly drivable. Why did the Google Scanner driver not want to go there? Who told the Google scanner driver, don't go beyond this point? And how does this make any sense if the neighborhood on the other end is clearly a functioning, elaborate neighborhood and you can jump into that neighborhood as you saw previously? No.

Cristina: Oh, I saw in the bottom. I wasn't looking up there.

Jack: Well, I showed you that there's no way onto here before.

Cristina: Oh, okay. Except for that one road. You can't go onto the.

Jack: You can't enter the beginning of this road.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Weird, right?

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Now this is Paradise Road we're looking at. Somewhere on Paradise Road is the access road to the neighborhood of Paradise. This isn't the neighborhood of Paradise.

Cristina: It's not?

Jack: No, it's not. That's just a random neighborhood.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: The neighborhood of paradise was so cluttered by trees that every house within a two foot radius had a fully grown tree directly next to it, which means its roof would be totally covered by trees.

Cristina: So you're saying it's there, but it's not there. Like we can't see it.

Jack: I think we can. And I think that's this circular formation we're looking at here. You can see little spicks of white in a circular formation going on. It's there, but it's hidden. Hidden.

Cristina: That's scary.

Jack: It's visibly in front of our face. You think you can see this whole little area right here fully covered by trees?

Cristina: Yeah. Except there's something in there. Yeah. What?

Jack: And that would mean that the access road must be directly in the area that we can't see.

Cristina: Weird. And we can't even check it out.

Jack: We can't check it out. We can't look at it. We can't do anything without going there ourselves. It would be impossible. There's no other way to investigate. You have to go there.

Cristina: So it's not even like a town we go find, but it is a real town.

Jack: It's there.

Cristina: We can see it there.

Jack: We can see it nice and hidden. We can't Tell where the road begins and ends.

Jack: There's no way to spot the access point.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But it's there because they must be reaching the neighborhood up here somehow. But I remember it being just the. We were just teenagers exploring, and we're like, hey, sketchy dirt road. Let's go on it. And so we did, and we landed at this place. I couldn't tell you exactly where the road is.

Cristina: No.

Jack: But I know in which direction it's going.

Cristina: It's impossible. It's impossible to see, like, how. You had to be there.

Jack: You had to be there. You have to literally be driving this road in order to find it to begin with.

Cristina: It's just. It's not there.

Jack: Yeah. And that road has no name.

Cristina: That road has no name.

Jack: No. Yeah. This is Paradise Road. And Paradise Road leads us to the dirt road, which is somewhere hidden in the woods. No markings. Google doesn't even recognize it as a road. Yet there's still a neighborhood we can see, covered by trees. There is a way there.

Cristina: Weird.

Jack: Additionally, if you look at Paradise Road and you look at Clinton Road, they're about almost equal distances from the neighborhood. In fact, the bottom part of the neighborhood is probably equal. Literally equal distances to both sides. So there might be more than one road in. Unless paradise is the only way. But that means we can maybe drive across Clinton Road and spot in that direction of road. But I did that and didn't find anything.

Cristina: And you typed in Paradise Road and it doesn't pop up.

Jack: No. Paradise Road is this road. Oh, you type in Paradise Road and it'll show you this.

Cristina: Yeah, Paradise, I guess. Can you type in paradise, though?

Jack: No, it won't tell you where the neighborhood is.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: Now you can find information about the neighborhood online. Not a lot.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But the neighborhood is definitely written about and exists, and people have seen it.

Cristina: Yes, but on Google Maps, it does.

Jack: Not exist on Google. Well, yeah, exactly. It tries by any means to pretend this clear formation here, this circular formation doesn't exist.

Cristina: Very strange. That is very strange.

Jack: But clearly. Obviously. Obviously. Come on, bro. Obviously. We're looking at houses stacked in the middle of this.

Cristina: What else could that be?

Jack: What else could that be? In a perfect little circle, too. Yeah, Perfect little circle going on.

Cristina: There's something weird happening in those trees.

Jack: With the largest patch being in the middle.

Cristina: Weird. That's the church. No, that's. That is so strange, because there's something in the woods. There's something in the woods. You can see there's things there, but you can't see what those things are, we can't investigate.

Jack: We have to literally be there in person. There's no way to like weird, weird.

Cristina: Did it have. I guess on Google they have pictures of the town. Is it like very foresty? Because that's ridiculous.

Jack: It looks like it's people's estimated photo. Like it's not really about the town. It might just be neighborhoods surrounding it.

Cristina: Yeah. It could be abandoned town for all I know. I don't understand.

Jack: Yeah, it could totally be an abandoned town. It's odd in general.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: It's a weird view right here.

Cristina: Yes. Is it abandoned? Do you know that? Do you know?

Jack: I don't know what to tell you based on that. If it is, you'll find out as we go through it. But details about this hidden, private, rural as all h*** neighborhood, as we know, located in West Milford, New Jersey. What we just saw, it is tucked away off of the infamous Clinton Road. Very close. But you wouldn't find that considering the area. And the only access point is off of Paradise Road.

Cristina: Yeah, that is weird. Okay.

Jack: Which becomes a dirt road suddenly. Now it doesn't become an undrivable dirt road. Any car, as you saw, any car could easily drive that road.

Cristina: Yeah, it's still a road.

Jack: It's still a clearly clear road. It's a dirt road, but it's not. It's not even bumpy. It was just nice and smooth.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: It's just an unpaved, very smooth road. Any car could easily traverse it. Yeah. And on the other end, it's paved too. It just becomes paved again. It's really just going through this one patch that whoever decided we're gonna pave the road also decided we're gonna stop paving it right here.

Jack: Weird.

Cristina: There has to be reasons for that.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Yeah, super strange. You just decided out of nowhere we're just not gonna finish paving it. We're going to ignore that other neighborhood, not pave through it. And the entire. Just for whatever reason, we're not going to finish connecting it.

Cristina: That road is in itself some weird mystery. Something's happening on that road.

Jack: Strange, right?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Okay. So weird. It's so weird. It just becomes a dirt road that leads to a hard to find access road that we couldn't find from the top. And I know it was weird when we found the access road the first time. We're like, oh, weird dirt road. A legitimate dirt road that just goes where? Let's find out.

Cristina: Yeah, okay.

Jack: Strangest thing ever. So the road, the access road that comes off of paradise, it has no marking. So it's basically a nameless road. That's why we just refer to it by Paradise Road. Because Paradise Road is the only road connecting to it that has name.

Cristina: Okay. But it itself isn't really.

Jack: Yeah, we can assume. Yeah, it's just a random, like, connecting road, if anything. So really, the only way to the neighborhood is Paradise Road. And then this indescript, unnamed, hard to find other road.

Cristina: Mystery Road. Okay.

Jack: Yo, that's beautiful. Mystery Road.

Cristina: All right.

Jack: Interesting. Mystery Road can only be accessed through Paradise Road.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And additionally, Mystery Road is particularly difficult to locate at night because of its completely covered up nature. It's swallowed alive by the surrounding foliage.

Cristina: It's so strange that you even stumble upon it.

Jack: Yeah, yeah, it really is.

Cristina: Because your goal wasn't to go on to Paradise Road or anything. It was just.

Jack: It was just Clinton Road. And we were just trying to scare each other. And we found this other road, jumped on it, and then we somehow found this other. And then before long, we're in Paradise. Yeah, we do remember it. When we get into the neighborhood, there's a sign that says welcome to paradise. That we do remember. And then following that, sinuses beware deaf children. And somebody, you know, sketchly cross one out or whatever. Dead children. But that's really weird. Just getting to it is odd. Just seeing it is weird.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And like we just saw, you can follow it. You can follow paradise and it will not continue weird.

Cristina: But it's weird.

Jack: Suddenly becomes a dirt road weird. And that's less weird than the Google scanner. Just not driving it. Dude. So many dirt roads you have driven. This is the shortest patch ever of dirt road that you could possibly drive. It would have been the easiest job completion ever. It would have taken you three minutes.

Cristina: I don't know, maybe it wasn't. It didn't want to because, like, the. The places in a forest, like, even if they laid that out, you wouldn't see anything. You just have lines in the forest. Right in the Google search.

Jack: Well, no. Why. Why didn't he. Complete driving Paradise.

Cristina: Oh, paradise itself.

Jack: He didn't have to go off of Mystery Road. He could have just kept driving Paradise. It would have taken him three minutes.

Cristina: That's true.

Jack: There's nothing in the way. It's just a dirt road that connects right back to the rest of the town.

Cristina: Because you want us to see Mystery Road. I guess. I guess that's why I was. I don't know.

Jack: It seems like they're protecting that road. Right?

Cristina: Like, even if there's no Reason to go onto that road.

Jack: It's weird.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So definitely cannot be found without going there personally. Already the strangest part. Mm, weird. All right, next. It's primarily a residential area. Paradise Town, the neighborhood town. Now, it contains no business structures, no markets or anything of the sort. It's purely residential. People just live in there.

Cristina: Okay, that's a little weird, but I mean, it's not weird.

Jack: You're surrounded by mad neighborhoods with stores and stuff. And I'm sure a downtown area isn't not too far off. Yeah, it's very countryside where, you know, we all live over here, and I got to drive 20 minutes in the town to get to buy groceries or whatever the f***, you know, that kind of thing. So they kind of just live in there. And the roads of the neighborhood are paved. I remember that specifically. The roads inside the neighborhood are paved, which means people came to pave, stopping short on paradise just to block off that part of the dirt road.

Cristina: And that must be another spot that you enter the town through. Maybe.

Jack: Maybe. And then. But it's not Clinton Road, because I click through just following. There's not one moment in which a road goes left. There's nothing.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And I looked carefully.

Cristina: Strange. Okay. I don't know what.

Jack: But the neighborhood is paved, Meaning somebody came to pave in the neighborhood and just close enough on paradise, but didn't finish paradise or Mystery Road.

Cristina: That is weird.

Jack: Weird pattern. Immediately reminds me of the lady who made the mansion where she let people do some parts, and it was like, no, get the h*** out. I got it. The specifics require me to finish these parts.

Cristina: Mmm.

Jack: Very reminiscent of that.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Of like, nah, I don't need your help anymore.

Cristina: Interesting.

Jack: Weird. Weird. Just looking at this stuff now, because of this nature, even if the neighborhood is paved and most of paradise is paved, it kind of makes the neighborhood exceptionally reclusive and exceptionally isolated from the rest of the world because you'd have to know where to find a dirt road.

Cristina: That's like, how do people even end up moving in there? Huh?

Jack: And another detail is that the primarily residential area has less than 50 homes total. Very small.

Cristina: Less than 50 homes. Wow. That's a small.

Jack: Tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny.

Cristina: It's not a town, though. It's. It's just a neighborhood.

Jack: It's just a neighborhood. But I will continue to call it a neighborhood town because of how removed it is. Yeah, it feels like a town.

Cristina: Yeah, it does.

Jack: Even if it's a neighborhood, it's weird. It's got already a weird vibe that makes it hard to describe in general, but it formed in the early 1950s.

Cristina: 1950S, that's when all that weird stuff was going.

Jack: That's when all the weird s*** was going down. Of course, for reference, I've got the timeline right up here, so we can focus on the things that happened around the 1950s. So leading into it, in 1950, 1952 specifically, was the first reports of the satanic rituals that were happening. 1955 is when the investigations were demanded by the mayor. Previous to that, 1939 was when the sketchy deal took place. So these are the events surrounding the formation of Paradise Road. Not Paradise Road, of the neighborhood of Paradise.

Cristina: Yeah, but who are those people? Where did they come from? Are they part of these cults? Are they part of the water park, whatever they're called?

Jack: Yeah, weird. Weird. Now, paradise formed in the early 1950s and is composed of residents with a tight knit generational like lineage, so that their families today, the people who live there today, they're related, have been primarily related. So this house belonged to my dad, that belonged to my grandma, and I've lived in this neighborhood always. People don't move in, people just live there.

Cristina: Strange.

Jack: People move out. Nobody moves in.

Cristina: But how did they get there? How did they get there? How?

Jack: At some point in the 1950s, they went in there.

Cristina: I know, but like, strange, strange.

Jack: So another weird part is that many of the residents have like lived there their entire lives. So they were born there and they just stay there until the day they die.

Cristina: But I wonder, like, where do they work? They're not there all day.

Jack: It's gonna get weird in a way that's gonna make it look that way. The entire surrounding area is covered by thick foliage, overgrown nature and unmaintained woods, as we've seen, making it impossible to see from any direction, even from on top. To locate through the dirt road, AKA Mystery Road and even access through Paradise Road. It's just invisible unless you know it's there. Yeah, the privacy of that is absurd.

Cristina: That is crazy.

Jack: It's just right there in the middle of New Jersey, invisible to the rest of the world.

Cristina: It's a mystery that you stumbled upon by mere chance.

Jack: Now, weird time based detail. The houses in paradise have extremely old designs, often appearing to be dated to the late 1800s design styles, with exception for a few that could be dated maybe to the 90s at the. At the latest.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: So the late 1800s. Many of them look like they were built around that time. But that makes no sense considering the 1950s is when this neighborhood formed.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: With the most modern structures appearing to have been the designs of the 90s.

Cristina: That is weird, too. Like, why would they be.

Jack: So in the past 30 years, no advancement in the structures, which would make sense if you don't want to expand in the houses that are there. Just the houses that are there from now on, but still kind of chooses.

Cristina: To go back like that. Like 1800s.

Jack: Weird. Right.

Cristina: You're in the 1950s. You're not making 1950 styles or whatever is the end style.

Jack: Like, there are some houses that appear to be that, but the oldest structures appear to have a late 1800s kind of aesthetic.

Cristina: Weird.

Jack: Very strange. When we look at public records for this. Right. There is very few period that address the neighborhood of paradise specifically. There's no media mentions. There's no public events ever hosted, and there's no historical records. Private, private, private, private. It's also unclear whether all the residents of the neighborhood are American citizens or if they were just born and never registered. It's unknown how many people actually live in that neighborhood. Because people could have legitimately been born there, never registered, and they could just go to stores locally and stuff, and there'd be no reason for them to ever go into a hospital and, hey, I exist.

Cristina: That is. I don't know what.

Jack: And because we know people don't enter the neighborhood to audit.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Because nobody enters the neighborhood. It's unclear how many people actually live there.

Cristina: But it can't be many. Or can it be many?

Jack: Like 50 houses? If we assume three people per house. You got a lot of people already. That's 150 people.

Cristina: People move out, but people don't move in.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Is that true?

Jack: I don't know. We say multiple generations of people.

Cristina: Oh, yeah. They could just move into other homes that were abandoned.

Jack: No, abandoned home is if they just keep multiplying. We can't just assume extended families live in single houses.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: So my grandma lives in the basement. My dad lives on the next floor. I got five kids myself. We all just overpopulated.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Weird.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: That's very strange that it's unclear how many people live there. It's theorized that many of the residents have been born and raised within the neighborhood of paradise and have not registered at a local hospital or city hall.

Cristina: But they don't, like, go to school either. Or at least unknown.

Jack: Maybe they have their own schooling, homeschooling. That could happen.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So it basically just results in an impossible calculation. You can't tell how many people actually live in there. And I Have no say about this next part. But this has been claimed by people who have ventured through, which is that the residents aren't too kind to outsiders.

Cristina: But you didn't see anyone, so you wouldn't know.

Jack: I saw zero people.

Cristina: Except for the laughing.

Jack: Laughing that was on the way there. That was on Mystery Road.

Cristina: Oh, it could have been the people.

Jack: 100%. I saw nobody, though.

Cristina: That is strange.

Jack: We saw no one the whole time we were there. Not a soul.

Cristina: Well, people have seen people and they're just normal, un friendly people.

Jack: Unfriendly people say hi, they'll ignore people. That kind of stuff.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Now, the neighborhood is incredibly self sufficient. One of the stranger aspects of it is that it being purely residential. But rarely is anybody seen. Rarely. In fact, most of the claims of there being anybody weren't even about inside the neighborhood. It was from the few times that people have been seen leaving the neighborhood.

Cristina: Oh, my God. So no one goes in or if they have.

Jack: Nobody has seen anybody go in. People have only seen people come out and when they. Hey, can you tell me about the ignored? Hey, I'm kind of lost. Can you. Ignored.

Cristina: What is strange? People like their family. They're just. It sounds like, I guess what people picture, like hillbillies.

Jack: Yes, yes. It's very, very that. It feels like very like off in my area. But if you rarely see people coming in or out, where's the food coming from? Again, you'd assume they're going to the local stores. But nobody's seeing anybody coming in and out.

Cristina: No, but they're surrounded by woods.

Jack: They're surrounded by wood. Do you think they're hunting? I mean, I guess yes.

Cristina: They sound like those type of people. They sound like, yeah, they just live off the land and they live together as a close knit family.

Jack: Definitely has that vibe. Additionally, at the southern edge of the neighborhood, there is a barn.

Cristina: There is a barn.

Jack: So they could be growing their own food.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And hunting for the rest of it and growing the rest in the woods.

Cristina: They have seen people leaving.

Jack: They have seen people leaving. Nobody has ever seen somebody going in shopping. They could be shopping. Hundred percent. And if that's such a small number of people, then one person with a pickup can fill the pickup up with enough groceries, go in and not have to come out for a while. Mm, Totally solvable problem. But the barn would also fix it.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And the fact that they're surrounded by so much thick foliage and woods will also fix it. They could just grow things in the woods. And that also means you could Just hunt the deer and hunt or whatever that's in there.

Cristina: Yeah. We can't even check if any of these guys have a job or anything possible. Yeah.

Jack: We know nothing about them. Right there in the middle.

Cristina: Just hidden. They're all just hidden.

Jack: Just hidden. Weird.

Cristina: That is very strange what is happening.

Jack: There now while the southern edge of the neighborhood has the barn, it gets weirder because it appears that there's a city hall like structure to the northern edge. City hall, they have a meeting point where there's governance or it would seem interesting.

Cristina: So they don't have. If they do have jobs there. No one really knows.

Jack: Nobody really knows.

Cristina: They might just have like a little society there.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: They're policing their streets, they're nursing their people there.

Jack: It could all just be. It's consistently described by outsiders as a self sustained and self efficient neighborhood. They don't require the outside world. Very odd. Now what's weirder about this is that you are in one of the most spoken of places in the entire country, yet you yourself are unknown. The castle. Everybody knows about the mines. Everybody knows about the road. Everybody knows about the lake. Everybody knows about. You're surrounded by all this s*** and nobody knows about you. That's the weirdest part about this.

Cristina: That is so weird. But they're so hidden. They're so hidden.

Jack: They are so. But this many people coming through all the time, you would think a lot of people go through that road. So why don't people going through that road consistently find Mystery Road and just explore? There should just be so many cases of, you know, people trying to scare each other or in the daylight, truly exploring. Let's go in the morning so we have the most amount of time before nightfall and we can truly get a look at everything out here.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: That would mean there's only three roads all of Clinton, top to bottom, 10 miles, no lights, no turns. That's one straight shot. You explored that. It took you no time.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Then you got the one turn into Paradise Road and you could travel all of Paradise Road. It would take you all of 10 minutes. And then in that time, how many people would find Mystery Road? It would be a f****** clusterfuck of people consistently finding Mystery Road and exploring that side too.

Cristina: Well, they only go there at night, so maybe it's harder to see.

Jack: I'm sure people go there in the daylight.

Cristina: I know, but just not the same number.

Jack: No, not the same number, but probably a s*** storm of people still. A f*** ton of people probably still go there during the daylight because they're too scared to go there at night. Okay, so where are these excessive numbers of stories? We have so few mentions, there's almost nothing on it. I checked everything.

Cristina: Like how do you keep people. But they're so hidden. They're so well hidden.

Jack: You'd find the road if you're navigating. If you just decided the complete driving on Paradise Road, you would find Mystery Road. Presumably. Unless it's so invisible that you don't even realize it exists. Driving right by it. But we found it.

Cristina: Yes, he found it. I don't know. That's a. That's a mystery itself. I don't know.

Jack: Well, I'll give you the next weird part. Mystery Road people have only ever seen people leaving it at night. Every single report was about night. Nobody has ever even reported seeing Mystery Road in the daytime.

Cristina: So you think Mystery Road doesn't exist in the daytime? I don't know.

Jack: I don't know. It's just. That's a really weird detail. Yeah, because now we're at a category I just called the Fringe.

Cristina: It's.

Jack: These are reports from non residential people that are.

Cristina: That stumble upon Mystery Road.

Jack: To stumble upon Mystery Road. Nobody has ever reported seeing something and it be daylight.

Cristina: It's at night.

Jack: They've only seen people leaving the road at night. If they are seeing the road during the daylight, they're just ignoring it because they don't see anybody coming in around.

Cristina: That could be. That could be.

Jack: Could totally be. But all the mentions of somebody coming out happen at night.

Cristina: Why just that night.

Jack: And nobody claims they've seen anybody go in.

Cristina: And you were there at night and.

Jack: I was there at night. Stumbled by accident onto Mystery Road. It was so obviously there.

Cristina: But you didn't stumble upon anyone. I mean, you did, but not on.

Jack: Not on Mystery Road. It wasn't even Paradise.

Cristina: Paradise. Maybe he came from that place.

Jack: Well, the. A consistent mention on Paradise Road. I didn't experience this and I didn't even know this was happening until I found it. Is that robed and cloaked men have been seen not coming in or out, but wandering around Mystery Road. Like the entrance of Paradise Road to Mystery Road, but also only at night. Which would see exactly what I saw on Clinton Road.

Cristina: They have to live there. They live there. It's a town of cults.

Jack: It sounds like a cult right off the bat.

Cristina: There's a cult lives inside the woods.

Jack: Yeah, checks out. Reminds me of. What was that movie? The movie. Just like that. Whatever. Some movie about them people living in the woods. Hate enough I mean, there's probably crap ton of societies like that too. Just f*** society.

Cristina: We just gotta come over here. That's crazy.

Jack: Weird. But that also explains them being not friendly. Because it's like, you don't belong here. You're in the wrong part of the woods, kid.

Cristina: That guy that you saw, he wasn't like. It wasn't like he was unfriendly. He didn't even like seem to know you existed or did he respond to you?

Jack: Did not acknowledge that we were even present. Didn't look in our direction, no nothing. He kept moving like we weren't there.

Cristina: I mean, that could be seen as unfriendly to other people. Like, it could be that they see something, some guy, and the guy does.

Jack: You know, ignores their existence.

Cristina: Yeah. And then they're like, oh, he's unfriendly.

Jack: It could totally be.

Cristina: It could totally be something like that.

Jack: Some of the reports are that they're just asking for directions and the people completely ignore them. But then this, this has a very, very reminiscent thing to it. What if they literally can't see you? What if they literally have no idea you're there and that's why they're ignoring you?

Cristina: What is that? Would that mean they come from a different time? The houses are 1800s.

Jack: There's something weird.

Cristina: There's something weird happening there.

Jack: Weird. Weird.

Cristina: This has to do with time travel. I don't know what is happening, but.

Jack: If it's time travel, they can still see you. They're just coming from a different time. You go in and you're somewhere else.

Cristina: But like a time bubble, you're seeing into the past.

Jack: Why can you walk where they are? You shouldn't be able to. You would just cross through. Every time bubble is like that. You just cross through. You're on the other side now. Usually they're in weird positions that you'd have to specifically navigate through. But we're talking. You've seen people come out and then you go in that same direction.

Cristina: Nothing happens.

Jack: Nothing happens. Weird.

Cristina: That is weird.

Jack: Now, other reports by people. The roads in the neighborhood. People have gone into paradise. Neighborhood. The roads and homes seem to change positions. I saw the roads change positions. I think our panic didn't allow us to pay attention to the houses. These people have claimed they've seen the same house twice. Driving in a straight line. Identical.

Cristina: Spooky. That's very spooky.

Jack: Yes. That the houses change consistently.

Cristina: The town is haunted. What is happening? It's not a real town or it's a real town. I don't know.

Jack: I don't know. And people have claimed to this site. Can I can definitely speak to this one. People have claimed to have found themselves trapped, driving in circles, unable to find the access road, AKA Mystery Road. Sometimes for several hours. In this small area. Yeah.

Cristina: That is. That is so scary. For some hours.

Jack: Hours. Trying to find the access road. Panicking. Not knowing. And what the f***. It was there the whole time. Maybe it wasn't.

Cristina: Maybe it wasn't. How is the whole place moving? Is it really there? But it looks like it's there. I don't know. And there's people. But are those people really there? They're not even.

Jack: Next point. Nobody who's entered the town has ever seen a person in it. Nobody has ever reported seeing a person after they've gone through Mystery Road into the neighborhood. They've never once seen anyone. Ever. No one has ever seen anybody in paradise.

Cristina: It's a ghost town. It's a ghost town. Maybe. I don't know. No. No. Yes. Maybe. I don't know.

Jack: That's so strange. Nobody has ever seen anyone ever.

Cristina: Never. Never outside of it.

Jack: Just outside of it.

Cristina: And those people don't even see you.

Jack: Those people ignore you like you don't exist.

Cristina: And they're dressed so old fashioned and they sometimes fashion home.

Jack: No. Some people come out in pickups and they'll just ignore you. But they have seen roped people not going in or out. The people they've seen coming out, just normal looking people who are ignoring the out of you. The people hanging around the outside who aren't coming in or out. Robed and cloaked individuals.

Cristina: What is happening? Okay. There was a guy in the pickup though.

Jack: Yeah. They've seen cars come out. People have asked for directions. No response. They'll just ignore you.

Cristina: What?

Jack: They won't even acknowledge that they're there.

Cristina: Just so it's not a ghost town or is it a ghost town? I don't know. Why is it moving around?

Jack: Which I can talk to the roads moving around. I. We did not. We were too young and too panicked after everything. After we lost Mystery Road.

Cristina: Yeah. You didn't even notice if any move. If any homes moved. You would not notice.

Jack: Crap. I can tell you for a fact Mystery Road moved.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Because we saw it on the other side of the town.

Cristina: And even though you don't see people in the town, the lights are off. Like there's no lights. There's street lights. At least.

Jack: We saw no light. I remember that so specifically. The only lights we saw the Entire were coming from the car's headlights. Everything we saw was shined through that. Not a single light. That's also another note. Nobody has ever seen lights or electricity or anything. Nothing. Always dark. Only your car lights shine it. It's almost exactly like Clinton Road. Not one light.

Cristina: I don't know then this might be like that. The castle where people just go to do rituals or whatever.

Jack: Except the houses don't look worn down. Everything is maintained.

Cristina: There's paved roads, but no one's there.

Jack: But nobody has ever seen a single person in the neighborhood.

Cristina: Is it just for show what is happening?

Jack: But that's crazy. Nobody has seen a single person ever. I found that so strange. You've seen people come out, but you've never seen one soul inside.

Cristina: That is very strange. What's happening? Is it. I don't know if it's ghost related or not. Is.

Jack: I don't know either. I just like reading about this and really doing some research on this. The. The visual of Mystery Road just vanishing is so clear to me. Straight line. We do a 180 drive right back where we came from. The road isn't there. We take a right because there's nowhere else to go. The road just kind of. We were on the. There was only woods to one side and the houses to the other side. So you turn around. Now the woods are to your right. And eventually you hit the point where you have to take a right.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And then we're wandering maybe 10 minutes. And nowhere where we came in through do we find Mystery Road. Total opposite side. I would argue it's literally across. Not even in front or to the side of it. It was literally across. If we came in through Paradise Road to the bottom, this road would have in theory been facing Clinton Road. Except we took it and came out back to paradise.

Cristina: Who made this? What is this? It's a maze in the woods. It's huge. It's a huge maze.

Jack: Less than 50,000. It's not even a huge maze. It's tiny. It's just impossible to navigate.

Cristina: Yeah. How does it do what it it's doing? What's the explanation to that?

Jack: It is very complicated. I don't know what the h*** is happening. I have no. Definitely worth. It was worth looking at this because of what the h***.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Now all of that. And it's not even the weirdest part. None of that. None of that is the weirdest part. The fringe category is not the category that comes next called the strangest. So the weirdest part of Paradise Road is None of the above mentioned, but rather the one most striking important coincidence. At the very center of the neighborhood, there's a church. In the center, at the very center of the neighborhood, there's a church.

Cristina: That church is a portal. I don't know what's happening.

Jack: Oh, and the church appears to be at the center. Regardless of how you travel it, of how you travel it or what, shift or whatever, it doesn't matter how anything else changes.

Cristina: Mayhem should go in that church. Did you see it? Do you remember church?

Jack: I do not remember seeing the church. I don't remember paying too much attention to the structures at all. Yeah, we were in a state of panic. We were just trying to scare each other and having fun until the road vanished. And then it was like, oh, f***. And then the car stopped turning on at that moment too. We panicked for a moment, tried to turn it on. The car didn't turn on. Then it finally did after a couple of moments of messing with it. And it's a car that's in perfect condition always. And that's never happened before.

Cristina: Yeah. So what's the description of the church, though?

Jack: The church, it appears to be a late 1800s design. The church has zero windows and zero entrances other than the front entrance. So you cannot see into it, you cannot see lights, you cannot see anything. There's no way to look inside. Triangular roof, boxy shape, and a front pillar with a cross. The end. Yeah, very old school. Nothing else going on.

Cristina: I don't know. This place doesn't sound real. It feels like it's a staged. A staged thing, like, I don't know, it doesn't seem like people really live there. It's just for show.

Jack: So who the h*** is coming out? Why are there people who look like they live there coming out?

Cristina: Hmm?

Jack: Who are these weirdos hanging around the entrance?

Cristina: Well, we don't know if they live there. It doesn't seem like anyone lives there. If they're. They're going there for something, I don't think it's for living there. I don't think anyone lives there.

Jack: Weird, right?

Cristina: It's for sure to hide whatever they're actually doing there. Whatever that's used for, there's something that's being used for.

Jack: Most people have never seen the church, though. Really? Some people have. Most people haven't. People who've been there. The majority of them have never seen it. I'm among the people who've never seen it.

Cristina: Yes, but everyone that has, it's been in the same exact.

Jack: Presumably the people who've been lost there for hours.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Because it's really f****** difficult to get to the center if everything is continuously changing and throwing you back out to the edges.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: If everything is always throwing you to the edges, getting to the center must be so f****** complicated. And like we saw in Google Maps, it's not even that big. A couple of houses, maybe. How the h*** can you find it so difficult to get to the middle?

Cristina: I don't know. That's strange.

Jack: The changing and shifting keeps spitting you out, always to the edge.

Cristina: It doesn't want you to get there.

Jack: They just want you to reach it. And a few people who have have no idea to know what the h***'s inside. It's just a church. An old abandoned church. Except the church, by the accounts of the people who've seen it, is the most kept. Well location in the entire neighborhood. It looks old, but it has the freshest paint job. The land around it is the most clean.

Cristina: So most likely that's the important thing. That's what people are. The people that know, the people that actually travel there. That's where they're going. Going to that church. They're dressed like it. It makes sense. I don't know.

Jack: Yeah. It's the best maintained structure. And its design is the oldest. Simultaneously and additionally. Additionally. Nobody has ever seen the road during the daytime. Mystery Road. Which means nobody has ever driven through Paradise Road. I mean, paradise neighborhood during the daytime. Nobody's ever navigated the town during the day, which means they've only ever seen the church at night.

Cristina: Yeah. Which mean it could be they. Those people could be using it at the daytime when no one's there.

Jack: Nobody can get there.

Cristina: No one can get there.

Jack: The neighborhood is just inaccessible. But then what the h*** happens to Mystery Road? It should be more visible during the day. Mystery Road should be most visible during the day. I don't know.

Cristina: That's weird. It's a lot of witchy stuff. I don't know yet.

Jack: Nobody has ever seen the road during the day. They've only ever seen the road at night, which means they've only ever seen people come out of it at night, which means they've only ever driven at night. And people have only ever been in paradise at night. Nobody has ever driven in paradise during the daytime. Nobody has any idea what that would look like.

Cristina: That's probably where things happen. Is probably during the daytime.

Jack: Weird, man.

Cristina: And like, we're. We. There's no. It's impossible to know, though. Unless we go.

Jack: We gotta go there personally. Go and we would have to go during the day.

Cristina: But then who knows? Maybe it will be missing.

Jack: There will be nothing, we'll see nothing. We'll go there and have wasted our time because there's nothing. Which means we have to go at night. That would be the only way. But honestly, that's the time I would want to go there at least. Yeah, we need a big group of people. Cameras and everything. Record every moment of it. 20 people. We're all going. Caravan of cars.

Cristina: Yes. We gotta go into that church. What's happening in that church? Yeah, people in robes. Obviously the church is being used for something, right?

Jack: Yeah, that. Total. Total connection. Total connection. People in robes. The church being the most maintained upkept place. But the houses are well kept too.

Cristina: There's no lights anywhere. There's no lights anywhere. But there's no lights on the church here.

Jack: There's no lights on the church either. There's no lights anywhere. Zero seeming electricity. Yeah, but again, some of the houses look like they were built in the 90s. Electricity definitely happened. No power lines.

Cristina: I don't know. But I don't think that's a real town. I don't think it's a family generated generations of family living there. I think it's the generations of cult leaders living there.

Jack: You think the whole neighborhood is of cults? Is of one cult. Yeah, but that would mean they live there.

Cristina: I don't. I don't know. I don't think they live there.

Jack: So what the h*** would be the point of building these houses?

Cristina: I don't know.

Jack: Especially if nobody can enter.

Cristina: I don't know. The whole thing is very strange.

Jack: It's really weird.

Cristina: It's really weird. Do they live there? Because like no one's. There's no proof that they do live there.

Jack: There's no proof that anybody has ever been there other than the people driving through.

Cristina: Yeah. We just know that we see cult members all over everywhere else around this spot. Yes, everywhere.

Jack: Everywhere. Even completely off of Paradise Road. That's where I saw it.

Cristina: Clinton Road is covered. The whole woods area is covered. The castle is covered. Like where are they not?

Jack: My bet would be they actually do live there. Whatever cult performs rituals at the castle lives in Paradise. I think paradise is the residential area for the cult, for the people who do whatever in that whole thing. And I would argue that so is the entrance to what's left of the castle. And it's probably in that church.

Cristina: Is this what Silent Hill is based on?

Jack: I don't know. But I bet the entrance to the castles to not even the castle.

Cristina: To the mines, to the mine.

Jack: The secret entrance to the mines is probably in that church. I bet that it's there. If it's not there, it's in a random indescript location. And they are the only ones who know exactly where it is. Probably a manhole cover in the middle of nowhere, covered by leaves. And you gotta like know exactly where it is to even find it.

Cristina: But it's as possible that it's in the town.

Jack: It's as possible that it's right there and that that's why it's the hardest thing to find. People can't even get to the church. Nine times out of ten just wandering lost. People don't even see a church. I never saw a church. There's a s***. We were lost for like 10 minutes. That town is not a 10 minute drive. But we never saw the center of that town. I know we tried to go through the center of the town. I guess we never really noticed that we never got to the center of the town. Now thinking in hindsight, how the h*** were we always on the edge of the town? That's weird. I never thought about that. We were always on the edge of the town and we took turns in every direction but we were always at the edge of the town. Even driving in, we would just come out to the other edge. I guess. It just obviously such a small town. You don't question it. You're just like, oh yeah, obviously I just got to the other side already. But I never saw a church. And I would have sworn to you I went through the center of the town.

Cristina: I wonder. Like there must be a secret path to get there then.

Jack: Like a combination of roads.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And that all the other roads essentially just kind of fling you around it so you don't ever mm. Get there.

Cristina: Yeah. Like if you try to not get to the center, I bet you're more likely to find the center or something.

Jack: There's probably exactly one turn you would take that would then take you to a series of other ones. And you got to take exactly one of those turns because they would spit you out. And then again you have to take specifically one other turn. So just a series of only this one, only that one. And they would take you there. Which means people have found it by total accident.

Cristina: Yes. Which is has to be the case. Yeah.

Jack: And then the structure of the houses have been intentionally built to be identical to one another to be extra confusing so that you don't know where you are at any given Moment because you're not familiar with the town.

Cristina: That's true. Like you could be looking. People think they're seeing that same house again. But it could just be that whoever made that town made it really identical. Yeah.

Jack: It's meant to confuse you as you're going through it.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: So, man, did I just pass and it's the same number. Maybe not. Maybe it's literally just. I mean, it's literally the same number, but it's not the same house. It was just meant to look that way to f*** with your head.

Cristina: Yes. Okay. That makes way more sense. It's not a ghost town. It's not. It's. There's a reason. It's an actual maze.

Jack: It's an actual maze. And if that's the case, in the center is either the entrance to the mines, the real entrance to the mines. Which means the people from this town can actually sneak into anyone's house through the underground tunnels. All the other five towns are at the mercy of this one neighborhood. Or it's not that. And this is a literal maze designed as a channeling location. And that church is as we would call the entrance.

Cristina: It could be both. Like, it's so weird. It's so weird that I can imagine that it's both.

Jack: Could totally be. It could totally. Like the top floor has the, quote, entrance to coming into the church. And the. Somewhere, you know, you go down a couple of stairs, a spiral staircase or some nonsense. And you get to the entrance to the mines.

Cristina: Yes. He's like, why were they hanging out that church? It's. It's because that's. They know about that. The mines. I think they know about the mines. I don't think it was about the church at all.

Jack: It's probably the people who've controlled the mines this entire time. Which means they would have. It's not just the neighborhood. It's the entire network of tunnels underneath and not just the entire net. Who knows how much other crap exists underground. We've had 70 years to continue excavating and building homes underground and building other things on top of the fact that we know about the one that is underneath where the castle was particularly large. Entire chambers. Rooms bigger than the neighborhood itself. The entire grounds underneath the castle are bigger than the neighborhood itself. So you could fit everybody who lives in the neighborhood. Assuming this is the case, you could have 20 times the amount of people that could live in the neighborhood living underground.

Cristina: Very strange. Very strange. What is this cult doing? Whoa.

Jack: Unless they're not even living underground. There's Way more complicated crap happening down there. We do have Clinton Road being the most supernatural place on planet Earth. There's nothing more supernatural.

Cristina: Paradise is more supernatural. And it's such a secret that we wouldn't even know.

Jack: We wouldn't even know. No stories, no nothing. Can't even find it.

Cristina: Yeah. What's happening? How does Mystery Road. Mystery Road, not a road. I don't know.

Jack: Mystery Road doesn't exist. Paradise has no people.

Cristina: But they're all connected. It's all connected.

Jack: It's all one thing somehow.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: I couldn't tell you how. There's not enough information. But it's all one thing somehow.

Cristina: I wish we could learn something about this cult. There's no name on it. No guesses.

Jack: Nope. People have no idea. The closest they got was referring to them as Druids.

Cristina: Druids.

Jack: And then changing that name to satanic cults.

Cristina: Okay. And the kkk.

Jack: And the kkk. All of that. Yeah. That's which. None of the above. The closest would be the Druids.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: If anything, Druids is what we'll call them because of how weird this is. The KKK doesn't have powers, bro.

Cristina: The h*** out of here.

Jack: Unless. The original purpose of the KKK was in order to create stones. Which would make sense of the sacrifices.

Cristina: Well, now we gotta go look into the kkk, I guess. I don't know. See the history.

Jack: That's all I got. That's all I managed to find about the town. I will call it.

Cristina: It's the town.

Jack: Neighborhood Town is why I was calling it Neighborhood Town. It totally checks out.

Cristina: Right?

Jack: The neighborhood town called Paradise.

Cristina: It's a mystery itself. It's a mystery. A mystery road leads to a mysterious town.

Jack: And the mysterious town is a maze in itself that nobody has ever been seen inside. Ever. Nobody has ever seen somebody in there at least seen it and reported it?

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: If they have, they never talked about it. Which tells us way more information. You saw it and never talked about it. Where are you then? Did you see somebody and then never made it out?

Cristina: Yes. That would be the other option.

Jack: That'll be the other option. Maybe you have seen people, which we.

Cristina: Know many people disappear.

Jack: Many people disappear. Many hundreds.

Cristina: Is this part of what's going on with that?

Jack: It's 100%. It's possible that every single person that went missing along Clinton Road actually went there. It's absolutely possible that's the case. Every single person that went missing found this road and never came out.

Cristina: They saw something they weren't supposed to.

Jack: See or someone, I guess don't find it during the daytime, buddy. That seems to be the case. If you see somebody there, you're. That could be the case.

Cristina: That could be. They don't do anything outside. They don't do anything.

Jack: I saw. Dude, just ignore me. Just ignore all of us.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Didn't react, didn't respond. No, nothing. We just weren't there to him.

Cristina: And he was hunting. Which fits. If they're all just living in.

Jack: Because of the deer.

Cristina: Yeah. That just goes with the whole. They're living there. They just live there.

Jack: Self sustained.

Cristina: Yep.

Jack: Interesting. But that's all I got. That's all I got. That's all it is. Weird. Strange. Oddest place ever. Definitely fits the character of every weird other that's going on there. And definitely seems to be at least related to the center of what's happening.

Cristina: Yes. These entrances, they're all. They all have this whatever mystery thing going on. This mazes and puzzles and something patterns. All of it just very similar looking.

Jack: All three instances. The mansion, the labyrinth and the town.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: All the complicated maze that could throw you anywhere and are all impossible to navigate and all have the entrance at the center.

Cristina: Yeah. If you have a far away. They look completely different but you zoom in, it's the same thing.

Jack: And on Google Maps we can clearly see a circular formation. We can see the very little bit.

Cristina: Of roof tips of the roots or something.

Jack: Yeah. Through the trees, it's very little. And then the big one in the.

Cristina: Middle, which is probably the church.

Jack: It's probably a church. Weird.

Cristina: Weird.

Jack: Anyways, anybody who has any kind of information related to this, please either the.

Cristina: Mystery Road or Paradise Road.

Jack: Mystery Road. Paradise Road or Paradise, the neighborhood town. If you have any information on any of this, please feel free to contact us and tell us about it.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: If you live there and all of this is bullshit and the Internet is making it up. Yes, reach out. Tell us about your neighborhood. Yeah, tell us about your neighborhood. We're curious and yeah, you could do that on our socials. That's at just convopad. On Twitter, on Instagram, on Facebook, on TikTok.

Cristina: Remember to subscribe, rate and review the show.

Jack: Yes. Word of mouth is a really overpowered thing and if you want. If maybe you know people who are into this and can inform us, tell that person to listen.

Cristina: Yes. And hopefully they'll hear us asking them to contact us. And they'll contact us. Who knows? Yes, contact us, please.

Jack: Yes, tell us.

Cristina: This has been the Rambling podcast. Take nothing personal and thanks for listening. Bye. S.A. good morning. Good morning. The podcast is hosted by Christina Collazo and Jack Thomas, produced by Lynn Taylor and published by great dots.info art by 0lupo and logo by Seth McAllister, with social media managed by Amber Black.

Rambling 282: Clinton Road: The Menu Part 3: Significance

Is there any starting point for researching this Forest surrounding Clinton Road? What could be the most pressing amongst the sea of oddities? What can be found on the other end? The duo unpack the last of the reports from Clinton Road. This time, the clearly important bits are discussed. 

+Episode Details

Topics Discussed:

  • Druid Activity
  • Disappearances
  • Satanic Panic
  • UFO Sightings
  • Mysterious Lights
  • Floating Orbs
  • Cross Castle
  • Mutilated Animals
  • Haunted Mines
  • Gnome Sightings
  • Invisible Barriers
  • Creepy Carvings

Official Website - https://greythoughts.info/podcast

X - https://twitter.com/JustConvoPod

Facebook - https://facebook.com/justconvopod

Instagram - https://instagram.com/justconvopod


+Transcript

Cristina: Warning. This program contains strong themes meant for a mature audience. Discretion is advised.

Jack: Going live in 5, 4.

Cristina: What does live mean?

Jack: Welcome to the Rambling Podcast. I'm your host, Jack.

Cristina: I'm your host, Christina.

Jack: And this is the show where you and I ground humanity's most absurd and baffling ideals. Yeah, no, that's legit, bruh. But okay, so recap, recap. Last time on Dragon Ball Z, for anybody who wasn't paying attention, Clinton Road for the hundredth billionth time, many years later, except now we have a lot of information to relook at it with. And so we've broken up the excess of things we have discovered. And we have separated into three categories, of which we discussed two already. Ones are echoes. Any long term listener understands an echo is a type of ghost that doesn't interact with anything. It's just literally a repeating something that isn't there.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Then phantoms on the shadow episode, probably shadow people, which is probably shadow people or other things that are just aware and they're physically and are aware of you and try to interact or can react. Those are not echoes. They're not just there not being responsive. They are there explicitly being responsive.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And then today. Well, to clarify, in the echoes episode, we had some little details that the point of that was we were basically going down all the major events that happened in Clinton Road, breaking them up into these three categories. And with the echoes episode, it was to completely remove what we know isn't doing anything. But the point of discussing that to begin with was maybe something sticks out and is relevant. Which we have found a couple of things that we should look into. Because of the nature of those things, particularly intense distortions, directions, we could be looking at, whether it be a different realm or into the future to see how we can possibly determine something's happening. These kinds of details you've acquired. The phantoms episode was a sin. Well, the shadow episode is the same idea where we're trying to unpack phantoms. Phantoms are what we call the creatures that do interact, but we normally call ghosts. We've created a distinction. The phantoms are the type of ghosts that can interact, and they're usually just things in the shadow realm that you're interacting with.

Cristina: Yes. And they're spooky.

Jack: Yeah. A lot of them can be definitely.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Some of them are trolls. A pickup truck was definitely a troll.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Today's episode is the last part of our branch as we go through the Clinton Road menu.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: And this is a collection of all the things That I know factually as we go down. Each one of these points is important. Without a doubt.

Cristina: It's all important.

Jack: It's all important. These are the things that all the. The other two sections were composed of things that, I don't know, could or could not be.

Cristina: But these relate to what we're trying to figure out.

Jack: This has ghosts, this has phantoms, this has tech. It's again, everything relevant that was factually relevant.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: That wasn't in the other two lists. The other two list was just composed of those respective subjects, but that was unclear.

Cristina: May or may not be important.

Jack: Yeah, these are definitely important. And have things that should be on those two lists if they weren't obvious.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Every thing here matters now. Okay. The problem is that there was no way to order this more efficiently because of how important everything on this list is. So it's not like I can escalate gradually.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: So I'm just gonna go for the number one thing here because it's the easiest for us to just kind of get into the groove and start to unpack this. But it is quite commonly stated and believed that human creatures. Human people. Not creatures. People. People. Humans. Humans.

Cristina: Humans. Okay.

Jack: Also wander these woods around Clinton Road. We know this.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: I personally saw an individual doing something weird. Doing something weird. There was a town, like, adrift in this location where nothing else can get to. There are people now. Where it gets weird is the dialogue people have used to describe the people they have seen.

Cristina: These aren't normal people or they're not. They're. It's obvious that they're doing something sketchy.

Jack: There you go. Yeah. It's more about what they're doing, not who they are.

Cristina: Yeah. Okay.

Jack: So the stories are of cloaked figures, which we know. I personally saw a dude. And they're said to have been seen or glimpsed performing rituals of all sorts in the woods. And the word most commonly used to describe these individuals by people who are informed scholars who search for what people are talking about. Oh, it's spooky and blah, blah, blah. No, it's probably just this. The this they use is Druids. They believe they are Druid activity. Let's simplify. Druid people who work with occult things. Let's specify occult things in the context we're very familiar with. We're in a high energy displacement space time, problematic area. And people have seen cloaked individuals performing things that they would describe as magic if it wasn't technology.

Cristina: Yes. Crazy.

Jack: There was probably a necromancer there at some Point.

Cristina: Okay. Okay.

Jack: That would fit what a druid is.

Cristina: Yeah. A necromancer.

Jack: There could have been.

Cristina: Which I guess, like St. Patrick. He would probably be described as a druid.

Jack: He would be described as a druid. Correct.

Cristina: Yes. Because what we know is they're in hoods. They usually have some kind of staff.

Jack: With a stone either in the staff or in a necklace.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: There's definitely a dialogue they're using with intention. And again, the fact that they use this word to describe it kind of reframes immediately the guy I saw instantaneously. You're not a KKK member, dude. You black? You're black. Black. So you're some other s***. But now let's take a step back. We use the word druid. Druid in this context means a magical individual. All the magical individuals we've known. I'm about to ask you to say something I haven't said myself yet. So put your thinking cap on. Where are they from? This is not a difficult question. Where are the people we have talked about doing magic from? Not which country. Which region?

Cristina: Which region?

Jack: Easy.

Cristina: I don't know. It's not a country.

Jack: Not a country.

Cristina: Not a country. The sea people. No. What region?

Jack: Where is Iran? Where is the Middle East? The Middle East.

Cristina: They're doing magic.

Jack: Oh, God. Okay, I got a. Let me grab your hand and walk you through it. The Middle east is the only mention we've seen of every single necromancer, every single magic activity has ever happened that began with somebody wearing a hood. It happened in the Middle East. We have no outside source that ever had a necromancer, ever had somebody who fit these descriptions anywhere else. It's always been in the Middle East.

Cristina: What about Sansa? He's in the North Pole. And the guy, Merlin? He's not in the Middle East.

Jack: They're not wearing hoods. I used these words so specifically. Guys doing magic wearing hoods is literally what I just said. Those individuals have only. We've only found mentions of them in the Middle East. Now another question I have not explicitly said, but is the obvious answer to this. They are in the Middle East. What is their skin color? Not a hard question.

Cristina: They're brown.

Jack: Darker than brown. Oh, they're very bronze.

Cristina: Is this important?

Jack: The guy in the woods that's wearing a hood is dark. I don't. How are you not connecting these dots, bro? Okay, I'm gonna stop trying to get you guessing.

Cristina: Are they saying the same thing, though, in their description?

Jack: No, I'm telling you what I personally Saw.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: They're saying there's druids in the woods and he's wearing. They're wearing, you know, they got cloaks and they're doing the things that, you know, necromancers fit. And then I saw a dude wearing a robe and it so happened to be a D skinned dude.

Cristina: Yes, dude.

Jack: The dots are connecting. But no, no worries. I'm gonna just connect all the dots and I'm gonna just flat out explain that.

Cristina: Like, did they describe it like that too?

Jack: No, I would have said that. But the point is I'm making the connection that there's a dude with robe.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: In the place where they're saying there's people with robes doing things and we see him with a machete. Then we get to a animal sacrifice. Like, all the parts are just lining up.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: No explanation required, but I will continue to just explain it instead of asking. But the point being that's definitely fitting the suit. Dark skinned dude in a robe definitely did something sketchy with an animal.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And he's walking away from it. That's what I see. But that just fits them. Talking about rituals being performed in the woods by druids.

Cristina: That's crazy.

Jack: That's weird. Now I wouldn't have put those things. I was thinking KKK. That's. At the entire time, since 15 years ago when it happened, I've only thought, yeah, it's okay. But it doesn't make sense to have that thought because this guy is dark also.

Cristina: What does it do you have to do with a kkk?

Jack: Yeah, like, well, the area is drowning with them. That's a very, very KKK present area. But why would he be a member? Unless he's a troll who's using it to, like, disappear into. But he was visibly just walking around. You could see his arms. You can see, you know, and it's like, okay, it has a KKK vibe, but I can see your face. So it's not a hood that's literally covering your face. The assumption was, you know, he has it lifted and, like resting on his head. But maybe it's just a literal hood, not a mask. And maybe you're in a robe, not a cloak.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: And maybe you were performing a ritual.

Cristina: Just out there like that. That's kind of crazy.

Jack: Literally what they say happens.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Rituals in the woods.

Cristina: Yeah, but you weren't in the woods. You're so.

Jack: You wouldn't have to literally be in the woods. They're not in a building would be the point of staying in the woods. It's outdoors. They're outdoors. Performing sketchy things would be the sort of general idea here.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: They're not hidden doing it because otherwise how would people see them? I'm sure that in the woods has meant some people have seen them on the street as well, just, like, doing weird things.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: And so you move around them. At least that's what we saw. And the thing is, all of us saw that. All of us saw the animal, and all of us saw the dude. It was unclear what the dude was holding. Two of us thought machete, two of us thought shotgun. But by the time we get to the animal, there's kind of not really a debate here because it's sliced open. Two of us are right, two of us are wrong.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But weird. Anyways, the other weird part about that moment, that quote druid, unquote, is that moment of the machete or the shotgun, because what. How could we not tell? But let's back up and talk about what we know about Clinton Road and what we know about the shadow realm. Clinton Road has high distortions. That guy might have not even been present. That guy could have been in the shadow realm, and we were seeing the distortions of the shadow realm. That would explain both happening.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: It's a distorted image of somebody on the other side.

Cristina: Yes, but did the deer look like it was from.

Jack: Well, no, the deer was cleared on this side.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: And maybe he used whatever he got from the deer.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: And we were seeing him phase in the middle. The veil was thinnest right after he took it.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Because he needed the veil to thin for him to cross. And then we're seeing him slowly distorting more and more as it goes through his system and he crosses over to the other side. Weird.

Cristina: Okay, but he didn't, like, disappear in front of you guys. Like, it wasn't, like, that type of spookiness, was it?

Jack: So the debate that we had following this moment, because we're driving and then he's in the back mirror, we assumed it just got so dark that there's, like, a threshold that you just instantly get sucked into the dark.

Cristina: Yeah. Okay. So, like, it appeared like he disappeared.

Jack: It appeared like he tried to make.

Cristina: It make sense, but it could just.

Jack: Be that, again, we were in a car, he was on foot. Like, the dark could have just swallowed him instantly. Beyond some point, he did get smaller and smaller and suddenly gone, which is possible. It's totally possible. We were also spooked by the fact that we just saw some random dude out here in the woods with the machete or shocker. So, yeah, we're maybe not focused. It's already, you know, the sits, the place and the situations already getting to us a little.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: But we'll leave that there. Who knows? The next one is this. This is one we're definitely gonna have to unpack in detail one day.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: There are giant lists. Giant lists of people who've gone into these words and never been seen before. Like, again, they're just gone.

Cristina: They're just gone.

Jack: Gone. People missing in these woods all the time. All the time. They disappear. These woods are not big enough for. So for there to be lists and nobody to find them, just. It's not big enough. You'd find them. You'd find them. You'd send crazy search parties and find them.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Nobody's been found. They're just gone. Everybody. All of them.

Cristina: How long is the list at the moment?

Jack: About 300 people.

Cristina: Oh, my gosh.

Jack: Okay, spread out, spread out. It's not like 300 people last year.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Like, through all the time, we've recorded about 300 people wandered, never been seen.

Cristina: Again for like 200 years. For a hundred.

Jack: For the past maybe like 30 years. That's a lot.

Cristina: Oh, okay. 330 years. Whoa.

Jack: Yeah, that's a lot. There's people wandering and vanishing and wandering and vanishing.

Cristina: You know, if there's, like, groups of.

Jack: People that disappeared as well, like entire groups have vanished. Yes.

Cristina: What is that?

Jack: Well, there's an answer for what that is based on the fact that they vanish in an area that shouldn't be so easy to lose so many people. Where are they going?

Cristina: Someone's eating them up.

Jack: I guess they're going to slip into the other side. Yeah. Yeah, they're. They're falling through some of these thin places into different times or falling into different spaces.

Cristina: Oh, you think different times.

Jack: They could just go through one and. I mean, they're still the one that overlooks the lake and is always looking into a time in which there are people at the la.

Cristina: Yeah. And there's. There's a spot like the. The tall grass in there as well.

Jack: There could be. Where everything is intersecting. Yeah. Once you're in your track, that'd be crazy. Maybe that's what they are. Maybe there is a situation like that going on.

Cristina: Those are crazy.

Jack: I would argue the tall grass is kind of based on some concept like that that somebody, you know once read about or something, and, oh, how interesting. And it's like. That's kind of real, man. It's kind of Kicking around reality a little bit crazy.

Cristina: But it could also be that they're being killed off because, like, who knows what's in there? All these stories of monsters.

Jack: Like, not even.

Cristina: They gotta eat.

Jack: Not even stories of monsters. Let's go to how people try to explain this. Because that's the next important thing.

Cristina: How they try.

Jack: How they try to explain it. This takes us back to the castle. They believe that Luciferians inhabit the castle and that their cults operate in that area, leaving behind strange symbols. This is literally written, as I'm saying it. Symbols and sacrifices of unfamiliar animals. Now, how would we identify a Luciferian? Well, you're just guessing who they are. A Luciferian who's performing a ritual would be indistinguishable from a Druid, wouldn't it? Yes, except you call them a cult. You're saying an individual is a Druid and a group is a Luciferian. Why couldn't there be a group of Druids?

Cristina: Yes. And they're sacrificing Shadow Realm creatures.

Jack: Shadow Realm creatures. Now we're getting to something.

Cristina: Yeah, weird.

Jack: There are symbols which are transmutations. You can convince me of anything else. You could not convince me. S*** else is happening. Strange symbols, huh? That's too familiar.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And then unfamiliar creatures being sacrificed. There is some sort of a portal somewhere around here that distorted everything. Those creatures are coming in and they're bringing them in. Or something happened in the future, in the past. This is the hotspot and they're keeping it safe. Hence the sacrifices. It's not sacrifices. They're killing whatever comes through that shouldn't be here.

Cristina: But then how, if they're keeping it safe, like they're still mad people going missing.

Jack: That's why they need to be there, keeping it safe. If they're keeping it safe, what would happen if they weren't?

Cristina: Oh, okay, so you're saying it'd be so much worse.

Jack: It'd be so much worse. At least they can keep it contained in the woods of Clinton Road. You see? Now, if they're the ones causing it, then we are talking about an area, and this is gonna. I don't know how the f*** I didn't think about this last week when we were talking about the Phantoms in the Shadow episode. But I literally mentioned that the Vikings had created a forest through continuous sacrifices in order to stay in contact, be able to traverse and communicate with things from the other side. How the f*** is this any different than that?

Cristina: No, it's the same thing. They're probably talking to A co. Uncle God.

Jack: Hella people go missing. That sounds kind of accurate to what the Viking were doing.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Creatures from who knows where. People hear voices when they're there. People slip in and out of places they're unfamiliar with. Everything jumbles around.

Cristina: The same story, just a different location.

Jack: Yes. It's a modern day portal location. It's a sacred forest to cross into the shadow Realm in Clinton Road.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: The argument is whatever the h*** happened once we crossed Paradise Road into the town of paradise, we weren't on this side anymore. That's why it was jumbled. But then we didn't consume anything to get there.

Cristina: No.

Jack: So we must have been on this side and it was just because again, if the steps that we're talking about are as we're talking about them, then the Druid I did see needed the thing to cross. We didn't consume anything. So we were watching a really hot spot on this side of that side. Yeah. We were just watching that side essentially. Without being there.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Like the thinnest part of the veil.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Without crossing. And so it behaves almost like we're over there.

Cristina: Yeah. But you need something to actually be there.

Jack: So then this brings up another question. Is it possible to thin the veil so much? It's almost the same place.

Cristina: Like you don't need anything.

Jack: Like you don't need anything. If that's what's happening in paradise, then paradise is an actual. And listen to me what I'm about to say, this makes so much sense. If paradise is just the thinning of the veil, then you can coexist. When people from the other side. We go back to the origin of Halloween and Christmas and all these things when they will go to these graveyards. It's where the veil is very, very, very, very thin. And they can just people who are dead and. But also be careful. There's creatures there who might harm you. There is a town in Norway where there are people from the shadow realm, people from Elfim and people from earthrealm living together. In no moment that we ever come across a line that said anybody crossed anything to get there, we just know they're there together. There's two locations like that. That's just one of them. Is it possible that these locations are extremely focused so that you don't need anything and people don't have to cross, but you can still see people from the other side. Additionally, in situations like the judge sleeping in somewhere, these spots, it would just be one. He never went in.

Cristina: He never went in. No. That makes it make so much sense.

Jack: He abused the knowledge of being in this twisted place repeatedly and got familiar because the veil is so thin. It's not the same place.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: He didn't slip anywhere. And he could see them like they're standing in front of him even if they're not.

Cristina: Yeah. And his sister probably took something though, once they. She made the deal with the other girl or whatever.

Jack: The other girl actually. They both actually crossed. But they had to learn how to do it.

Cristina: Yeah. But I don't think he did.

Jack: I don't think he did. I think there's a. I think there are places within veils where you can just interact and it's the same place the them into us. And we haven't thought about this before, but it checks out. Because the way that fear thins the veil.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Means you could get it if you can just keep applying the same logic and never have adrenochrome. You never bring adrenochrome into the equation. You just keep applying more and more and more and more and more and more fear.

Cristina: That's why you were there. But it was different.

Jack: But it was different. But there are conflicts to this theory. What Twin towers fall. There's a crazy amount of fear. New York didn't suddenly shift.

Cristina: It's not a hot spot.

Jack: It would have created a hotspot. If the fear is what's doing it. Or are we talking that you need to create technologies to thin the veil to this point?

Cristina: Possibly.

Jack: So from the other side creatures can come to this. I would fear alone. But we need some catalyst.

Cristina: Yeah. Because we see all this time distortion thing going on. That's not happening.

Jack: That's not happening over there.

Cristina: No.

Jack: Another theory for the same idea of the thinning veil is what if it's literally the same thing to get across. How do I put it? We need fear. They can see us. What if there's something on that side they have to do and then we see them give a point. What's the fear equivalent?

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: If it's one to one, what's over there that we need over here to suddenly start seeing them? Ooh, we haven't thought about that.

Cristina: I don't know. That's tricky. I don't know.

Jack: But makes sense.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: If that's the case and is the kids in the playground who aren't there, they could get scared and then that, you know, thins that area a little more because foreign and exciting and. Oh my God. Well, we're kind of spooked out. There's people camping out there looking for things too, from the other side.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: It could be just as scared.

Cristina: So you think it works both ways? The fear itself.

Jack: Both sides are horrified because it's a fun place to go be scared.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And so both sides are going and kind of scaring each other, not knowing. Oh, my God. There's something over there. People. People. It's just people.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: There are things. There's dangerous things. There's wolves and there's bears and there's snakes and poisonous and birds and crap and weird chimeras and. But also on the other side too. Just whatever things they got. But also they see weird things. But it's just us and we see weird things and it's just them.

Cristina: That's. Agree. That makes sense.

Jack: Makes so much sense.

Cristina: Yeah. It's just fear works the same over there as it does over here. Okay.

Jack: And if it's not literally fear, we can just put the value of X and call it fear. Anyways, they have something.

Cristina: We got something that works the same.

Jack: Interesting. Useful, right? Yes, interesting. Everything on this list is useful. It's important. And in like crazy thought reframing.

Cristina: Wow. Yeah.

Jack: So there's definitely something weird going on. I don't know if they're causing it or trying to contain it. Unclear. That's what we need to be looking at that castle for.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: But it brings up the theory that there is something going on. And then the Druid himself walking through having gotten some ambrosia, fades away because he crossed over. Meaning you do need the thing to cross over. But then we connect the fact that we didn't consume anything when we were in paradise and it seemed that we.

Cristina: Did crossover some event happening is important. The time distortion thing, because we would have these still anywhere. Like, why is this the spot?

Jack: No, 100%. 100%. I do agree. I think this is an overlap of many things.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: I think things happened here either on the other side in the future or in the past. And that created just enough disturbances had to happen so long ago or so far in the future or somewhere we just can't find that then makes us not know what this is. And it's just a unique place that we can't be like, oh, no. It's unique because of that. We don't have that answer. So we're just like, oh, it's weird and spooky and that gets people excited to go there. And then that sort of perpetuates the fuel of fear and crap.

Cristina: But something had to start.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: Not sure where, when, but something yeah.

Jack: The distortion seems to be unrelated to the spooky s***, even if it kind of resulted in it.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: It's just this came first and it allowed for other s*** to happen and now this s*** happens as a result of the curiosity from that s***. But it's still a super hot spot because it's where the thing, whatever happened.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: So it's kind of like all of the things overlapping in one spot, making it this kind of complicated amalgamation of all the things we would define as ghosts and horror and mysterious. Now this brings us to the next part, which is again why we have to start looking in this area more seriously. Because the next sentence, I must say it as they describe it, but then we know really what it means, which is there are quite a hefty number of reports that identify flying objects that could only be described by the individuals as aliens.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: UFOs everywhere. We know who the UFO are.

Cristina: The sea people.

Jack: The sea people.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: And this is a hot spot that all this ghost activity and then we have UFOs. No, they're observing and probably landing places and checking out. Because they're probably the ones with s***.

Cristina: Yeah. They probably end up doing something there that causes whatever to happen to happen.

Jack: Exactly. You tell me UFOs. I know who we're talking about. You tell me UFOs over weird time lapse hot spots within places and shadow realm creatures. I'm like, bro, yeah. There's only one group of people that's doing this.

Cristina: Yes. And they're a group of scientists. Anyway, like obviously they're doing something weird, even if it's to stop themselves from doing the weird thing. Like some kind of Star Trek thing.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: They end up doing it anyways.

Jack: But then this tells us something else interesting. They do come out because these sightings are recent. The spot is recent. This is all recent.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: This is the first mention we have modern day of something that is probably the sea people. Now. It would just be UFO and people being crazy if it wasn't where the f*** it is.

Cristina: Yeah. But is the same thing. Does that happen in the ranch that we were talking about a while ago?

Jack: Yes. So, yes. UFOs drowning in there.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Weird, right? I mean, that was the whole thing we're talking about. It's paranormal, but it really means just ghosts and aliens and it's like.

Cristina: Yeah, yes, yes, yes.

Jack: There's a pattern here where you have a lot of quote, ghost unquote activity. You have aliens and it's like neither one of these are what you guys think they are.

Cristina: And before those stories, you had fairy story.

Jack: Yeah. In the same places.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Oh, interesting. In both places. Kind of painting a lovely. It's becoming too easy to find what we're looking for.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: The. In the collective of what they don't know is all one thing. Paints us the picture we're looking for. Kind of crazy, right?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Now deeper into the rabbit hole. We got creatures that are unfamiliar, creatures that are likely familiar things that are probably the scientists. We know rituals. We got thinning veils. We got the clear shadow realm overlap. We got weird things everywhere.

Cristina: Everywhere. Yeah.

Jack: And then people say they see what they could only describe as sentient lights or orbs moving through the woods, responding to people and avoiding people. Usually the size of a softball.

Cristina: That sounds familiar.

Jack: I'm thinking fairies. I'm thinking this s*** has everything still to this moment.

Cristina: Till this moment.

Jack: I think all of it is in there. I think these are fairies and we're seeing what they would look like without coming through.

Cristina: Mmm.

Jack: We're seeing the shadow realm equivalent of fairies. Never thought about it. How would they look like if they didn't come fully, but they were still on their side watching us, if we thinned that veil.

Cristina: Interesting, because I. I don't know if we've talked about fairies like that.

Jack: Never cross our minds. It would apply the same. If it's all the same.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: It would just be a different direction, but the same idea.

Cristina: Yeah. Yeah. They just see them moving around.

Jack: That's like an impossible to catch. Impossible. Just super fast. And seem to, like, not be phased by creatures. And just totally like the overpowered thing that doesn't care about anything is that orb. And it's like, weird. I can't confirm it's a fairy. I cannot.

Cristina: No, but.

Jack: But, like, what else could we be talking about? Yeah, we'll pin that as fairy for now.

Cristina: Mm. Could be a shadow realm creature.

Jack: Yeah, it could be. But the fact that it's a light kind of argue because the shadow realm. They named the shadow realm because of its dark characteristics.

Cristina: Yes. Yeah.

Jack: The fact that this is bright, a bright glowing orb, it's like, oh, okay. That's some whole other thing you're talking about.

Cristina: Okay. You know, yeah, that makes sense.

Jack: But yeah, that. That one caught my attention because I'm like, I've never thought about this, but I could only explain this as the opposite of the shadow realm, which I would say is all fame and, like, how would they look like if these guys look like shadows but they're not?

Cristina: What would the other guys look like?

Jack: They would look like light even if they're not. And definitely the most important thing here is Cross Castle, which is specifically the ruins of the castle that it's said to be haunted by spirits and consistently visited by alien presence. Which is like, bro, it's always being like, aliens are always a UFO's always hanging around. It's like, brother, come on, you just tell me.

Cristina: The Druids are doing rituals.

Jack: That's where Luciferians are at.

Cristina: Yeah, it's.

Jack: It's obviously there. Yeah. You're telling me aliens are watching Luciferians in a place where they're performing rituals and when weird creatures come out of. Come on, bro, that is.

Cristina: That's too much.

Jack: That's too much happening all in one place. None of this is coincidence. The fact that people are talking about it like it's random. Separate is stupid to me.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Like you guys really think all this separate is happening simultaneously? Just maybe it's all one thing. Whoa. Yeah. As I go through it, it's just gonna get dumber because it's gonna be so obvious. You don't even need any of the information we've uncovered to really understand what's happening.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: At this point, like, bro, obviously, obviously. But yeah. So Cross Castle, that's gonna be the main focal point. And I think as we unpack all of the details that matter to all these right now we're just skimming through, and then we're gonna truly deep dive into all these things. We're. We're in here for the long.

Cristina: Starting at Cross Castle, right?

Jack: No, we're ending at Cross Castle. That is the last point we will get to.

Cristina: All right.

Jack: Because I'm sure when we get to that, all the other points are going to become null and void. So I want to leave that for last so that we just don't run out of s***.

Cristina: All right.

Jack: But Cross Castle will be the very last visit out of all the things we deem are important here. Now, revisiting the mysterious animals that seem to be unknown, there are a couple of things that ring familiar with the descriptions of these animals. Now, oftentimes are considered exotic because people are just unfamiliar with the animals that there are. But there are two descriptions that ring very powerfully. There is an old research paper of a journalist who was digging through these things, John McLean. And John, in looking at these things, says a nearby zoo had animals escape. According to their mention, the zoos.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: But it seems that there was no forced entry upon police speculation. So it must have been a clean job. It's a zoo. There's no such thing as a clean job. So they gave the animals to somebody. That's weird. One fact random. Other note from a different. These are not journalists, these are people, okay, describing what they've seen, claim that the animals they witnessed are hybrid animals. Chimeras, literally.

Cristina: We do know about a scientist that was working on chimeras in real life.

Jack: Though, about many sciences.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Now where this becomes relevant is when we look at what was taken from the zoo. Lions went missing.

Cristina: Sea people's favorite animal.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Okay, yeah. Were there horses?

Jack: Horses went missing, huh? You got anything else? You're on point.

Cristina: Those are the only two main ones I can think of.

Jack: Horses went missing, lions went missing, eagles went missing.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: You see where we're going? It's just visually on point.

Cristina: We got the flying horse. The flying horse.

Jack: Eagle, flying lion. Oh, exactly. What the we're supposed to be seeing is what went missing from the. And no broken entry. How'd you take eagles? How'd you take horses? How do you take lions? No broken entry. Come on, you serious? That's a breeding ground. Those animals were donated, by the way.

Cristina: They're donated.

Jack: They were donated to the zoo. Oh, zoo's in on something, isn't it? Oh, you see, it's weird lines. It's like we don't even need to dig deep to understand some of these pictures. You tell me exactly what's missing over there is what people saw. Hybrid over here. What are the odds?

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Just a coincidence, you know, just like they think isn't this is unrelated to that. It's just all random coincidence. It just so happened to be that only horses, lions and eagles are stolen and you see hybrid lion, horse, eagles over there. It's fine, it's unrelated.

Cristina: Unrelated. Okay, you're going.

Jack: You jump into speculation, man. What are the odds that exactly what's taken over there shows up over there? Fused.

Cristina: Were there any other animals taken?

Jack: No. Okay, horses, lions and eagles specifically. Yeah, no broken entry. The two explanations are escaped and were stolen in neither case could have happened. No, neither could have happened. You guys had to open and let them be taken. That's the only way. Yeah, crazy random details, not saying any of this means anything for anybody who thought this was always just coincidence after seeing everything put together. But whatever, you know, total coincidences. Then we get still on the topic of animals, what people describe as. And we know exactly what these are. Phantom animals, ghostly sightings of long dead pets, including dogs, cats, appearing alone in these areas. Very interesting detail here that these ghost creatures are pets. And that they're in this area because it would be the place where you would see the things from the other side. And if the veil is incredibly thin, then if you live in the area, your dog looking for you follows your scent like a wetchudge would and lands in Clinton Road tracking you. And then you see your long lost dog who's been dead for a while.

Cristina: Do they say like if they behave like an echo or.

Jack: No, these are just fully. Yeah, they feel like these are actually phantoms interacting and like. Oh my God, is that my dog? Oh my God. And then disappears.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: And it's like. Okay.

Cristina: This makes sense to be a spot where they'd.

Jack: Exactly. Where they would pop up. This fits the graveyard.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: That very well. People will go there because it's just a beacon for dead s***. And then you can go see your loved ones there.

Cristina: Yeah, yeah.

Jack: This could be the same thing. It's just a beacon for dead s***. And anybody who lives close maybe comes here to scare themselves once in a while, but your s*** is already in there somewhere. And once in a while you might just cross paths and see it. So I think that's very interesting. Weirdly and. Yeah. Yeah. It's weirdly enough. A lot of the visitors, like, this is my first time here. Like I saw my dog in there. It's like. Yeah, it's a beacon for deadship. Yeah, it's the hot spot. One of the. The other point that this makes me think about if the Vikings had one and we have one. Every major populated wooded area where people go missing is probably some s*** like this.

Cristina: Yeah, you gotta look into every.

Jack: There's an easy one. Japan has a forest of death where people allegedly go and commit suicide.

Cristina: Yes. There's gotta be weird stories coming out of there. If anyone just goes in there, they go in for the stories, but they see other s***. They gotta.

Jack: Yeah, I am sure now with the perspective this all we ever get more information. And then it enlightens other situations. And now we know this is probably the same as the Vikings place, which means we have a second one of these. But if there's two, then there are more.

Cristina: So much more. Yes, yes, yes.

Jack: There has to be a lot. And if we're talking Japan has the forest of death and Jesus went to Japan.

Cristina: That has been chosen for a reason. Okay.

Jack: F****** force is old, bro. Ours isn't. That forest is.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: That's been spooky to people for millennia.

Cristina: Yes. There's got to be some kind of energy or something that is involved.

Jack: Something. There is More important, Jesus himself thought that.

Cristina: Mm

Jack: Now we move to the next part of this. Here we're talking about undeniable s*** that we don't have to theorize about. Specifically with the next thing I'm about to say. People have found items in the woods that they believe look like cursed artifacts and relics. They use the term magic. That oftentimes when somebody tries to reach one of this, they've seen these artifacts begin to glow.

Cristina: Oh.

Jack: Or behave weird. Oh, it looks like a rock. And when I try to reach for the symbols on it light up or something. And it's like, maybe you're just looking at technology.

Cristina: Fairy technology, Shadow Room technology, Elysian technology.

Jack: Why would it look like our stuff unless it was made by earthlings. Okay, which would be the.

Cristina: But you said cursed.

Jack: They're describing it as cursed.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: People who don't know who wandered through the woods. All of this is just people who don't know. Every description we've given, there's people who don't know and they say cursed. They see a piece of stone with symbols on it, they reach for it and it glows. And they're like, it's cursed. That's an uninformed assessment of a piece of technology you're looking at.

Cristina: Okay. Okay.

Jack: Of course, anything sufficiently advanced enough would look like magic. That makes sense. Oh, I reached for it lit up. It's cursed. It's woods with Luciferians. There seem to be demons in here. And then I find a rock with a diabolical looking symbol. I reach for and it lit up. It's cursed. Checks the narrative. It checks out with the narrative they're painting. Yes, but that means that there's so much activity here that there have been pieces of technology left, left, right. That means that some Alicians maybe have been killed in these woods running experiments. And like a wet judge breaks out.

Cristina: And like, off them, something horrible is happening there. So currently, not just in the future, is there something gonna happen, but there's.

Jack: Something currently happening, energy wise, we don't know. But we do know, activity wise, never stopped.

Cristina: Never stop.

Jack: We don't know if there's a giant machine being run, a machine that was run, or a machine that's gonna be run and where it's at. Exactly. We don't know any of that, but we do know activity wise, since the moment it began, it has not stopped.

Cristina: It's not gonna stop. And it's not gonna stop. Looks like it's not gonna stop.

Jack: Interesting.

Cristina: Yes. And I wonder if we'll see these items Again, yes.

Jack: So I actually have mad stars next to that now. Because we've found images of technology from the past. I want to see what the f*** there. Somebody had to be brave enough and pick one up and be like. Or took a photo on their phone or something. You know, show it to me. So I'm gonna dig and find something. I want to see what it looks like. And then. Is it in a book? Can we find a hieroglyph with an image of it? Yeah, you know, anything. Just give me one image and I will cross reference everything under the sun until I find something.

Cristina: We're gonna find something.

Jack: We have to. They. It's. It's more than one person saying this happened.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: There are cursed artifacts that people have talked about. It's like, okay, okay, now we're on to something. And that's unquestionably something obvious.

Cristina: Yeah. But when I think of like, if they're gonna call something cursed, does that mean something happened to the people? You know?

Jack: Like, no, they don't know. They're. If they're reporting it.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Nothing happened to them. They just don't know what they were looking at.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Like, if they're telling you about it, they made it out.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Otherwise they wouldn't worry about the thing. They'd be like, people died in the wood, you know?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: They're like, no, I saw a weird thing. It was probably cursed.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Like, okay, then nothing happened. They're just using s***** language because they don't know better.

Cristina: Alright.

Jack: They don't know no better.

Cristina: You gotta check that out though.

Jack: So coming back to the idea of animal rituals, the. This is so related to me. Pretty often people find mutilated animals. That's just like a literal report. Mutilated animals usually on the curbside or roadside. Yeah. And the, the exact descriptions go like, they find animals in the woods. They're speculated to be result of the occult rituals. Oftentimes opened from the chest down to the belly button. You know, kind of that area.

Cristina: That's what you think you saw?

Jack: That's literally what I saw. Literally what I saw.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Literally what I saw. Yep. The deer cut straight from its neck all the way to its private parts and then just opened. That's it.

Cristina: And it looked like it just happened.

Jack: It looked like it just happened. I didn't think about this next part until this very moment. And now I'm disturbed because I think about this next part until this very moment. I've told you a thousand times about that deer.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: I never once saw blood on him or the deer. That's f****** weird. I never thought about that for the last 15 years. Never crossed my mind. There was no blood. Not a bit. I told you. I even f****** walked and was looking at it up close. I was amazed by what the f*** I was looking at. The guy was in a white robe.

Cristina: Yeah. No blood.

Jack: No blood did cross my mind when nobody questioned anything.

Cristina: The deer. No blood.

Jack: Deer, no blood.

Cristina: Mmm.

Jack: Weird.

Cristina: Weird, yes.

Jack: Now I have less idea what I saw. That's weird. Now I have less idea what I saw. I don't remember any blood. I don't know why. I don't know why the f*** doesn't cross my mind.

Cristina: So right now the whole situation's weird.

Jack: Yeah, it is f****** strange as h***. This strange one spectral fog. So a thick, unnatural fog that rolls in suddenly, obscuring vision and often causing travelers to lose their way. Now people say this fog is so confusing, it feels like the Roger movie. Is this fog literally what it looks like? When the veil is thinning more, you're seeing the other side, so it looks unclear.

Cristina: Yes. When you saw. But you didn't see fog?

Jack: I didn't see fog, no. But also we crossed something.

Cristina: Yeah, I don't know.

Jack: I don't know. Something to look at. I got everything here. Something to look at. All of it somehow relevant.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: We've never heard this before. First mention of a fog that rolls in right before things start to jumble up.

Cristina: But you saw things jumbling up and no fog.

Jack: No fog. I saw a jumbled up mess and I never saw fog.

Cristina: Strange. I don't know.

Jack: Okay, let me do some f****** rapid fire. Running out of time. G******. Okay, okay. This is important as f*** because I didn't even know this existed. I only found. This is one of the. It's towards the bottom of this list because it's one of the last things I found. Just looking through this and I'm like, what the f***? Nobody's ever mentioned this. There are mines out there. Mine, mine. There's old mine tunnels said to be haunted by spirits of miners who died in them. People have been seen coming in and out of the mines, bruh.

Cristina: People might be going in and out of the mines.

Jack: I don't think that's Rose, bro. Think about this real hard.

Cristina: We know people are experimenting.

Jack: There are mines going way out of sight. Let's take another moment. Eloi built his lab in a cave. When you go into those caves, you see the pipes going in random directions.

Cristina: Yeah. This could be a lab.

Jack: This could be a f****** Lab.

Cristina: I think it's a lamp.

Jack: The castle isn't in the center. The mines are. Of course, if we were to ever find a huge energy displacement, something, something. I think it's more likely to be in the mines. To be in the mines?

Cristina: Yeah, I think so.

Jack: It's also weird that that's the least mentioned thing.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: There's been mines there this whole time.

Cristina: Well, who's gonna be exploring the mind?

Jack: It's not about exploring them. Why don't people talk about them? That's all. Just mention it more often. I've heard so many of these other things, I've never once heard of the mines.

Cristina: Most people disappear at the mines.

Jack: Fair enough.

Cristina: Who knows?

Jack: Like, fair enough. Fair enough. That's definitely, like. I do believe if we. If we're looking for something, it's the castle or the mines, one or the other. And at this point, knowing the past, it's probably the mines, not the castle. Castle is probably home or, you know, the top of the mountain. The place you get to before you walk to the other place. Yeah.

Cristina: The mines has to do with the sea people, but the castle has to do with the Shadow realm, the necromancers.

Jack: So we're talking just a hot spot for, like, literally, not just for activity of other things, but, like, there. Different groups are coming here to use this.

Cristina: Mm. We got fairies. We don't have any fairy trees.

Jack: We don't have fairy trees, but I'm about to blow your mind. Now that you mentioned fairies. One of the most consistent sightings of things here are gnomes. Weird, weird gnomes.

Cristina: Have we spoken about gnomes somewhere else?

Jack: Yes, we've briefly addressed gnomes. Gnomes, yes.

Cristina: Weird. Okay.

Jack: Oh, yes. And gnomes are fairies. Very type of fairy.

Cristina: Okay. Are they hanging out by the mines or they're just random.

Jack: No. And just in the woods, along with orbs, along with all the weird creatures, just random spottings of these things. Everything is out here. All of it.

Cristina: I bet there's fairy trees. But of course, no one could find the fairy trees.

Jack: If you did, how would you tell? Yeah, how would you tell? I bet there is a fairy tree. I bet if we look hard enough, we could find a fairy fort.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: I mean, dude, there's the mine and there's the castle. Come on, bro. Everybody has a base here. Yeah, it's not big enough to lose a s*** ton of people, but it's big enough to have a couple of bases in here.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: You know, it's starting to paint a real vivid picture. I think we're looking at a spot that's kind of like the city up in Norway. I think we're looking at a spot that's kind of like the city in India. These places where, you know, amalgamations of people get together and they can kind of coexist and maybe. Neutral zone. It's a neutral zone. You are beef. Whatever. You know, we got the un. I might hate you as a country, and you hate me as a country, and we're gonna go bomb each other later. But at the un, we all shut the up and we're just. Nothing happens here, or everybody here bombs you.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: And so that would be the idea, Right? The space. Neutral territory. We can't do anything to each other here or the other groups collectively. F*** you up.

Cristina: All right.

Jack: Neutral territory.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And so a fairy can gladly be here, knowing the Elysian can walk right by him. Be like, I'll get you when we get out of here. You know? Because if you do violate. Well, how many other groups are here that are just gonna. Well, we're not gonna let you violate our safe spot. Even if we don't like them, too. We're gonna you up, because now we can't let you do that because then you might do it to us too. And, like. Okay, so neutral zone where everything weird happens.

Cristina: I think so. That sounds like that.

Jack: Because we've seen too many different things now.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Too many conflicting interests coexisting. There must just be enough of something to go around. What is it?

Cristina: What's going on? They're all interested.

Jack: Mm. Now, this next one is definitely gonna be the hardest one to unpack, but it's also like, the clear. Yeah. People have probably even touched one of these buildings. People come across invisible barriers. And there's one group of people who we know are really good at making invisible s***.

Cristina: Just making invisible things.

Jack: The Alicians. The people who make entire mountains vanish. I guess the people who can be in plain sight and their civilization not be in there.

Cristina: Okay. Yes, we know they're in there.

Jack: They're in there.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But, yeah, people have literally, like, come across, like, what the f***? I can't go through?

Cristina: And it's, like, kind of scary.

Jack: Yeah. You're just probably touching a building or some s***. You don't even. You can't see it, so you're like.

Cristina: Which matches the whole. Like, they're going up and down. You're seeing these weird ways that they're walking. Like. Yeah, it could be.

Jack: Well, no, they wouldn't be. You wouldn't see them at all. They would be invisible in the building.

Cristina: Oh, yeah.

Jack: Everything in there would be invisible.

Cristina: So that's the shadow realm, the other one, I guess.

Jack: No, that's the elation. Cloaking technology.

Cristina: No, not that. The people that you do see walking up and down.

Jack: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Those people must be in the shadow realm. You must be watching movement within the shadow room, for sure. But these people are definitely not like, this is the fact that they. They literally set invisible barriers.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: It's like, oh, man, that's so specific, bro. I don't even know what to do with that information. That means we just gotta walk a ton of Clinton Road, broad daylight, and just. Just such things run until we hit something that doesn't. That isn't there, I guess.

Cristina: I don't know.

Jack: I don't know how we would find it, but, like, people have come across it.

Cristina: Yeah, that's. That's tough.

Jack: Tough. But this also suggests something different. Elysians can find their building without uncloaking it. They must have something to show them where it is.

Cristina: Yeah, I guess. They have the technology.

Jack: Other obvious thing that is here are, you know, time slips. Little thin places, people. That's the primary thing we think is dominating this place. A s*** ton of thin places everywhere. And creates the main attraction, which is probably what everybody else is there. Abusing ways in and out of different places.

Cristina: Mmm.

Jack: And that's in abundance. People are like, I f****** went through here. I felt like it was a five minutes. And then when I got to the other side of this tree, it was f****** night.

Cristina: Okay. Now, there's a lot of stories like that.

Jack: That s*** is the most abundant kind of story. That is literally the most common occurrence. There is seeing something weird that can't be explained. The truck and people losing time. Those three events. Those are the most consistent things that happen. People see a truck a lot. That guy's out there desperate, okay. He's desperate. Seeing shadows and crap super common. And then people losing crap tons of time or moving in unbelievably quick. They're going. They began. Two minutes later, they're on the other side.

Cristina: That's strange.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: It's 10 miles. How'd you do it?

Cristina: Whoa.

Jack: Going back to odd symbols, there have been symbols found on stones. There have been symbols found on structures. There have been symbol found on odd relics and artifacts. The weirdest one is symbols found on trees that seem to always be in pairs.

Cristina: What do you mean?

Jack: What people describe always seeing two. I want to find images of this. I couldn't.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But people say fine. Always finding to. I had to say, because I know you're gonna ask, are the photos but two trees next to each other with exactly the same symbol on both trees?

Cristina: What could that mean?

Jack: What could that mean? Kind of sounds like a lazy portal.

Cristina: To me, I guess.

Jack: Right. Because it's still the arch. You still have the two walls to it.

Cristina: If you.

Jack: I don't know how. If the top is requirement. But like, I don't know. I'm just thinking, like, what could I picture possibly me. So, yeah, that's. That's what we get. Those are the important things to look at. This is the thing you need to.

Cristina: Look at that there's so much. Yeah, yeah. We gotta look at everything.

Jack: There isn't one thing I mentioned on.

Cristina: This part that we don't need to look at.

Jack: So this is why I called this what's significant.

Cristina: It's all.

Jack: It's all significant. I'm telling you. We're here for the long haul. This is a lot of crap to dig into.

Cristina: Yeah. Whoa.

Jack: There's a lot. Yeah. It's ridiculous. So, yeah, this is what we have, man. There's a crap ton. We, we got fairies, we got thin places. We got creatures from the Shadow Realm, we got Elysians, we got fairies, we got science experiments. We got people desperately trying to get back. People somehow just casually crossing to the other side. We have places with extremely thin veils that make it indistinguishable. We have that as an explanation to how people in the past managed to get in and out without ever actually going in. We have. Have too much information going on. Everything. Everything is here. All of it happens here.

Cristina: You have a lot of missing people.

Jack: We have a lot of. We have a lot of missing people. But that's a clear one, man. Because they're either cultivating a way to get through or there are stones being made. Maybe s***** ones. Could be just enough to do casual things. Yeah, you need something huge. You don't need a crap ton of people. Yes. Need a casual stone. Take two or three people.

Cristina: We have a deer with no blood.

Jack: A deer with no blood. We got chimeras. Obvious chimeras. A zoo that's somehow tied to it.

Cristina: Yeah. Weird.

Jack: So, yeah, that's what we got for you guys. So, you know, if you guys have any input, any ideas, any in. Anything interesting, any information additional. I think I didn't mention that. You guys think is relevant and falls into here, please. We're kind of just. Yeah. Connect Dots connect.

Cristina: Yeah. There's so much connecting we got to do. We tried our best but like anything.

Jack: We didn't see feel free. Call us stupid just give us the answer but what you got to do just tell us what the answer is.

Cristina: Yeah help us.

Jack: And you could do all that by going to our socials. You can contact us at just convopod on X on TikTok on Facebook and not on YouTube because we're not there anymore.

Cristina: And remember to subscribe ran review the show.

Jack: Yes and word of mouth is one of the most important things in the world. Let everybody know that we have discovered so many things and that maybe they want to know about it.

Cristina: This has been the Rambling podcast. Take nothing personal and thanks for listening. Bye.

Jack: Sam.

Cristina: The podcast is hosted by Christina Collazo and Jack Thomas, produced by Lynn Taylor and published by great dots.info art by Zero Lupo and logo by Seth McCallister with social media managed by Amber Black.

Rambling 198: Dangerous Imaginary Friend

Why did Jackie imagine Hank? Who is Hank? Is this something Jackie and her family should be concerned about? The duo opens the case of Hank, the Imaginary Friend, and the investigations gets only stranger as the data I reviewed. With a theory that feels right!

  • Episode Details

Topics Discussed:

  • Jackie, the 9 Year Old
  • Hank the British Imaginary Friend
  • Is Hank Real?
  • Hanks Increasingly Odd Behavior
  • Making Threats
  • Abandoned Car
  • Missing Person’s Report
  • Questionable Heart Attack
  • Mental Asylum
  • The Forest
  • Speculations

Our Links:

Official Website - https://greythoughts.info/podcast

Twitter - https://twitter.com/JustConvoPod

Facebook - https://facebook.com/justconvopod

Instagram - https://instagram.com/justconvopod


+Transcript

Cristina: Warning. This program contains strong themes meant for a mature audience. Discretion is advised.

Jack: Going live in 5, 4.

Cristina: What does live mean?

Jack: Welcome to the Rambling Podcast. I'm your host, Jack.

Cristina: And I'm your host, Christina.

Jack: And this is the show where we ground humanity's most absurdity, baffling ideas.

Cristina: Wow.

Jack: Yeah, that pause was monumental. So let's recap. Halloween's coming up, so we've been doing some weird. We've been.

Cristina: Yeah, some weird stories.

Jack: We've been digging. We've been digging deep. Deep in the. In the. In the digs.

Cristina: In the digs.

Jack: We. We've been digging deep in the digs.

Cristina: What's that supposed to mean?

Jack: We've been digging.

Cristina: We've been digging.

Jack: We've been digging holes. Yes, like the movie holes.

Cristina: Like the movie holes, except this one has the demons in it.

Jack: It built a character.

Cristina: What, this hole that we found has demons in it?

Jack: Well, we did. Yeah, we did find the hole with demons, but. Okay, so, yeah, there is a hole in some country, Russia or some s***. Like the border of Russia. I don't remember the story of Russian. Something and evil is in the hole. Allegedly. We don't really know.

Cristina: It's the Pepsi Cola.

Jack: Yeah, the Pepsi Cola wormhole. Yes, the Pepsi Cola wormhole is a scary place, but so is the Bio Ventura.

Cristina: The real life resident Evil lab.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Yeah, the Umbrella Corp.

Cristina: Umbrella Corp.

Jack: So, yeah, we. Look, the first story was just looking for some weird thing that happened in real life. The second story that we found was trying to type in exactly the same circumstances that would, in theory, describe the first story. But we just found the flip of it. Right. Originally we were like, what's a real scare? Not scary, but like, what's a real.

Cristina: Weird event that scientists can't explain? Or I guess they might have explained, but we'll never know their explanation.

Jack: Exactly. There wasn't a way to really tell.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But I'm like, okay, what's a real event that has some. Some spooky connotations to it? And then we found the. The. The lab thing, right. It's trying to replicate the whole thing. The whole thing was just. Hey, what's weird? What was it? It was. We. What's some. A scientific thing that has no explanation?

Cristina: Okay. Yes.

Jack: And I was like, okay, but that was by accident. I just. What's something scary we could look up and I found some science related. What was it? No, what's the scary science thing?

Cristina: Something scary that science can explain.

Jack: Yes. Well, I was just looking for something scary and I found Something sciency. I was just looking for something grounded, something that, you know, what's tangible. What do we have evidence for? And so we found the science experiment that was weird. And so then we looked into it or typed in the right. The same combination to try to find something else after we found that story. And instead, what we found was something unexplainable. They happened to be with scientists. Yes, but this one had, like, an alien or ghost vibe to it.

Cristina: Mm. And they weren't doing any research on the thing. I mean, their research was kind of like a normal human research of, like. What's that sound? Let me check it out.

Jack: Yeah, well, there wasn't research. It was more like investigating.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Now we do this, get conclusions, blah, blah, blah. So I'm like, all right, we got to do this again because, you know, now we're by accident, consistent. And it's October. Let's do it. So October. And I got one more. One more chance before Halloween to be spooky.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: And I started digging.

Cristina: Spooky.

Jack: Well, I start digging, and I can't find anything related. It's sort of the same situation again because I type, okay, like, this time, we have a bunch of police reports and stuff. And I'm like, oh, that's. You know, that's kind of cool. That's pretty dope, because they weren't police reports for the first thing. There was just a bunch of people abandon the s***. And then the second one actually had police reports. That's kind of cool.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So I'm like, is there something else that, like, there's actual police reports for that's creepy and unexplainable? And I go digging and digging and digging, and I actually do find something quite interesting. The question is, is it spooky? So this is potentially hit and miss, but we're gonna find out.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Okay, so let's dive into the story of Jackie. Jackie is a little girl.

Cristina: How little? Or I guess how young?

Jack: Very.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: She's from Oklahoma. She's like eight or nine.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: She's from Oklahoma. And Jackie has an imaginary friend.

Cristina: That's, like, the first thing I was thinking.

Jack: I said little girl, and you just thought, imaginary friend.

Cristina: Yeah. Okay, continue.

Jack: It's just. Okay, based on me saying imaginary friend, what do you think is gonna happen?

Cristina: I don't know. Because, like, she talks to the friend, and the friend tells her to. I don't know. It's always like, some kind of, like, evil ghost thing. But we'll see.

Jack: We'll see. Okay, so Jackie's Grandmother Stephanie stated that she often spent time playing with her imaginary friend and her dolls.

Cristina: Okay. Okay.

Jack: Basic little girl s***.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Imaginary friends, dolls checks out.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So when asked to describe her imaginary friend, she claimed it was an older man named Hank.

Cristina: Always. Why is it always some creepy dude? What is with these creepy dudes hanging out with little kids? Imaginary creepy dudes. It's always a dude ghost. I never hear about a woman ghost hanging out with kids.

Jack: I don't know either. But also, pedos are, like, a thing and quite. This is what. This is the kind of s*** that makes you be like, well, it's probably real. Like, it checks out according to, like, the percentage of creeps that are out there. Yeah. So anyways, Jackie would tell her parents about, like, stories of the. The. Of Hank. Hank would tell Jackie stories, and Jackie would excitedly tell her parents stories. So she would tell. He would tell her about, like, how he used to work at a lighthouse.

Cristina: That's cool.

Jack: He used to work on a lighthouse off the coast of England. Jackie's from Oklahoma, so it's interesting that there's this random guy, and so she, you know, he tells her about his life and. Because his imaginary friend. Right. So he tells about his life, his hobbies, just things. Stuff.

Cristina: Nothing weird that he's telling her, or at least not yet.

Jack: No. Yeah, I suppose so. As a little girl playing with her dolls, I find it strange that it's not just weird that he's a grown man. That's weird. But it's weirder that he's a grown man playing with dolls that's already kind.

Cristina: Of like, okay, he's playing with her. Like, she. It's her playing with dolls with him. You're saying, like, they're playing together?

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: With the dolls?

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: Okay. Okay. I didn't know that. Okay.

Jack: That's weird. It's not that she's playing with him and playing with her dolls. She's playing with him and her dolls.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Simultaneously, he's a grown imaginary friend who likes to play with dolls, and he's a dude. An older dude.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Kind of weird. Checks out the whole, you know, I'm grooming your child to do things to it, kind of. But it's imaginary, so what the h*** can anybody do? There's not a problem there. Just a crazy little girl or a normal little girl with imaginary friends.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So one day, Hank approaches Jackie screaming and crying and saying he'd seen something horrible happen. What? Imaginary stuff, you know?

Cristina: Yeah. Okay. Okay.

Jack: So he says he saw somebody fall and get hurt outside Simple.

Cristina: Well, she checks it out.

Jack: Well, she doesn't check it out. She tells her mother and her father and although they didn't believe her, so she, she, they, you know, in order to humor her, they check it out. They go check it out and what they find is an actual kid had broken his leg outside somewhere. Yeah, it was like a block away.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: She probably heard it or something. You know, typical. She was probably because she was playing outside moments before. She wasn't down the block, but maybe she saw something.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And she tells her parents or whatever. M and I think actually she was in her backyard and this happened a block away, but she probably heard it happen. And you know, as an intelligent child, quick fact. Children with high IQs tend to be the ones who have imaginary friends.

Cristina: Really.

Jack: It is their mind processing information highly, like very fast and it has to compose and composite things. And a lot of the time it superimposes imagery that allows them to process. And if the child is thinking at an extremely adult level, they might manifest an adult that can think for them in that instant psychology fact. Anyways, this child must have heard the kid fall and start crying.

Cristina: Okay, so nothing weird yet.

Jack: Nothing weird to come in from the backyard and tell her parents. And then her parents then went to investigate and found the kid. They're aware that her child is highly intelligent. They've been told things to expect of her child and also to not worry about the imaginary friend because of this very circumstance. Highly normal. It is an extremely intelligent child. Okay, so this is kind of expected. And a child with high intellect is also a child with high intuition. You can have very small pieces of information and piece together quite vivid images that are accurate.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Her predictability. Not her predictability, but her ability to predict. Astounding. Because of high intellect, imaginary friend because of high intellect and intuition. Because of high intellect, the kid is essentially psychic. Because of high intellect, she could hear something and piece it together, basically what happened here. So obviously her parents thought nothing of it.

Cristina: Okay. Yeah, I guess there's nothing suspicious there.

Jack: No, nothing at all. Why do you keep saying yet this what you keep saying yet?

Cristina: Cuz something's gonna happen.

Jack: Do you believe something's gonna happen?

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Okay. Anyways, so. So the child's parents were contacted, the situation was dealt with, blah, blah, blah. And again her parents just brushed it off as something expected something normal. And sometime later, Hank began acting strange again, but in a weirder way. You know, he started think of like nurses from Silent Hill. How they kind of like twitchy and, like, real uncomfortable looking.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So, yeah, doing that and like, screeching and like, at random, he would do this. Almost like he was glitching. But this. This is her describing this to her parents. She wouldn't use the word glitching, but, you know, she would try to explain the motions and how he would just start screaming crap. And then he'd just go back to normal.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: And like, it never happened.

Cristina: Like, she tried to get an answer from him and he couldn't explain it.

Jack: Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Like, he would. Like it never happened to him. Like. Oh, I don't. I don't know what you're talking about.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Yeah. Again, imaginary friend. So whatever weird things are gonna happen. But as a result of this, she began to have a lot of night terrors, consistently night after night after night after night after telling her parents about this. So it became really consistent that she would have these. And she had to go into a child therapist. She started seeing a child therapist consistently because of this. It was becoming intrusive. She would not sleep any night. All the nights were interrupted. All the nights, all the nights. All the nights, all the time.

Cristina: Because she was dreaming about or having nightmares about Frank.

Jack: Yeah, just these weird motions. Screaming. Some of the dreams that she described just kind of looked like a horror scene is basically all black and just him there, nothing else. And him, like, twitching in that manner and screaming in that manner with nothing else but him being the focal point.

Cristina: Oh, my gosh. Okay.

Jack: Yeah. It's kind of horrible because it's unclear whether she. She placed herself in the world of the dreams that she was having. Like, she was physically there or she was just watching nothing but him. Like, is she seeing herself third person, or is she seeing first person so all she sees is him? That was unclear, but it was described as essentially a dark void with nothing but his presence. How she saw him. That made her scared.

Cristina: Yeah. Were they trying to now, like, get her to stop having an imaginary friend? Is that even possible?

Jack: Yes. They tried medication in small doses because she was a child and that wasn't really working. But they immediately stopped that because of. It was kind of numbing her out, but she would still have all the problems. So you'd like drugging your child and not even solving the problem, which is a huge issue I have with giving children medication. Anyways. Your kid has adhd. Maybe that's just your child has a lot of energy and maybe. Don't drug your child.

Cristina: Don't punish your child for energy.

Jack: Don't punish your child for Being a child.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Oh, my child can't focus. Well, they're f****** kid, you know. But yeah. So consistently her parents would chalk it off to emotional stress. The therapist explained that this stuff is expected. You know, her mind has to process even the darker things of life, and as she gets older, she's going to understand those things more. But maybe not consciously, maybe this is all happening subconsciously and manifesting as these twisted images that she's getting from Hank.

Cristina: Okay, so everything's normal so far.

Jack: It's normal. It's very on brand for a intelligent child. Minus the now. This is. According to the doctors, it's totally fine. But what's weird for Jackie particularly is that she's consistently trying to explain. He's always more aggressive than he was before. So the twitching is more vicious, the screaming is more vicious, and he's more confrontational. Consistent. Like he's more aggressive in his words, have a stronger tone and he sounds like he's talking down to her more frequently. That kind of stuff.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: But. But again, totally normal, according to the doctors, really.

Cristina: What.

Jack: What would be abnormal about an imaginary friend being weird? Unless you're thinking something horrible, which you are.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: It wouldn't be strange.

Cristina: It's gotta still be weird for the parents. Even if they're being told it's normal, it's still weird.

Jack: Why would it be weird? As opposed to, oh, our kid.

Cristina: But their kids having nightmares and it's. She's telling you her imaginary friends going wild again.

Jack: Just because you're expecting something odd to happen is that you're in the state of mind. Think about how often a little kid leaves his bed and goes and jumps in bed with their parents. And you're like, oh, how cute. But that kid had a nightmare. Some kids do that every night. That's not weird. You're just expecting something weird to happen. So you see it weird. But it's extremely. It's the most common thing.

Cristina: Nightmares, though, if she's saying that she's.

Jack: Experiencing this, well, it's an imaginary friend, which is also incredibly common. It's like a kid saying there's a monster under the bed every night. Again, you're expecting something weird, so you're seeing it as something weird. But what part of this have you never heard before? All of it is extremely common. Kids see crazy s***, though. There's monster, daddy, there's a monster under my bed. And that. That every night has to come and be like, there's not a monster under the bed. No, I saw it. Okay, I'll look under. Or it's in the closet. I'll in the closet. This is normal. This is all normal. You're expecting spooky, so you're thinking about it as weird. Why? Well, it's so weird that she. It's totally normal. There's actually nothing strange about this, about imaginary friends.

Cristina: That glitch out. That's totally normal.

Jack: You gotta understand that none of what's being described is weird in the context that a child's mind is making it up. So I'm using the word glitching out.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: I could say spasming. Regardless of which word I use, the descriptions of the child are childlike and what. The events that are happening are extremely normal, as explained by therapists who experience it all the time.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Professionals who experience this all the time are saying, this is normal. This is absolutely normal.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Which means it's so common.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: That they're not like, your child's f***** up.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Do you see?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: You're expecting something weird, so you're seeing it weird because you're looking for it. But the people who are trained to spot how normal it is are like, well, this on paper is some s*** I've seen a thousand times.

Cristina: Okay. I have not seen this a thousand times, but okay.

Jack: Yeah. But you're expecting to see something weird, so you're already looking for it. You're like, which part of this is the one that I'm supposed to pay attention to? Don't worry about it.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: The doctor said it's fine. You just follow the expert.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Not the little girl. You focus in too hard on little girl's opinions. Little girl. Why are you putting trust in her? Even her parents are like, f*** this child. She's just a f****** kid.

Cristina: That's awful. I don't know.

Jack: But, like, in most cases, what you gonna do? Humor your child's crazy s***? And then they turn out to be a real nutcase because you made them think this is absolute. Absolutely. Okay. Instead of going out of it. That is where you see you'd messed up your child in this instant. Because you're like, well, this is so weird. My child. Oh, my God. But no, it's not. It's totally normal. It's absolutely normal. It's absolutely normal. Until 8-16-20. I mean, 2001.

Cristina: Okay?

Jack: In August 16, 2001, it stopped being normal.

Cristina: How so?

Jack: Well, Jackie calls Stephanie, which is her grandma, claiming Hank said he would hurt her parents.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Now it stopped being normal. Now, if she were to tell the doctor that the doctor would Be like, now we've got a problem. Up until that point, it was totally normal. You were looking for it. Now you got some s*** that is like, is this kid gonna f****** hurt her parents?

Cristina: Is she?

Jack: Well, I don't know. What do you think? So, okay, Stephanie asked to speak to Jackie's parents, and they were fine, obviously, because this f****** kid's crazy, okay? And also, it's a f****** nine year old. Like, what the h*** are you gonna do to hurt your parents if they're paying attention, you gotta catch them while they're sleeping or something if you're crazy like that.

Cristina: Is that what she does? No. Continue the story. Yes. Okay. Okay. So they talked. She talks to the parents. Parents are fine.

Jack: Yes, they're. The parents are perfectly fine. And, you know, nothing. Nothing out of the ordinary. It's just like your kids spazzing out of the nightmares of guy weariness or whatever. She just needs to escape the situation. So Stephanie has to have Jackie for the night, you know, to ease the parents worry. To ease Jackie's worries. And interestingly enough, Jackie said that anytime she was with her grandma, Hank wasn't there. Hank tends to be at home. At her. At Jackie's home, not at her grandma's house.

Cristina: Okay. Because if this was a ghost story, he's just haunting the house she's living in.

Jack: Yeah, yeah. If this is a ghost story, it's haunting the house is living in. And so Jackie goes and stays with her granny at her granny's house, you know?

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: So the next morning, it gets weirder.

Cristina: I don't know what happens.

Jack: The next morning, the police knock on Stephanie's door.

Cristina: Okay, about the parents.

Jack: Right, about the parents. So, okay, this is what happens. The parents car is found parked on the highway, but the parents aren't there. And they did a search to find who the car belongs to, but the parents were also not home. But the car was there. Didn't look like anything weird happened. It kind of looked like they pulled.

Cristina: Up, they just abandoned their car, parked.

Jack: And just abandoned the car. Now the car's abandoned, but they find out that, you know, it belongs to the parents or whatever.

Cristina: How long was it abandoned for? Like, when did someone realize that it was, like, suspicious, or the next morning. Next morning. Oh, okay. And it took them that quickly to, like, look it up of, okay, the parents live there. And then the grandpa, like, did they contact a bunch of people?

Jack: Probably not the next morning. That was just a couple of hours. The girl just stayed overnight.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Which means the car was just parked on the Highway.

Cristina: And then they went to the grandma to look for the parents.

Jack: Well, not really. They probably went to the parent looking for the parents at the parents house. They probably ran the plates and they're like, somebody just parked out here.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Chances are that car had a ticket.

Cristina: On it and stolen or something.

Jack: That was probably the initial realization. But the car was just parked there. There was no broken windows or anything. And so they didn't find the parents at the place. But you know, looking for contacts and whatever, they end up finding the grandma. And they're like, okay, yeah, weird, but whatever. And the car is just there. So at this point, the grandma. Stephanie and Jackie have not heard from the parents since the previous night. So they don't actually know why they would park and abandon the car. They just know that they parked and abandoned the car. But they did in fact confirm, yes, that is the car.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Very important. Which was the goal of the police being like, does this belong to whoever?

Cristina: Yeah. And they found out. Yes.

Jack: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So the car gets. Because it's on the highway, and the car. They're told that the car's been towed. The car. This is important for you to like, get in contact with these people and tell them. And they. They're like, yeah, whatever.

Cristina: They like, yeah, whatever. Yeah.

Jack: Like, they're gonna go and she's gonna contact them. Eventually she gets in contact with them. She's gonna be like, hey, your car.

Cristina: How long does it take for people to feel like, okay, maybe they're missing or something?

Jack: Or that's like a day, like a week.

Cristina: But she's not worried.

Jack: I mean, the car was just found parked on the highway, so she's very worried. It doesn't. Nothing told us she's worried. But I Like, we can reasonably assume you find a parked car on the highway unless she's dead on the inside. She's probably like, well, that's strange. I should probably be worried. It'd be crazy if the cops knock on the door in the morning and they're like, hey, this car was probably here overnight, but. And also, we didn't find the people in the car. Does this car belong to somebody who you know? Yeah, it's a car of my daughter. Okay. Yeah, it was abandoned.

Cristina: Nothing suspicious about the car.

Jack: It was abandoned in the highway. And besides that, Stephanie is like, oh, that's cool. And then the cops leave, and then she never again gives it a second thought. She's just like, what is. Stupid parents my granddaughter has that they would just park on the highway and walk away don't they know that's what parkings are made for? Not the emergency lane. You know, she's over here cooking, like, stupid child of mine. I taught them how to park. Why are they stopping on the highway? No, of course she's like, what the.

Cristina: F*** do you know which one is her child?

Jack: Her child is the girl.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: The. The mother.

Cristina: Mother. So she tries to contact her.

Jack: The mother of the daughter. Cc. Yeah, she tries to contact her. That does not work out. This is 2001. Presumably one of them had a cell phone. Probably not. It was probably house phone. And see, here's the problem. This is also why it's, like, less concerning, because there's no. There's not like, any. You can't immediately get in contact with anybody.

Cristina: Yeah. So it's going to be a while for her to be like, this is really dangerous. Or not dangerous, suspicious.

Jack: Like something horrible. No, it's already. Again, there's a car parked on the emergency lane in the highway, and there's nobody in the car. And we cannot seem to find the people whose car it is at home. Have you seen them? Nah, nah, it's already suspicious.

Cristina: Do they know, like, maybe the car. There was something wrong with the car, like it couldn't drive.

Jack: They don't. Which is actually an assumption that was made. Perhaps the cut. That's why they went to the house to find out.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Perhaps there was something wrong with the car that prevented the car from moving. They didn't have the car keys, so there was no way to just turn on the car and drive it away. The car was towed.

Cristina: Interesting.

Jack: Yes. But I'm assuming after the car was towed is when it's like, okay, we gotta contact the people whose car it is to then get them to come and get the car. But, oh, we can't find them.

Cristina: We can't find them.

Jack: So we need to do everything in our power to find them. Because we need our money.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: We gonna get gangster on these mofos. They better give us our guap.

Cristina: That's all they care about.

Jack: Care about. So they show up to the house, and the pope was like, there's nobody here. They probably knock the door down, get, boom, search the house for the money or whatever. Or whatever cops do, you know?

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And then they dip. Find the money, and they're like, they're hiding. They don't want to pay. We're gonna find them by any means necessary.

Cristina: So they go to the grandma for the money.

Jack: So they go to the grandma, they beat that door down. Too. And they strong armed grandma. It's like, we know you're hiding them. We know. She's like, I've not seen them. You're lying. They tortured her for weeks trying to find out. You will tell us. They waterboarded her every night.

Cristina: But, like, when they dropped her off, the grandma didn't think anything weird was going on. Like, the parents seemed perfectly fine.

Jack: Yeah, yeah, the parents didn't seem. I mean, none of these reports tell me that, but like, the fact that nothing was mentioned. Mm, probably it was just like a normal day.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: Like their behavior wasn't strange enough that she would say, oh, they were being weird beforehand.

Cristina: Yeah, there's something going on. But okay, yeah, like, clearly I thought.

Jack: Something would happen because they were being so strange. No, that never happened. They were perfectly fine. Fine. But it got weird because although they didn't get in contact with them the first couple of hours, questions start to rise after the first day and they're still not around. And then the second day and they're still not around.

Cristina: Has the grandma told anyone about what the daughter had said?

Jack: No, she. The grandma actually completely forgot that the daughter even said this. It's totally escaped her that the reason this little girl was staying at her house in the first place is because she. Because you gotta understand, this girl has been complaining about this for a long time. So anything and everything that she says relative to Hank, it just goes tuned out to some degree.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Because, you know, they've dealt with it for a while.

Cristina: Yeah. And how's the girl behaving during this time while her parents are missing?

Jack: She doesn't know that her parents are missing.

Cristina: Oh, she doesn't.

Jack: She's not told a single thing. Why would you just freak this girl out? Especially if you're just gonna fight. What if you just find her parents and they're perfectly fine? They were just out there f****** somewhere. They went to a hotel. The f***? And you're gonna be like, oh, my God, your parents are missing? No, just, you know, she's protecting a little girl. The girl doesn't know anything, but. So it was totally forgotten. But eventually, after the second day, without hearing from the parents, the police determine, you know, this is. This is. Okay, now this is problematic. This is a missing person's case at this point.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: Yeah. So they're like, okay, we definitely need to organize a search party. We know where the car was. Let's start sending people out. It's, you know, if they have been kidnapped or if they're hurt, we Gotta get to them before like it's a wrap. So they send the search party and you know, as things go, they were searching the forest around the highway that the car was found.

Cristina: There's a forest around the highway.

Jack: Well, most highways cut through a forest.

Cristina: Oh that's. That sucks. But like the search sucks because it's gonna be hard to find them if they are in there.

Jack: I mean anytime somebody is missing around the highway, there's. You gotta search the forest next to the highway. That's never not been the case.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And like I think the point of a highway is that it cuts through the forest so that you can get to the next location. So I think every highway, unless you live in California through a forest. It's through a forest. Yeah. There might be nothing more normal.

Cristina: Yes. It just sucks as just like to search through though.

Jack: But no, because if this is the case and every highway is surrounded by a forest, you've already trained in searching every forest or not every forest, but you trained in searching through a forest. It's probably easier than searching through a city where there's alleys and buildings with multiple floors that somebody could be missing in.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: You just got complicated one dimension to look. It's a plane. You just walk through the plane. And that's why it's way easier. You know, it's the whole shallow grave scenario. It's like what's in the woods. It's kind of easy to stumble upon.

Cristina: You probably have search dogs too. That makes it even more easier.

Jack: Way easier. This like there's nothing easier than searching the woods.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Hard would be somebody went missing in the city. Well there's, I guess there's 5 million people in the city. How the f*** are you gonna find it?

Cristina: Could.

Jack: They could be walking by us and we might mess up.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: You know, the woods, ideal location for somebody to go missing. If you're gonna find them. The woods is where you want them to be.

Cristina: Alright.

Jack: And so after the two days they go and they organize a search party and start searching the woods. Now two days of search go by without finding anything.

Cristina: And the girl still doesn't know.

Jack: The girl still doesn't know. She's just staying with her grandma. But at this point the girl hasn't even talked to her parents on the phone or anything.

Cristina: So she's probably getting suspicious that something's.

Jack: Wrong or it's like a nine year old girl. Why would she get suspicious of anything?

Cristina: I don't know. Does that she have school or something to go to or she's Too young for that. You think?

Jack: This child is like, oh, my God, I should. She's like. She's remembering school.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: This is like a vacation. Yeah. This child's like, man, I need to. I need to go to school. It's important. My education comes first. What's happening?

Cristina: I miss my friends, maybe. I don't know.

Jack: This kid doesn't give a bro.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But two days into the search and they. They find Jonathan, Jackie's father.

Cristina: Okay. Oh, Jonathan. That's good.

Jack: Yes. Yes. And he's actually found dead.

Cristina: Oh, no.

Jack: Yeah, he's. He's. His body is found resting against a tree deep in the forest. It's called a parallel forest, by the way. So deep in parallel forest, he. His body's found. Parallel forest is off. I don't know the name of the highway, but it's off the highway. And this is in Oklahoma. And so his body's just found, like, sitting against a tree.

Cristina: Sitting against the tree?

Jack: Yeah, sitting against the tree. And the coroner's report says that it was just a heart attack.

Cristina: Really?

Jack: Yeah. Like, he got out of the car, traveled the woods, started to have a heart attack, leaned against a tree to kind of like, brace himself, and died there.

Cristina: What? That's pretty insane.

Jack: Yeah. That's f****** crazy, right?

Cristina: Whoa.

Jack: It's like, whoa, dude, you were having a bad day.

Cristina: And then they find the lady?

Jack: They did not immediately. So it was actually.

Cristina: How many search days is this? So far?

Jack: It's been two days of searching without. So it was two days missing?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Then two days of searching. It's been four days since they went. Since Jackie stayed with her grandma when they find her father. Okay, so four days between the day she goes to her grandma's and the day they find her father.

Cristina: Okay. Do they know how long he's been dead?

Jack: That is not established. I do not know.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: It was probably in. Somewhere in there, and I totally skimmed, so I don't know. The amount of time that comes by nex is three days before her mother is then found.

Cristina: What's her mom doing?

Jack: It's less about what her mom is doing, more about how weird it is what happened. So her mom is found in Modoc National Forest.

Cristina: Is that like super far from the forest that they're in?

Jack: Well, they're in Oklahoma and this forest is in California. What? That's weird.

Cristina: That's weird. What? What? Okay.

Jack: Yes. Also, she's found dead, and she's found sitting against a tree in the woods.

Cristina: From a heart attack.

Jack: The coroner's report claimed it Was a heart attack?

Cristina: No, she got a heart attack after walking from Oklahoma Street.

Jack: There's no way she could have walked that.

Cristina: That's not a four day walk or how long has it been at this point?

Jack: It's seven days. But that's not a seven day walk. You'd never make. You'd die long before then.

Cristina: Okay, but they think that's suspicious though, right?

Jack: She could have taken a ride there and died.

Cristina: I guess. That is so cr.

Jack: Like nobody's like, she walked there and died? No, again, only if you're expecting it to be weird will you conclude that these things are weird. Otherwise she just f****** left and had. Now again, the cops aren't connecting these dots. They're just like cops elsewhere found her. They're not like aware that again, cops in California found there. They're not like, hey man, does this woman over here have family that died elsewhere give a s***. They're just like a dead woman. So yeah, that's. But us observing it is like, whoa.

Cristina: Whoa, what does the grandma think of all this?

Jack: I know the grandma's tripping out, bro. She's like, what the. Because that's her daughter.

Cristina: Her daughter doesn't really believe her daughter ran away and then died.

Jack: Yeah, she didn't think her daughter parked the car, hitchhiked. The California died of a heart attack in the woods. Like, what party were they? Dude, that's some crazy drugs her and her husband were on. D***. I'm sure that probably crossed your mind though, like, what kind of crazy drugs were these crazy kids doing? Bath salts.

Cristina: Oh, maybe.

Jack: Man. Were bath salts even around in 2001? I don't think so. Right?

Cristina: No, it was just happening like Beth's.

Jack: Yeah, bath salts is like 2006. Maybe they had the first batch of bath salts. Yeah, they had like some super dysfunctional no kinks worked out.

Cristina: Oh my gosh.

Jack: Yeah, but that's nuts, bro.

Cristina: That is nuts. That's just like a mystery.

Jack: Yes, yes, it is. That is. That is precisely what it is.

Cristina: The cops don't do any more work. That's the end of their jobs.

Jack: I mean, what the are they supposed to. What do they think?

Cristina: The house, the car, why?

Jack: It's a heart attack. What are they supposed to do? The coroner said a heart attack. It's provably a heart attack. They're gonna be like, it was murder and someh. They caused the heart attack.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Like, no, they're just like, it was a heart attack. There's nothing beyond that point that they could do. The crazy cop that's like Dr. Housing it.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: He's like, this is a setup. I can feel it. I know the coroner's report says this, but in my gut, for whatever reason, I'm extra invested in this one random case, and I want to find out what really happened to this woman who was in the woods and died of a heart attack.

Cristina: So then what happens with the grandma? What does she do?

Jack: Panic? Her daughter died?

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: It's not like she's thinking clearly anymore. Her daughter died. She's just like, my daughter died of a heart attack. She probably forgot. She's not connecting dots. Her daughter died.

Cristina: Okay. I guess, yeah.

Jack: Your daughter dies, your next thought is, man, this little girl has something to it. Or I gotta investigate the murder of my daughter, who they've told me had.

Cristina: A heart attack like, in some other faraway place, like, I don't know. You don't think she, like, was kidnapped? No.

Jack: You just gotta think, my. What the f***?

Cristina: She had a heart attack in the middle of nowhere.

Jack: Right? Right. So the logic here is she got kidnapped and then had a heart attack and they dropped her in the woods. That's the logic you're expecting your grandma to have? Maybe this little girl's not safe with that grandma. If that's where that lady's mind goes, immediately like, well, the cop said the thing, but I know more has happened, but, like, there's no evidence that more has happened. The pros told you, yeah, it was a heart attack.

Cristina: It was a heart attack, but she ended up so far away.

Jack: That's a f****** nut. But again, her daughter died. She's not over here, like, considering the distance, she's like, oh, my God, what a tragedy.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Like, maybe afterwards, after the waters f****** calm down or whatever.

Cristina: Does she then tell her granddaughter, or is she living a lie now?

Jack: No, she doesn't tell her, Grant. I'm sure eventually she tells your granddaughter.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: But immediately, it doesn't make sense. You gotta kind of strategize what to do with life. Your daughter's dead. You're stuck with your granddaughter. Your next move isn't, your mom is dead.

Cristina: Mm. No.

Jack: You got like, okay, let me damage control first.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: I gotta, like, collect my emotions and I gotta, like, I guess I've adopted my granddaughter. Do you know the least of your concerns are, let me go tell my granddaughter her mom Is that. Then control her. I still don't know what I'm doing with this girl, but now I gotta worry about her emotions and, like, her mental stability, and she was already on edge.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: You know, like you're not gonna say s***. You're gonna think about the well being of the child.

Cristina: Yeah. While you're having a meltdown inside.

Jack: That is what parents do. That is what grandparents, that's what adults are supposed to do. You suck it the f*** up. You keep your head down and you problem solve. Because it's not about you or your emotions. It's about that other person you're trying to raise into a functional adult. There's no way her immediate reaction is, oh, my God, your parents are dead, Bo. Your mom is dead. Your dad's dead. Everybody around you is dying. Oh, my God. You're gonna die too one day. Like, that's awesome.

Cristina: I'm gonna die.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: What.

Jack: What's that from? I remember that. That was like scary movie or some, right?

Cristina: Probably, I think. Sounds like a scary movie thing.

Jack: Yeah. Your mom is dead. Your dad's dead. I'm gonna die too one day. Oh, my God, you're gonna die. It's just.

Cristina: Yes. I feel like that is one of those movies.

Jack: Yeah, it is, right?

Cristina: I can't making fun of that movie with the seven Days to Die scenario. You know, the one that if you watch the tape.

Jack: No, but I don't think it was out. I know exactly who the guy is saying it is.

Cristina: A kid who watched the tape.

Jack: I don't remember that part. I know the guy. He's. Who's saying it is the guy who was the brother of Char. Or not the brother, but whoever the h*** was Charlie Sheen's co star when he was the main character in Scary Movie. It was that one. It was that scary movie with Charlie Sheen and some other dude. Yes, I remember that much. Maybe that's the one with the ring.

Cristina: Yeah. Yeah. I'm pretty sure they own the farmhouse. That also. With the.

Jack: With the hole.

Cristina: Yeah, whatever. Yeah. Somehow leads all. All the stories are connected. I don't know.

Jack: Yeah. But the grandma is definitely not doing that to the girl. No, that's definitely not happening. That feels like the wrong move when everybody. When it's. That feels like the worst move when it's true, you know, it feels like a good troll, but it doesn't. It doesn't feel like too tasteful when it's real. It feels like bad timing to just freak out like that. But now she just sucked it up and like a good old lady, she's like, I've adopted this child. Now we need to go to her home and get clothing and crap to stay permanently. I suppose.

Cristina: Yeah. Get all the stuff.

Jack: Get Stuff? Yeah. No, I mean, not all the stuff. Just clothes and like, toothbrushes and junk like that, you know. So she goes to do all that stuff. Collects clothing and crap. But while there, the little girl says, Hank's there too. And Hank, now, she hasn't told this little girl s***. Hank tells a little girl, and the little girl tells her grandma that he said he killed her parents.

Cristina: No.

Jack: The chills that this lady must have f****** felt at that moment must be indescribable. She hasn't said anything yet. And this little girl just said Hank said he hurt my parents. Not just hurt. He killed them.

Cristina: He killed them.

Jack: He killed him. Those are words he told her. These are the words she told. She used the words killed. That is in the report. That is what said.

Cristina: What does the grandma do then? Like, what does she think? Does she believe her now? Or does she think her child's not. Child's granddaughter's insane.

Jack: Well, she's horrified by the way there's. This was on the news. This isn't just a bunch of police reports. This was reported on the news because the. The granny. Eventually. I'll let you know. So this was informed to the police about what happened, that the little girl said this.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: And Stephanie, then. This is where this, like, spins the f*** out. Stephanie explains to the police. Let me take a step back. Stephanie gets institutionalized shortly after this. And the girl gets put into a foster home.

Cristina: What?

Jack: After Stephanie went to the house to collect the things. And the little girl, Jackie tells Stephanie this. She gets institutionalized. Stephanie gets institutionalized. Because Stephanie goes to the police. And Stephanie tells the police what the little girl said, but she proceeds to give some extra details that we did not know until this point. She says that a long, long time ago, when her husband was alive, she cheated on her husband with a guy named Hank.

Cristina: Stop lying. What? Continue. Continue. Yes. That's so crazy. Okay.

Jack: And Hank happened to be a British guy. And she always believed and never told her husband that he. She always believed he was the father of Victoria, her daughter.

Cristina: Wow.

Jack: She was convinced and kept this s*** a secret.

Cristina: Gosh. Okay.

Jack: Yeah. And then in explaining this, they're like, this whole family is nuts. And they institutionalize her. They thought she was, you know, dangerous f****** situation. Because at this point, she's talking about ghosts.

Cristina: Does, like, she know? Does she say what happened to him? Does she know?

Jack: No, she has no idea.

Cristina: Okay. But she's now believes the daughter because of the ex or whatever being the same ghost. Or at least that's what she thinks is Happening. This is her story. Her side of story is that she believes her ghost ex.

Jack: Well, now she's just, like, trying to explain anything. It's just like, I knew a guy named Hank or whatever, and blah, blah, blah. And it's just, you know, she's freaking out.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Now, again, she. She begged the police to listen so consistently, she was like, please, come on. This is totally happening. This is true. Hank f****** killed them or whatever the h*** the story here is. He told the little girl, little girl told me, but little girl isn't telling. The cops told the grandma, and the grandma's on the cops and sounds kind of nuts.

Cristina: And they're not gonna question the girl about it.

Jack: They are. I mean, you can question the little girl about her imaginary friend.

Cristina: If they think she knows something about the murder.

Jack: They don't.

Cristina: They.

Jack: Why would an imaginary friend tell you information about the murder?

Cristina: Isn't that what the grandma is saying that happened?

Jack: Yes, but the cops are like, well, this holds water. Both the parents died of a heart attack. Let's review that.

Cristina: Oh, yes. It's not a murder.

Jack: There is no murder. You're looking for the weird, so you're seeing it. But there's no weird so far because.

Cristina: If it was a murder, they would still talk to the girlies.

Jack: Now there's a problem. Yeah.

Cristina: Okay. But no, there's no murder. This grandma's just crazy.

Jack: This is a crazy grandma. Who said that? Her. Basically, she's spazzing the f*** out because she has crazy guilt.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: That's what they're saying. The guilt broke her. There was no murder. There's nothing suspicious. The coroner's report said it was a heart attack. So, yeah, this old lady gets put in an asylum and the little girl gets committed because of this crazy, right?

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: It's a nuts story.

Cristina: So, like, the gram. Or for their. They think she just made up these stories. Do they think she made up the stories of the imaginary friend? Like, that's all.

Jack: Maybe her, maybe. I don't know. I don't know why they would ever report that. But. But maybe. I guess it could. I guess the logic would be she made up the stories because she got committed. But, like, I don't know. They. They weren't like. Also, we think, you know, like, we also believe she made up the stories that the little girl was telling us or telling her or whatever.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: She made up all of it. Well, I guess that part. They think she made up all of it.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Now, after this case, right, the old lady gets committed and Jackie gets Placed in a foster home where she claims to spent her time with Hank. This. The. The. This is where this makes the news. This lady, her friend or something explains that Jackie, through her entire time staying at the foster home, always talked about this guy named Hank who she spent time with, but nobody saw her spend time with. With. Now, she never pretended to be around anybody, but she would always talk about her friend Hank.

Cristina: Okay, wait, the person telling story is a friend of hers?

Jack: Yeah. So there's a bunch of this is pieced together by a bunch of crap.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: And now we're talking about the news report that Fox had about 9 wondering why is there a report about this? So the news report that Fox had where the friend of her was talking and explaining that she was always talking about this guy Hank. But, like, we spent almost all time together. There's no way she knew a guy named Hank. And she leaves the foster home at 18, so, you know, taking contacts for too long. But on her 21st birthday, Jackie's found.

Cristina: Dead from her heart attack. No. I don't know.

Jack: In a forest.

Cristina: No.

Jack: Leaning against a tree. From a heart attack, according to Connor's report.

Cristina: Oh.

Jack: What?

Cristina: That. What. Who pieced the story together if no one believed any of it, or I guess, like, afterwards. Because this friend at least heard stories about Hank.

Jack: About Hank. Yes, she knew about Hank. She didn't know who the h*** Hank was. She just heard about the guy named Hank. And then working backwards, they come across the information necessary to then claim all these things. So there's enough police reports, there's coroner reports, there's the documents that put the grandma in the asylum, and the grandma is still alive to ask questions to. So. Yeah.

Cristina: So did the grandma have more information?

Jack: Knew Grandma knew what she knew, and that was it.

Cristina: Oh, I don't understand. Like, this is supposed to be some weird ghost story, or is this a real person that's stalking a family?

Jack: I don't know. It's crazy, right?

Cristina: Yeah, because, like, I don't get it. Like, how are they dying from heart attacks?

Jack: That's the craziest part. The immediate thing I thought about when I was checking this out was like, somebody has a death note. Somebody. Like, how is everybody going off of a heart attack, bro?

Cristina: Yes. Walking into a forest. And. Yeah.

Jack: It's like somebody wrote the instructions ahead of time, and then it's like, just put the name a heart attack. How weird. It could have been anything else. They could have just all walked off a bridge.

Cristina: I don't understand. Like, why would. If this was like A ghost story. Why he would have this much hate to do all that? Like, did her husband murder him? Or something like that would make sense, I guess, as revenge. I don't know. Like, we don't know anything.

Jack: Yeah. The problem with the. When stories like this are real is that somebody's withholding information because they don't want to look bad. So maybe if this was a re. If this is a ghost story, if this is a ghost doing this, somebody had to do something to him, right?

Cristina: Yeah. Like, besides lying about. There's no way that that's the whole truth.

Jack: Yeah. That some, like, this old lady knows. Like, my husband died because he was killed by the guy because he went out to kill him in the first place or whatever.

Cristina: Yeah. Or he just killed the guy and then that's it. That's all she knows. Like, oh, my lover just disappeared one day after I got pregnant.

Jack: Well, interesting enough, she did say that she cheated on her husband with the guy, but never told the husband that she thought that was the father of the daughter. But did her husband not know or did he know?

Cristina: What if he did know and then killed the guy? Yeah. And this was his revenge.

Jack: Yeah. 100 it could be. But also, why would he kill his own daughter? Unless that wasn't actually his daughter? She only thought it was.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Again, she wasn't sure. She was convinced, but it.

Cristina: She was convinced. And maybe her husband was also convinced.

Jack: Yes. But maybe he just wasn't. And it's like, you killed me for nothing.

Cristina: Yeah. Whoa. That could totally be it. Who knows? But, like, yeah, if that was his daughter, why do this? Why? Murder. It's just too much murder to be like.

Jack: It's no murder.

Cristina: No. Well, whatever.

Jack: To this moment, there has not been a single murder.

Cristina: Suspicious heart attacks.

Jack: Yes. Ex absorbently suspicious heart attacks.

Cristina: Yes. I don't know. Like, if we don't count him in, then what is happening? How did they. Why and what the.

Jack: Do the woods have to do with anything?

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Or the forest. Whatever.

Cristina: Forest. Yeah.

Jack: Also, weirder question. Why is the mom all the way in California?

Cristina: Yes. How? Why?

Jack: Well, how? She probably hitchhiked there. But, like, what?

Cristina: Maybe Frank was from there. Who knows? I don't know none of that. Hank. Hank. Is it Frank? Yeah, whatever.

Jack: No, he was from England.

Cristina: Yeah, but he lived somewhere in America afterwards. Like, she met him in England.

Jack: Unclear. She dated a British guy and he worked at a lighthouse off the coast of England.

Cristina: Yes, but was she dating him there? I don't think so.

Jack: I mean, how would she date a guy Working at the lighthouse. Yeah, but I guess he worked at the lighthouse. It doesn't necessarily mean. No, it was off the coast. So he wasn't, like, on. On a f****** island, I guess.

Cristina: I'm guessing he vacationed in America or something. Yeah.

Jack: Like, how'd she meet him? You know, unless she vacationed. But no, this. Okay, so if we're trying to make this make sense, he had to come over here.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Not the other way around. So she just had, like, a fling. Probably in California.

Cristina: Exactly, because maybe she was on vacation.

Jack: Maybe they were both on vacation, man. In California. Some s*** went down. Then she confessed to her husband. Her husband went over there immediately and off. The guy. Maybe. She was in vacation with her husband, obviously. And then, you know, wild night where he was just at home. She was, you know, I'm gonna go hang out at the bar. You don't want to come out, whatever. And, you know, things happen. Goes home with Hank or not even goes home. Maybe Hank rents a car. Something happens with Hank, and then she feels. Oh, well, the pregnancy I have isn't my husband. Oh, my God. Yeah, but it was totally. Was your husband. And then your husband finds out because you confess or something. Oh, honey, I'm so sorry.

Cristina: I thought she kept it a secret. I mean, she did keep a secret from her daughter, I'm assuming, because she just let it out after everything happened, but I don't know. Yeah, I think she probably confessed.

Jack: Yeah. Yeah. To her husband.

Cristina: Yeah, Exclusively.

Jack: And so. So then the order of events were going by. Is lady lives in Oklahoma. She then has a vacation in California.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: By the Murdoch National Forest, actually. When her husband, for whatever reason, isn't with her and she happens to meet a guy named Hank, they have a fling in the forest. Yeah, that's where they f******.

Cristina: Oh, the plot thickens. Yes.

Jack: They f*** in the forest.

Cristina: And he probably was killed in the forest or his body was hidden in the forest after he was killed.

Jack: One of Holy. That's exactly what happened. They didn't f*** in the forest. They probably in the car parked by the forest.

Cristina: Oh, my gosh.

Jack: She explains to her husband what happened. Her husband goes and kills the guy, takes him to the forest. It just so happens to be the nearby forest. So both events take place there.

Cristina: Yes. And she has no clue what he's doing.

Jack: She has no clue that he did this. She just knows she confessed.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: The end. That's her. The extent of her knowledge. Her husband did the rest, and he has no reason to. He's horrified that he did this. He's not gonna be like, I killed a guy and threw him in the forest.

Cristina: Yeah. That's a secret he dies with.

Jack: Yeah. They go back home. She's pregnant. She does not tell her husband that she believes that's the other guy's baby. But she does believe that the other guy's baby. Which is probably not the case. It's probably just her husband's child. She's just guilty. She feels guilty.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And all these other thoughts are associated with the guilt. Simple. Simple. One plus one equals two. Most cases. But sometimes it could equal one as well. But we're not gonna dive into this. Into the semantics of how math is kind of difficult to understand. So he kills a guy. She doesn't tell him. She thinks it's his baby. Totally not his baby. But this lady grows up, marries a guy named Jonathan, and then they have a daughter named Jackie. And then Jackie has an imaginary, unquote friend.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: For whatever reason, this guy is messing with this girl. I guess this spirit is just waiting. And then one day, the moment arrives and the whole scenario happens. So car by the woods where she probably f***** in the first place. The guy. Because it's just possibility. And then the bodies in the woods where her late husband had buried. Not literally in the first instance, but that's why the mom, the actual biological one.

Cristina: Mm. Is buried over there.

Jack: Not buried.

Cristina: Found over there.

Jack: Yes. Interesting enough, I wouldn't be surprised if the guy's body is beneath that tree. But they would have had no reason to look.

Cristina: No.

Jack: Also, that happened so f****** long ago. There's no sign on the dirt.

Cristina: Yeah. There's no way that they could piece that together.

Jack: Yeah. So it's just a dead lady.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: But the guy who isn't her father is buried directly beneath her.

Cristina: Possibly.

Jack: What?

Cristina: That's crazy.

Jack: The idea here is that all of this happened, everybody in this lady's family died because of her f****** cheating on her husband in her first place.

Cristina: The ghost got his revenge by not killing her.

Jack: By not killing her. Letting her stay alive to watch all this. To know her family's dead.

Cristina: Yeah, like he really had it out for her.

Jack: Maybe she could. The problem is, maybe she could have stopped her husband. Maybe just not telling him would have been the right move.

Cristina: Yeah. Or maybe she has suspicious also that he did something to Hank and just never said anything. Like she's living with that guilt.

Jack: Interesting.

Cristina: It's way more than just.

Jack: Yeah, she could definitely have an inkling and, like you didn't avenge his death.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And it's Your fault he's dead. Yeah, like you didn't redeem yourself.

Cristina: But what if it has nothing to do with her story or whatever? Like, what if this girl did have an imaginary friend that was a ghost? Maybe in the house? Is that possible? I don't know. Like. But he has the name of the other guy.

Jack: Yes, yes, yes. The name is where this immediately becomes a ghost story.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: If the name didn't line up, then it wouldn't be a ghost. And who he killed. Why wasn't it. Why didn't he just hurt the little girl?

Cristina: Why did he take all these steps? Like. But it feels like it also, it wasn't in his control either. Because you say he like, changed over time. He was friendly at first, and then he just grew more and more hateful.

Jack: And that's interesting, right? What's that about? That's also where it gets kind of creepy. The rest of it is. It's more of a mystery. Everything is mystery until you get to the silent hill aspect of the little girl. That one patch is like, what happened because he was just playing with her, which would then make you think, no, that is your daughter. That's your granddaughter. That's your granddaughter.

Cristina: Unless he didn't have all his memory and he was gaining it. And that's what's all the glitchiness. Not glitchy, but, you know, the odd.

Jack: Behavior that's somehow somewhere, some such is so horrifying. I don't know why that disturbed me. The fact that he's a ghost with no memories. And then suddenly the memories start coming. It's f****** twitching and.

Cristina: Yeah. And then the hate starts growing. But that's real hate that he had before he died. But he just didn't have it at the moment when he met the girl. I guess. Like it just formed.

Jack: Interesting. Interesting.

Cristina: Like that makes sense because he was playing with her. He was normal. He was like, whatever.

Jack: Yes. And then slowly, gradually, more corrupted, broken, more twisted.

Cristina: Yeah. Like that's very strange. Could it be because it. What does that even mean? A ghost gaining memories?

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: How's that a thing like that means.

Jack: He was a goat. An incomplete ghost to some degree.

Cristina: Yes. I don't know. That's like.

Jack: And why focus on the little girl unless you're actually related? Related?

Cristina: You think? Maybe. I don't know.

Jack: If it wasn't, then he would have just focused on the old lady. But he didn't. In fact, the old lady was completely left out of it. That part right there makes me think that's actually the Victoria Is actually his daughter.

Cristina: Okay. Because he was around her. Well, sort of.

Jack: Daughter. He's around the daughter. Somebody in the family. As opposed to being around Stephanie, the grandmother.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: That makes me think. Yes. And I guess it would hold. The story would still hold. So Stephanie and her husband go on vacation. For whatever reason, one night, she's not with her husband. She meets a British man named Hank, who happens to also be in a vacation. They're from Oklahoma, but they're vacationing in California by the Modoc woods. She has a flame in the car parked on the side of the highway with Hank. She does get pregnant by Hank. She confesses to her husband what happened.

Cristina: Yes. And he goes. Fine.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: Hank. He goes find Hank. Kills him in the woods.

Jack: Well, kills him and.

Cristina: And then buries him in the woods.

Jack: Probably.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Could have killed him in the woods, could have killed him somewhere else. Regardless, he kills him.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And he puts him in the woods.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Then they leave. But she is, in fact, pregnant. She doesn't tell her husband that she's pregnant with his. The other guy's baby. He thinks this is his child.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: But it's not. Fast forward. Hank's spirit follows the bloodline manifests to the little girl. His granddaughter.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Because victorious. His actual daughter.

Cristina: It has to be. Maybe. But I wonder if she had an imaginary friend and the grandma just doesn't remember. But then again, she would have known. Like, this would have.

Jack: Like this would have happened already. Yeah, it would have already happened. There would have been. No, no, Jackie, no. Because Victoria is where it would have ended.

Cristina: Why was a heart attack?

Jack: Why would a heart attack. That's another thing that doesn't make sense. Because why wouldn't they just show up dead and then have no trace as a. Why, like, you know, like, only clearly murdered, stabbed to death, or, like, beat to death or whatever. But there's no trace of who did it. That would make sense. That's like. Okay, whatever happened to you, you did to them.

Cristina: Yeah. Unless he somehow died from a heart attack. Can you cause someone to have a heart attack?

Jack: I don't know. Maybe he hit him in the chest a couple of times, punch him in the chest repeatedly, and kill the guy by accident. Maybe. Maybe he went to beat the guy up, not kill him, and he beat the guy into having a heart attack. Maybe by hitting him in the chest, the guy dies. Then he goes ahead and buries the body in the panic. That's why this was never reported.

Cristina: Yeah, well, no matter how he did it.

Jack: But so the good. So Hank dies of A heart attack. And then he makes sure that the bloodline dies of a heart attack.

Cristina: Yes. Why kill the husband, though?

Jack: Yes. Because he's not related.

Cristina: It's not related. Yeah, but.

Jack: But keeping this in mind, maybe he sees Victoria and Jonathan as individuals that are mirroring what Stephanie did. Maybe they're not doing the same event. But he doesn't have a husband to take revenge out on. He has a daughter and his daughter has a husband to take revenge out on. Yeah, there's a husband somewhere.

Cristina: And I wonder how much the daughter reminds him of the mother of Stephanie.

Jack: Interesting. And then he's just. Yeah, it could totally be. It could totally be.

Cristina: It's just a weird build out. Like I don't feel. It doesn't feel like he planned it out from the beginning. Unless he. Maybe he did. I don't know. But then it's just weird. But we don't know the whole story.

Jack: We don't know the whole story because why would she tell us?

Cristina: Yeah, but I mean, like the little girl story too, of how he was friendly and then he just over times becomes a different person? Pretty much.

Jack: Well, here's what's interesting. The girl in the foster home isn't being tortured by Hank. Hank is just fine. It's just stories of being with Frank and spending time with him.

Cristina: That's also weird because she knows he killed her parents at this point.

Jack: Interesting. I wonder if this girl has some suppression problems going on, huh? Because it is traumatic. It's particularly traumatic. Your parents disappear, you got this crazy f***** tells you he killed them. Your grandma gets put away. You're young.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: You just create a blockade.

Cristina: I guess that would be the only way because, like, how are you living with all this nonsense going on? This is nonsense.

Jack: Like, interesting.

Cristina: What? Like she had. Did she believe him? Does she not believe him? You wouldn't know. I mean, her friends weren't worried about it. They were like, ah, she has an imaginary friend. Whatever.

Jack: She's an immature individual. At the end.

Cristina: She wasn't seeing a therapist. Still during that time, I maybe, like.

Jack: She'S already been seeing a therapist, so it wouldn't be like, crazy.

Cristina: Oh, and there's no story from them.

Jack: Why this? It would be illegal.

Cristina: Oh, there.

Jack: There's probably a crap ton of notes that nobody's ever gonna see because that would be illegal.

Cristina: This is. It's just a weird story, man. She did it. No. How did she do it?

Jack: Anyways, that's the story of Jackie and Stephanie.

Cristina: How she killed her parents.

Jack: No, I don't Know how her parents died.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So interesting, though.

Cristina: Yeah. A weird case of random heart attacks.

Jack: Random heart attacks and a crazy old lady with crazy stories.

Cristina: Yeah. Yeah, that's what it sums some.

Jack: Three heart attacks and a crazy old lady with crazy stories. Anyways. Anyways. Anyways. So we're totally way over the time here, but good. Bad, bad. Middle ground.

Cristina: Middle ground.

Jack: I think definitely not as horrifying as whatever the h*** happened last week at the Biovent is like, bro, that's horrifying. But this is just. This is just a weird.

Cristina: It's very weird.

Jack: It's very strange.

Cristina: It's.

Jack: It's probably just like.

Cristina: It's a bit icky. I don't know. Yeah, yeah.

Jack: And there's. Again, there's no murder anywhere.

Cristina: There's no murder, but it's very suspicious. Everything is like. It's not right.

Jack: It's not suspicious. It's very. Yeah, it's just not right. Right. There's just something like. This is weird.

Cristina: Three heart attacks. No way. In the forest. No way.

Jack: Yeah. And all of them in the same.

Cristina: Exact way in different forests. None of them in the same forest. Nope. That's very weird.

Jack: That is weird. Anyways, Anyways. Anyways, if you guys enjoy spooky stuff, we got two other episodes right before this one that are strange circumstances that.

Cristina: Have happened in life, and we have other episodes. Episodes. Older episodes.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: About weird, strange, real events.

Jack: Yes. There's a bunch. And not just real, there's a bunch of just like mythical crap that's weird, too. And like a bunch of horrifying creatures everywhere. There's a plethora. We. We kind of circle horror often, although we don't word it in horror kind of ways. There's a lot of creepy we talk about when you think about it.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And you can find all that on the podcast platforms. Any of them. And if there's one we're not on, like, I don't know, send us a message. And you could actually send us that message on Facebook, Twitter, or Instagram @justcomfopod, as well as find a bunch of clips and crap there.

Cristina: Awesome. And remember to subscribe, rate, and review the show.

Jack: Word of mouth, incredibly important. So, you know, if you. I guess that's not even word of mouth, but. How do I put it? If you rate the show, though, it's the equivalent of word of mouth, I guess, because we move up, you're telling.

Cristina: People, hey, but if you review it, aren't you doing the same thing?

Jack: Yeah, if you rate it, you bring us up and you're like, hey, worth looking at. And if you review it, you're literally letting people know. Letting people know with words. Although not words of mouth. It's words of keyboards.

Cristina: Yes. Words of keyboard. Yes. Okay. I let someone who might like this show know about it.

Jack: Thus insert the word of mouth.

Cristina: Yes. This has been the Rambling podcast. Take nothing personal. Thanks for listening. Bye. And these penguin guards, what are they? They're just. They're just guards.

Jack: They're guards. There's some sort of chimera of some sort or some man made creature. Maybe there's. Maybe there's birds and penguins over the. I don't f****** know, man. I don't pay attention. Yeah, we're. Our job is inside the.

Cristina: Inside the wall. Yeah. That's why we don't really travel outside the wall.

Jack: Yeah. There's no reason to.

Cristina: Yeah. Everything is in here. Yeah.

Jack: Yeah. So that's definitely, you know, that's what's happening there. And the reason that it's connected to Martin Luther King is actually that Martin Luther King, he had to communicate with the people from the other side of the wall to get help to establish laws that would help inside the wall.

Cristina: He had to do that.

Jack: He didn't directly. Basically, Martin Luther King would have secret meetings with President. What the h*** was his name? Lynn? Lyndon.

Cristina: Lyndon.

Jack: Lyndon Johnson. Yeah, President Lyndon Johnson. Martin Luther King would have special meetings with President Lyndon Johnson. This is fact secret meeting. Some of them were recorded unknowing. And these meetings took place because, you know, as, you know, world leaders communicate with higher ups and the chain goes all the way to the top of the Illuminati, top of Freemasons, top of government, all these things that usually manage from outside the wall. And so he needed to talk to the president to get messages from the president to the overseers and overlords on the other side of the wall to then get resources sent back so that we can, you know, they would have advice, they would send people to help and black neighborhoods need help or whatever. And so people would show up that like, where are those people from? But, you know, so much help, we're not gonna question it. And it's because people from over the wall are showing up to help.

Cristina: Good morning. Good morning. This podcast is hosted by Christina Collazo and Jack Thomas, produced by Lynn Taylor and published by greatthoughts.info art by 0lupo and logo by Seth McAllister with social media managed by Amber Black.

Rambling 129: The Doomsday Clock

Doomsday Clock, Apocalypse, Rapture, Time Travel, Ending, Clock, Watch, Time

Has the apocalypse happened? Is there a way to predict when it will? The Doomsday Clock and a priests predictions of the Rapture are unpacked a day after the ending of the world on this episode of Just Conversation!

+Episode Details

Topics Discussed:

  • Mayan and Christian Calendar
  • World War 3
  • The Fig Tree
  • The Apocalypse
  • Fat People
  • Biological Weapons
  • 2nd Amendment
  • The Road
  • Starvation

Art by IG @Zero_Lupo

Our Links:

Official Website - https://greythoughts.info/podcast

Twitter - https://twitter.com/JustConvoPod

Facebook - https://facebook.com/justconvopod

Instagram - https://instagram.com/justconvopod


+Transcript

Cristina: This program contains strong themes meant for a mature audience. Discretion is advised.

Jack: Going live in 5, 4.

Cristina: What does live mean? Welcome to Just Conversation, the show where we ground humanity's most absurd and baffling ideas in childish ways. I'm your host, Christina.

Jack: And I'm Jack.

Cristina: And if you haven't yet, remember to hit that subscribe button to get notified. Second, new episodes are released.

Jack: Yes. And also, this show is most enjoyable with the listening partner to share opinions and ideas on topics we discuss. So be sure to grab somebody that you love dearly by the shoulders, and you stare deep into their eyes, romanticizing them. Make sure they feel the love coming, radiating off of you. And you. You hold them by the shoulders, looking at their eyes, and you tell them, look, I really, really. I would love it if you listen to this podcast. Like, why? Why is this important to you? Why. Why did the moment get so tense?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And then you say, it's because it is a literal life and death situation. And she's gonna say, what? Or assuming it's a she. Well, in this scenario, it's a she because I'm the one talking. Okay, but let's assume whoever the listener who's trying to get somebody else to listen is, is talking to a she. So if you're female listening to this, you're lesbian for this moment. Or I guess it could just be your best friend. That just got real tense with. I guess whatever the case might be. You're talking to a female, and now you identify as a male, too.

Cristina: No matter what you.

Jack: No matter what you are, you currently identify as a male and you are talking to a female, regardless of whether that's what's happening.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Anyways, you tell them this, and they're like, what do you mean? And tell them the world is ending. If you don't listen to the podcast, it's like, how does that work? And it's like, I pressed a button.

Cristina: You pressed the button.

Jack: There was a red button.

Cristina: The list, the. Wait. The person that's saying this to them pressed the button.

Jack: Yes. We mailed them a button. We mailed our listeners a button. It's connected to a nuke. I don't know where the nuke is. It came out of the quantum computer.

Cristina: Oh, my gosh.

Jack: I just said, make something dangerous and it spit that out. And I sent it to all the listeners, and I'm like, somebody's gonna press it.

Cristina: Well, I have some news. I have to spoil your fun. That's a great idea. I wish they could have done that. If they Were listening now, but the world ended yesterday, I'm sorry to tell you.

Jack: So did that work?

Cristina: I don't know. Because they got it today. They're doing it today. Yeah, but if it ended, they can't do that.

Jack: So this is the post apocalypse?

Cristina: Yes. Well, it can be. There's two options, of course, depending on what happened yesterday. But we weren't there to see because I'm too scared. I'm afraid to find out that I've lost all my loved ones.

Jack: Why? F*** the loved ones.

Cristina: Well, anyway, yesterday, the world might have ended. There's this pastor. There's this. I guess. I don't know, this is just one of the many conspiracies online, I guess. I don't know if this is a bunch of people believe this or this is just one person's crazy writing, but this pastor explains on his website this whole detail of how and why it's ending yesterday. And I'm gonna try my best to explain to you why yesterday was the date.

Jack: Okay.

Cristina: To start off, you know when the Mayans got the date of the apocalypse, it was supposed to be 2012.

Jack: Yeah. They got the numbers wrong instead of 2021, 2012.

Cristina: It wasn't just them. The person that gave them that information was Satan.

Jack: Of course it was.

Cristina: Yes. And he got the number wrong. I don't know. Like, I guess he was also trying to figure out when the apocalypse is so he could be ready and let his people know. I don't know.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: What his reasoning for trying to figure it out. Because I would assume he maybe would know already. I don't know. But I guess for Satan, it's gonna be a surprise as well as for us. So the devil was wrong. Of course.

Jack: See, that makes total sense to me that somebody would say that because that means they don't get how time is calculated. And like the Mayans, I don't believe their Calendar literally said 2012. I believe the way they were calculated. Because we count 2012 based on the Christian calendar.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: We're just kind of putting together where their calculation would land. This is a person who made a prediction and had no idea that's what happened.

Cristina: Well, obviously the Mayans were tricked to follow a different. I don't know, they were taught to.

Jack: Follow a calendar that didn't exist yet.

Cristina: Yes, yes, exactly. So maybe, maybe they did have the Christian calendar as well and they just lost it.

Jack: And that's why we're like, later in the year 2000. Well, in the year one or zero.

Cristina: In the year zero. They figured it out. There was no year zero, though. There wasn't like, a day that was.

Jack: Well, now we start counting, people. Okay, everybody, now we're gonna agree to start count. No, what happened with time was that they chose. Somebody decided this is like, the starting point.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And then they calculated everything backward and forward from that moment.

Cristina: Yeah. So, but when was that year? That was like, year 11,000 or something.

Jack: Yeah, it was just 18,000.

Cristina: They discovered, like, or whatever. Okay, that's interesting. But, yes, there was no year zero. That's an interesting year, though. If anything happened that time, did they just skip zero?

Jack: They just skipped zero zero.

Cristina: There was no zero. Oh, okay. There's just one and negative one.

Jack: We got to think of it like Koreans do. Like, year one is also year zero, but it's like, from day zero all the way to 365. That's year one.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Now think of centuries. You'll be in the year 2000, but be in the 21st century is because you're adding all the numbers from the beginning of the year 2000 to the beginning of the year 2000 and 2100, that's the 21st century. You're counting all the dates within that as part of the 21st century.

Cristina: Yeah. So that's what would happen with zero.

Jack: Yeah. Okay, so the first year is zero to 365. That is year one. So in any case, I guess Koreans are the ones who have it, Right.

Cristina: Oh, snap.

Jack: Holy s***. Who would have thought that?

Cristina: Then would the year of the end of the year be the right year?

Jack: No, that means the numbers are f***** up anyways. It would have been 2013.

Cristina: Oh, then does that mean if this calculation that he does is right, would it be 2022 instead of 21?

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: Oh, no.

Jack: He was wrong. No matter what the case might be.

Cristina: Okay, well, the way he figured out his math. Because there's math involved. Of course.

Jack: Of course.

Cristina: Like, super scientific here. Okay.

Jack: Yeah. One plus one.

Cristina: Yes, pretty much. Okay, so you remember the story of the fig tree, right?

Jack: Sure. The God angry at a fruitless tree.

Cristina: Yes. Jesus sees a tree, he's like, why don't you have figs when it's not fig season? How dare you? You're cursed. Now it dies.

Jack: Seems like something Jesus would do.

Cristina: Yes. And then he tells a story about a mountain, and then he explains, if you wish for any, if you pray to God, God is gonna make it happen.

Jack: So, okay, let's. Oh, my God. So Jesus, AKA God.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Goes up to a tree, and he's like, tree you should have figs on you. You should have figs right now. And see, I'm God and I make whatever I want happen. You should have figs. So if I pray to God, who's me, then anything is possible. Thus you should have figs, but you don't have figs, which means me, who I prayed to, didn't do the thing I prayed to me to do. So I'm destroy you, fig tree. This is on you.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: The end of story.

Cristina: That is the story. That is. Yes. Or at least that's my understanding of the story.

Jack: Conclusion, if I pray to me and I don't do what I told me to do, blame whoever is closest.

Cristina: It's the fig's fault. The fig's fault because it didn't have his religion. Because somehow the story is a symbol, or the fig is a symbol of the nation and not being religious enough.

Jack: The fig didn't have enough faith.

Cristina: Yes, the fig didn't have enough faith. What that is what the true story. That's from an actual Bible. People who look into the story, they're like, yes, that's what this story means. But back to the pastor, though. He's saying that that's actually the start of the doomsday clock. There's a hidden message where the fig tree is Israel, which is what the people who interpret do think. The fig is fig is Israel, the fig tree is exile.

Jack: Right.

Cristina: That's why it was like they think it's at that present moment, it's dead, or it's. It's because they don't have faith in that time. But the priest today thinks it's because this is gonna happen now, that that's not back then that he's talking about. He's talking about what's happening right now somehow.

Jack: Right. Like that big tree. Okay, so how does the math come in that justifies this?

Cristina: Yes. Okay. He starts off with seasons. For some reason, he talks about winter and spring and summer and that Jesus said that Israel is going to come back to life somehow with seasons. I don't know the true math. Okay, look, it's a little crazy. Okay, I understand. But since Israel became a nation again, he sees that as spring, and that's the start of a whole season for the fig, which is Israel.

Jack: Okay. Why is it real, becoming a nation, the deciding point of a season?

Cristina: Because Jesus said so. He feels like this is what Jesus is talking about. He thinks Jesus is talking about what's happening to Israel right now.

Jack: Israel, boom, nation. Thus spring.

Cristina: Yes. And then summer. Well, first it was winter, actually. Israel wasn't a nation anymore. Then spring, it becomes a nation. Then summer is when things are going to get bad and the apocalypse happens then. That's what we're waiting for, for summer. And there's something about in which generation is this great big second coming and the end of the world stuff is going to happen. And he says, like, it's going to happen in two generations or something. In the Bible, a generation equals 40 years or 70 years or something. So in 1948, it became a nation again. And then 40 years from that is 1988. And then he adds 40 more years for some reason to make it 2087. And then he minus seven years to make it 2001.

Jack: He added 40 once and got to 2087 twice.

Cristina: He added it once to make 1988.

Jack: Got you.

Cristina: And then again to make 2028.

Jack: Okay, that would make sense. 88 doesn't make sense. 2088, that number's inaccurate.

Cristina: Yes. And then he minus seven because there's going to be seven years of horrible stuff happening. So that's why he subtracted seven pieces. I don't know. Who says seven years? It's going to be seven horrible years. But he's saying biblical. Oh, okay.

Jack: Rapture.

Cristina: So when you -7 is 2021.

Jack: So there's three years of peace, four years of h***, or something like that.

Cristina: Okay, but so there's two things that could happen. Either yesterday, Israel was forced to bomb Iran to end their nuclear threat, triggering World War three and the crash of the world systems and start of the apocalypse. That all happened yesterday.

Jack: Sweet. I didn't notice. I must have been asleep or.

Cristina: This pastor wins the Bible lottery. The Bible code lottery. That's his words. The Bible code lottery. He figured it out and he starts this church. And this church does so well that God is like, all right, I'm a stop Iran's nuclear program with an earthquake, and then we get a few years of peace. The end.

Jack: No apocalypse. Everything just keeps going.

Cristina: Yeah. For a short time. I don't know when the next. Like God's.

Jack: Oh, he built in his re date.

Cristina: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jack: He built in the redate.

Cristina: Yeah. In case. So when his church does succeed, if it did succeed yesterday, then, well, the apocalypse is pushed back.

Jack: Fair. So his church, it all hangs on his church.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Okay, sweet. That seems legit.

Cristina: I love it. It's amazing, right? Did you know that 22% of Americans believe that the world will end in their lifetime?

Jack: 22%. I mean, I guess we're all f****** stupid. That's. Of course we think that everybody's paranoid.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Like in mass. It's mass hysteria. That's paranoia. And then media convinces the dumbest of people that everything is at its most crucial. And then it takes even the dumbest of those people and divides them to opposite extremes to fight an imaginary war that is orchestrated by people who pretend to be on opposite sides wearing suits, but are obviously working together and made up the narratives that they got their people who are fighting the wars to follow. And then we're just talking one country at this point. Obviously, we're just talking the United States, but it's happening. If it's happening in the rest of the world. You zoom out and then you remember that there's a place called the United nations where the people who send the people to war shake hands and agree they're gonna send people to die versus each. You could just blow that guy's brains out in that room and your problem is solved. No, me and you, we're safe because we're part of the United Nations. The people from our countries, we can draft those m************ into war and they're all gonna die. All made up. Yeah, it just all got made up behind closed doors. And then dumb people fall for it. If you believe in democracy, in republics, if you're unrelated to democracy and republics, a democrat or a republican, a leftist, a rightist. Regardless of which country you come from, if you pick the side, you're a f****** idiot.

Cristina: Who. You're on the wrong side.

Jack: Yeah, you f******. You're an idiot because you believe there's a side. They made that up just for you to believe in it.

Cristina: Ooh. Yes.

Jack: They entirely designed it for dumbasses who would believe there's a side. And then they trick you into believing it's the end of the world. Consistently.

Cristina: Consistently. That's why so many people around the world truly believe that a religious figure is going to return to save the chosen few. Yes, that's everywhere. That's not just here, that's everywhere.

Jack: They have that belief all of time, though.

Cristina: So it's part of religion. Pretty much, yeah.

Jack: All religions have this form of thing that's going to come and save you.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Even freaking. What the h*** is it called?

Cristina: The alien one, the alien religion.

Jack: Scientology. You can be saved by aliens from 3,000 years ago or miles away or some s*** like that.

Cristina: 3,000 years ago?

Jack: I don't f****** know. I just know. The point is, aliens are going to come and take us.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: It's like, what the f***? Everybody has some salvation story.

Cristina: Exactly. Yes. Well, all of this reminds me that fake news is such a problem and that fake news has even entered the real doomsday clock. We talked about the fake biblical doomsday clock that happened yesterday. I mean, maybe it's not fake. Who knows? I haven't checked outside yet. But there's a real, what I'll call the real one, which is the science made, I guess. Doomsday clock and fake news has entered into what they're worried about.

Jack: Yeah. Because they're gonna trigger retarded people to react in the dangerous situations. The insurrection was triggered because fake news.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: The assault on Asian Americans is because fake news.

Cristina: Yes. So many things.

Jack: War is formulated because fake news propaganda Russian hacks into our systems and create fake narratives that then cause people to be paranoid anti vaxxers, freaking the leftists taking over the world. But then the right is, you know, being all rogue and it's like, doesn't matter where you come from, what side you stand on.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: You fell for the fake news.

Cristina: So many fake news.

Jack: Yeah. Both sides are susceptible, but it's targeted towards the dumb people.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: If you believe any news outlet. You fell for it.

Cristina: Yes. So that's why they had to add that. And from learning about that, I found out that the doomsday clock has been around for 75 years, just waiting for us to get close to him for the actual doomsday, which would be us starting it as human beings.

Jack: Oh, yeah. Nothing else that's gonna happen. Like no meteor is gonna. We're gonna become innovative enough to solve that problem.

Cristina: Exactly.

Jack: Instantaneous. What we can't solve is. Oh, that a****** has a button. Well, you know what I have?

Cristina: That's exactly how it's gonna end. I mean, we're already there. We're just waiting for who presses that button first.

Jack: We're waiting for mutually assured distraction.

Cristina: Yes. That's really what they're watching. That's all they're watching for.

Jack: Some douche is gonna press the button.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And then some other a******'s gonna panic.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And then everybody's gonna start pressing their respective buttons and that's it.

Cristina: Hopefully we're in Mars by then.

Jack: That's.

Cristina: I guess that's the only thing. Like, we gotta get some people over there. So once this is gone, I think.

Jack: Elon Musk is to get us the f*** out of here. Because he's like, they're stupid, bro. They're really gonna just cause this. I just need to be off before that happens.

Cristina: Yeah. What it's problematic, but it's gonna happen. So on the Doomsday Clock, we're the closest to the end that we ever been.

Jack: It's always the case. I know. That is a fact about the Doomsday Clock.

Cristina: I've always been like that.

Jack: You were always the closest.

Cristina: Well, the closest.

Jack: Inching.

Cristina: Yeah, it's always inching. But it's always moves back and forth, though, as well.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Like, away from it. What is it?

Jack: But when it comes back in, it comes back in harder.

Cristina: It's way, way seconds away. Yeah.

Jack: If you were to think about it and think of a grandfather clock.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Except rather than swinging really hard to both sides and then focusing in the middle, you start in the middle and you gradually tick harder and harder and harder. And your swings are more drastic every time.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So we're in the really extreme swings where one day we're almost there, the next day, a moment away from peace, and then again, totally nuclear moment.

Cristina: Well, right now we're at just 100. We're just at 100 seconds. And that was since last year, because they do it every year. But last year was the closest. And this year is. It's the same. They haven't changed at all. It's that bad. Yeah.

Jack: It's 2021, part two. It's 2020, part two. It's 2021.

Cristina: Yeah. Yes, yes. And besides, we got what fake news we have to worry about. What else do we have to worry about? Oh, they also watch, of course, for nuclear threats. Did we already say that, too?

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Yes. And I don't know if you know this, but in 2019, there was almost 13,900 nuclear warheads in the world.

Jack: Don't we have like, 99% of that?

Cristina: Probably, yes. But, you know, the highest was having 7,000. I mean, 70,000. In the mid-1980s, there was 70,000 nuclear warheads in the world.

Jack: But those were weak sauce next to the nuclear warheads we have now. That's why we had less. They're way more overpowered.

Cristina: Oh, yes, that's true. That's probably true. Also, climate change has been added to the list since 2007, so.

Jack: Because we're always melting everything.

Cristina: Yeah. And that's the most controversial thing that they've done, because, of course there's the.

Jack: Climate change, because f****** back to the deniers.

Cristina: Yeah, the deniers. Yes, exactly.

Jack: It's part of that person who picks up snow and brings it into a freaking town hall meeting. Do you think there's fake. There's a. Is climate change real? Then how am I holding snow? It's like, I don't think you comprehend what climate change is.

Cristina: No, no. So fake news and conspiracy theories are important to them because the conspiracy theories, what worries them is the WHO anti vaccination movement and how that's like. Some things that were gone because of vaccines have come back because people don't want to take the vaccines for it. That kind of stuff happens.

Jack: It's crazy that we would have gotten it under control because people understood how vaccines worked and somehow that knowledge got lost.

Cristina: I don't think they knew how it worked. I think it was advertised to them. Good enough. Well enough that it was like, oh, yeah, we should take it because it's popular, or something like that.

Jack: But then fake news jumped in.

Cristina: Yeah. Like, it was probably fake news of, like, it's gonna help you, even though we're not really sure it's gonna help you.

Jack: And then, you know, I'm saying fake news popped up. Oh, yeah, I see what you mean. Because then fake news popped up and, like, convinced them otherwise.

Cristina: Exactly. Exactly.

Jack: How many people have no idea how vaccines work? Yes, they're too stupid to do the.

Cristina: Research, but the scientists aren't good at explaining things either.

Jack: God, I hate scientists. They're so dumb, too.

Cristina: Exactly.

Jack: Like, they're academically smart. They are not necessarily even intelligent. They just have academic information memorized. If they were intelligent, they'd be like Einstein, that you could rephrase it without reciting what you read from a textbook.

Cristina: Rephrase it? That makes sense to a child.

Jack: Well, that would be the point of rephrasing it in the first place.

Cristina: Okay, yes, yes.

Jack: So that you can say something that isn't what you read off of a textbook. But scientists are f****** stupid. They just have good memories.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: So they can only repeat what they memorized off of a textbook.

Cristina: And then the average person is going to see that, hear that, and think of gibberish.

Jack: Yeah, you. You're lying to me. Because you're telling it to me like this. We need people to study Einstein and learn to communicate things to people so that they can be like, this is what it is. And you'll be like, oh, I can picture that.

Cristina: Yes. So ridiculous. And a few things that they're looking. A few things that they're looking into, but it's not really on the list yet. Is disruptive technologies like synthetic biology and gene editing.

Jack: Right.

Cristina: I wonder what horrible things could happen from that.

Jack: Wait, why are they looking at that?

Cristina: That's in case something horrible happens in.

Jack: That I somehow Doubt that. The whole purpose of that would be for us to become better, to remove problems.

Cristina: Well, maybe someone's gonna use that to do evil. I don't know how.

Jack: I mean, I guess it would be weird. You'd have to acquire fetuses that aren't dead. Like, you're talking about the sketchiest, darkest holes of science.

Cristina: Oh, like some.

Jack: Well, they're worried about the ground. I mean, there was that guy who was just f****** splicing DNA of humans and pigs and animals and s***. Like that was a f****** thing.

Cristina: Oh, yeah, we found that guy. He disappeared.

Jack: Yeah, he just some Mexican guy who just bailed. He went to China to do this. Did this thing.

Cristina: Yep.

Jack: Trail runs cold as f***. Yeah, that's the guy who made Scooby Doo.

Cristina: Oh, yeah, that guy. Oh, my gosh, yes. They're looking at him. He's on the list. Well, he's not on the list yet. They're waiting to see what he does.

Jack: Man, you know what's f****** crazy?

Cristina: What?

Jack: That's China again.

Cristina: That's China because he went to China.

Jack: To be able to do it. That's mad f*****. Is that just like the anything goes over there?

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: D***, bro. Maybe that's mad f*****.

Cristina: Yes. And they're also worried about artificial intelligence because of weapons mostly. You know, smart weapons.

Jack: I guess they think they're gonna turn on us.

Cristina: Maybe.

Jack: That seems highly unlikely.

Cristina: What? These aren't on the list. These are like in the far future. Let's see what happens. It's not anything. This isn't stuff that they're actually on. This. This isn't what they decided the clock on or anything.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Really looking into this. They're just.

Jack: And how are we. Just a couple of seconds. I don't understand.

Cristina: We're a couple of seconds because of all the things that I mentioned.

Jack: No, no, no, no, no. That means that in exactly 100 seconds from this moment, everything should end. How is.

Cristina: Because that not the case.

Jack: What does 100 seconds really mean?

Cristina: It doesn't really mean anything. It's. It's just a symbol. It's just a metaphor of. It's good. We're really close. Like, one simple mistake extra that you add on to this list might actually end the world.

Jack: Got you. That makes sense like that.

Cristina: Yeah. And they started. They started this list because after World War II, a lot of the scientists that were part of the Manhattan Project and were working on the nuclear bomb, they were just. At that time, they were just wanting to be Germany in making the nuclear bomb, and they weren't really worried about, like, what's this gonna impact the world if we actually, you know, use this thing? They were just like, we're scientists. We gotta do this. And then after the atomic bombs were used in Japan, they were like, oh, crap, this is bad. This is not fun. And then they were worried that we could destroy the Earth with these things.

Jack: Which is pretty accurate.

Cristina: Yes. And that's when they started this list and seeing, like, how could we convince leaders and people to take care of the Earth and slow down with this whole arms race and all that stuff?

Jack: Who pays attention to the clock?

Cristina: They're hoping that the government will pay attention. I don't know if they do, but that's their goal. And for regular people to be concerned too, because I guess they expect regular human beings to protest together to make change or something.

Jack: You know, make everybody paranoid.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Try to stir up some madness.

Cristina: In a good way? No, not a mass hysteria, I think.

Jack: No, it's kind of mass hysteria. They're trying to scare everybody into action.

Cristina: Yes, I guess, in a way. Yes. Yes. But they think it's realistic, not something imaginary like the biblical doomsday.

Jack: So you're saying the biblical doomsday is imaginary?

Cristina: It's from one guy's point of view.

Jack: How is he not the guy? How do we know he's not the guy?

Cristina: I don't know. I'll find out when I go outside. But as far as I know, he's not the guy. But I don't know if they're the people either. Like, I don't know, they're also doing what he's doing. So who knows?

Jack: You tell me who's not. Who doesn't have faith in some random s*** and have a thing they call the Bible to a scientist? Equations. Scripture. Follow the equations. It tells me all the answers. You mean like the Bible tells these people the answers? Yeah, yeah, the equations tell me all the answers.

Cristina: Exactly.

Jack: But you can't prove anything there. Well, they're theoretical.

Cristina: Yes, but.

Jack: So you have faith in these theories? No, no, no. It's fact. But you can't prove it. That's why it's a theory. It's just religion.

Cristina: It's just religion. Well, this. Yeah, I guess so. We got two different doomsday clocks, okay? And they're both saying the end is near.

Jack: One says it already happened.

Cristina: Oh, yeah. One says that it's already happened unless he actually saved people with his church. And then it moves back a little.

Jack: A little. Got you enough time to save more people.

Cristina: Yeah, so keep pushing it Back then.

Jack: Eventually save everybody and you'd beat it.

Cristina: Yep, I guess. Right? No, it eventually has to stop, though. There eventually has to be an end because the apocalypse has to happen there. Whatever. The Rapture.

Jack: Yes. There's God, thus Rapture.

Cristina: Yeah. So there's no. Like, we can beat it.

Jack: And then, you know, what's the biggest hole in this guy's plan?

Cristina: What?

Jack: The fact that he can push the apocalypse that God decided back. Is this guy somehow related to St. Patrick?

Cristina: Maybe he's got some St. Patrick's blood in him.

Jack: He's a descendant. Oh, snap.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Just.

Cristina: If he does it, God's gonna help him. That's. That's the deal.

Jack: That's the deal.

Cristina: Yeah, I guess. So if he gets enough people. I don't know how much he is enough people. How much was it for that one story where God was like, I'm gonna destroy this place unless you convince a hundred people. And then he's like, no, what if I convince 10 people? Okay. And then no two people or something like that. You know that story?

Jack: Yeah, Yeah, I remember that story.

Cristina: So what if it's like that? Like, if you just convince two people that the doomsday biblical clock is true, that they need to be Christian or whatever it is if they convert to whatever he's selling, that he's. He saved the world.

Jack: Maybe. I suppose. Yeah. I don't see how it would be any different.

Cristina: Yes. Yes. In 1953 was the closest before 2020, where it was set to 11:58pm after the U.S. and the Soviet Union had hydrogen bomb tests. Right. In 1991, it was the furthest away from the. From midnight. It was 1153 in that year. The end. It was the end of the Cold War, and they signed a Strategic Arms Reduction treaty so that they would stop or to reduce the amount of dangerous weapons they had.

Jack: Who?

Cristina: The world. The America and the Soviet Union, I guess.

Jack: Got it. Got it.

Cristina: And so the way they. The way the scientists do this, every year, they begin in November, and they meet up in Chicago for a day and a half, and they ask two questions. One, is, is humanity safer or at greater risk than the year before? And is the. Is humanity safer or at greater risk than all the years since 1947, which is the year they started the clock?

Jack: And that's how they measure how much further to push it.

Cristina: Yeah. Whether to move it closer or farther from whatever it is.

Jack: We're not necessarily always more dangerous than we were the year before, but we're always consistently more dangerous than when we began. And if we take any five year sample, at least we're always significantly worse than any five year before us.

Cristina: You think so? We have a. We don't always move. Also, there's been some periods where it's been the same. Like from 1953 to 1960. That's not a lot of years. But those years, it was all that year. I mean, at that time it was all the same time. It's not always going up and then back down. There's been years where it's straight down, which is bad, but then some straight ups, which was good and good. Like when I'm saying up and down, I mean like closer to midnight is down, and farther to midnight from midnight is up.

Jack: So 1991, we were further from midnight, further from 1947 than we are now in 2021.

Cristina: Yeah. We're like, wait, what? From what year? 1947. Yeah. And for how far we are from the clock from midnight, it's 100 seconds, which is a minute and two thirds. They actually used seconds for some reason instead of minutes, they used seconds. This was the first time that they used seconds instead of minutes. That's how bad it is right now. And yeah. So it's still 100 seconds to midnight.

Jack: Right.

Cristina: And what's like you said earlier, that panic, misinformation and racism relating to Covid has just spread all over social media, all over the world, faster than the virus. That's pretty crazy.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Yep.

Jack: Again, stupidity is the main target of anybody seeking money. If you're trying to sell something, because everybody's trying to sell something, and fake news is just you selling stupid f****** information, but you don't give a s***. You're trying to get the views which equals money.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And so you'll sell dumb s*** to dumb people who buy your dumb s*** regardless of what side they land on. If you're buying it, well, you sold some dumb s*** to somebody.

Cristina: Yeah. Have you heard. How many conspiracy theories do you think you've heard so far in my life? Since the vaccine?

Jack: Relative to the vaccine?

Cristina: No, to the coronavirus, actually. To the coronavirus. How many conspiracy theories have you heard so far?

Jack: New ones or in general?

Cristina: In general, I guess.

Jack: Conspiracy theories about the virus or since the virus?

Cristina: Since the. About the virus? Both. I don't know. I want to talk about both. Okay, but first I'm going to talk about how the coronavirus was made or.

Jack: Why you are asking how many conspiracy theories about the virus I have heard or just in general, like monkeys came from the.

Cristina: No, just about the coronavirus. How many conspiracy theories have you heard about the coronavirus?

Jack: I don't know, 10.

Cristina: 10. Well, have you heard that the coronavirus. There's one that it bears the sign of the beast, symbolized by 666. I don't know how they found the number on the virus, but a priest found. Did math, of course.

Jack: No, he didn't.

Cristina: But okay, he did math and I'm sure he showed it to people and it was like, look at this math. I didn't actually check up his math because it just. It's too ridiculous. Where do you find this stuff? But people do. Coronavirus is an American biological weapon. You for that one.

Jack: Yep.

Cristina: The Chinese. It's a Chinese chemical weapon.

Jack: Yep.

Cristina: Oh, we talked about this one. It's caused by 5G towers.

Jack: Yep.

Cristina: It's caused by Bill Gates to put a microchip in you.

Jack: Yep. Heard that one too.

Cristina: It's caused by Bill Gates to sell you vaccines.

Jack: Didn't hear that one, but that makes sense.

Cristina: I don't think that makes sense.

Jack: Like he could own these vaccine companies for.

Cristina: Okay, he has. Yep. Yep. The coronavirus isn't real.

Jack: That is the most common one.

Cristina: That is the most common one. And it's just another flu.

Jack: That is not necessarily conspiracy theory.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: It's. It is a Covid.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Which so is the flu.

Cristina: I guess people just think it is the flu.

Jack: It's not. Not the flu. It's Covid.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Which is what? The flu. They're both coronas. I guess Covid is the wrong name. But they're both coronaviruses.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: There's just different kinds of coronaviruses. We've had coronaviruses forever. SARS is coronavirus. It's just a different kind of SARS that we're dealing with right now. So it is sort of kind of the flu. It's just, you know, the flu took some steroids or some s***. At the beginning it was way weaker.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But then it got to the fat.

Cristina: People and the old people.

Jack: And the old people. It was just raging, Ray. That's where it got its like legs. It started running dash and darting. Just f****** people up. But also we're in a consumer culture where we sell McDonald's to everybody and they eat it because they're weak minded morons who don't really care about their health. And then when they're starting to die, they then get scared. It's that thing about the every atheist in his last moment praise.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: That's exactly what's happening here. It's like, oh, my God, I need to be healthier. And it's like, you have had your life to make this choice. Now you decided, nah, maybe if it takes you out, you just had it coming.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: That's where I am with this virus. I got no problem. I want everybody to catch it.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: 100% of us. If you did not prepare for this, this is your fault. You went to school where they taught you health and hygiene and you had parents who told you clean your. Wash your hands, brush your teeth, take a shower. We all had that. At least the majority of us. And the ones who didn't have such a robustly, ridiculously overpowered immune system because they're so g****** dirty that this coronavirus enters your body and it f****** dies.

Cristina: What?

Jack: Okay, so you're either in one of these two extremes or you're a fat.

Cristina: Person and you should die.

Jack: And you probably should die.

Cristina: Ow.

Jack: And look. Oh, we shouldn't. Fat shame. Fat people are dying because the virus kills fat people. That is literally what's going on.

Cristina: Do you think Phyllis Gates has a problem with fat people?

Jack: Who's Phyllis Gates?

Cristina: Bill Gates. Do you think Bill Gates has a problem with fat people?

Jack: Oh, no, I don't think he actually made this virus. I think this virus has a problem with fat people.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: And old people, it just has a problem with people who aren't healthy.

Cristina: Wow.

Jack: And if you're obese, you're not healthy. And you know, big is beautiful. We push that so much, we have one of the highest f****** counts in the world. That's how badly we push. Big as beautiful.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Like, bro, it could be, but healthy is more beautiful.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Big could be as beautiful as you want it to be. It will never be as beautiful as healthy. If big is beautiful, then healthy is f****** gorgeous.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And that's how it goes.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: This virus is taking the bottom tiers down and only leaving the top.

Cristina: Ow.

Jack: You were beautiful. You weren't gorgeous. You were just beautiful in. You didn't cut. F******. You didn't make the bar. Oh, no. This 300 pounder is equal to that 115. Nah, nah. I promise. If you were to take some health tests, you'd fail. You'd get a very different result. Like if we couldn't look at you physically and just. You gave us blood and we took samples and we couldn't see you. If we just had that, we could tell you you're ugly based on how unhealthy you are.

Cristina: Oh, my gosh.

Jack: That's all it would take we don't need to see you. You're just ugly.

Cristina: You're just ugly.

Jack: You're just ugly.

Cristina: I hope they become. That's a rating system in the future. What?

Jack: Like, how healthy you are, man. I don't know why we don't push that. It should be like, the healthy you are, the sexier you are, regardless of how f****** you really land. On a scale of 1 to 10, like, how round your face is or to color your eyes or color your hair. The tightness of your waist. If you're healthy, who gives a s***?

Cristina: We gotta know what your doctor says about you.

Jack: Yeah, well, it. I guess we should normalize being attracted to people who eat well and seeing people exercising. Me like, oh, yeah, that's f****** nice. Somebody eating well. Oh, yeah, it's f****** nice.

Cristina: Be turned on by those things.

Jack: Yeah, we gotta normalize that because we're like, big f****** fat thighs and huge a****. And, like, one. Most of that is fake.

Cristina: People have a fetish for that. They're like, you eat more, eat more.

Jack: Media did that.

Cristina: Mmm.

Jack: Rap was not the mainstream, but they had women shaking their a****, Usually bigger women, all sexy and s*** and skimpy outfits and whatever. And then rap became the mainstream, and we still maintained that in those videos. But now people want it to be those things because it's the mainstream. It's cool, and I want to be cool. And thus we have in real life today, people we were looking down on in music videos 20 years ago that is just like, it left the f****** music video and is just walking around outside. It's like Michael Jackson jumping out of the f****** screen and Family Guy and snatching up the kid.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Like, it was in the screen. Now it's just out here.

Cristina: Mm. Well, I'm fat racist. You're fat racist. Okay.

Jack: Ever since. Ever since COVID I'm on COVID side.

Cristina: I'm like, look, you're pro Covid Joe.

Jack: The rest of us are f***** because of these people.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: If there weren't so many fat people, the rest of us wouldn't have to deal with this s***. There wouldn't be that many people dying. It's because there's that many unhealthy people. It's the fat people's fault we're all f*****.

Cristina: What about old people?

Jack: That's not their fault.

Cristina: They're old, but they're dying.

Jack: Aren't they way less than the fat people. Oh, it's the fat people in places where overweight was the minimum, age was the maximum. So if you don't have enough overweight people. All you can calculate is the older people. Think of Italy. Absurdly healthy country. Obesity. One of the lowest countries with obesity. Italy also, they have some of. Actually, literally the largest elderly population in the world.

Cristina: Those are the ones.

Jack: And that's who was dying. They didn't choose to get old. That f****** happened. Yeah, that happened to them. Not by them, but in these countries. Like, our population isn't majority elder. We're majority young. We have crazy young population. For us to pretend that it's not the fat people's fault that we're dealing with lockdowns and forced vaccinations. No, it's the fat people's fault.

Cristina: Okay?

Jack: We don't have enough old people for it to be a problem the way it was in Italy. Well, we don't. We don't. It's so small. Our elderly population is like 15%.

Cristina: 15%. Okay.

Jack: Yeah, it's. It's.

Cristina: How much is the fat people?

Jack: 65% of the American population.

Cristina: What? 65.

Jack: 65% of the American population. You're more likely to see somebody overweight than somebody. Not on average.

Cristina: On average.

Jack: If you were to see three people, two of them are overweight.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: That's where we are.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So, of course all this s*** is their fault. We're dealing with it because of them.

Cristina: Wow. Yeah. F****** fat people also. But what if. What if the coronavirus is trying to keep the masses obeying the government?

Jack: So it's a nanovirus.

Cristina: I guess it's for mind control. I don't know. I guess it's killing off people. People who disobey the government.

Jack: No, in this case, it would still be some sort of biological weapon, but intentionally created for the sake of having the right to impose these laws and rules by scaring people into agreeing to them.

Cristina: Oh, yes, that's. Yeah, that could be.

Jack: It's the whole get rid of guns problem. Like, nobody's really trying to get rid of guns, but the ideology behind that is, if we wanted to.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: We just go ahead and send a couple of people to shoot up some of the leftist areas, then they would force us to remove their guns, and then if we wanted to overthrow them, they'd have no guns to fight back with.

Cristina: Is that a conspiracy or that's a thing?

Jack: No, that is a fact. That is exactly the point of guns in the. The amendment. The Second amendment is to defend yourself against a tyrannical government. Yes, the government is who's trying to get rid of your guns. Yes, but they usually don't do crap, but wait until you try to push it and then they're all on board. Yes, yes. We need to do this depending on.

Cristina: Your party though, I guess.

Jack: Not really. If you got money, because even some Republicans lean into it. It's really just about if you're rich and you kind of probably make money off of guns too.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: Like if you're an NRA member, you're probably paid off.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: You're making money by supporting this.

Cristina: Which many of them are.

Jack: Which many of them are. Because ultimately if you're not an NRA member, you have no benefits here. Yeah, f****** get rid of the guns. If you wanted to overthrow these f****** would be way easier if they didn't have some. Not to mention it's f****** stupid to say you want guns because at the end of the day, what is your stupid pistol gonna do to a tank?

Cristina: I don't know. You're gonna throw it at the.

Jack: Yeah. What are the Republicans think they're gonna do? Well, I got my gun. If the government tries that, bro, they got missiles.

Cristina: They got robots.

Jack: Yeah. They got roach you can't beat no. Figures. Your gun isn't s***. It's fully automatic, bro. Their missile is like a tank that flew 100 miles per hour at you.

Cristina: They got dogs robot that looks like that dog robot from the Black Mirror episode where it was like an apocalypse and just dog robots everywhere.

Jack: Yeah. This is just real s***.

Cristina: It wasn't even like any scary type of robot chasing you. It was a little tiny dog robot that looks like it could flip really well.

Jack: But it's a total robot. That's good enough.

Cristina: Yes, yes. And of course the coronavirus was made to kill the old people because someone really hates the old people.

Jack: No, but that. I've heard about that one. That's population control.

Cristina: Oh, that's part of the population.

Jack: Because we allegedly. We don't. It's not that we don't have enough resources. They're distributed very shittily. We have a bunch of rich people with a s*** ton of resources and then poor people with none of it. And then we're like, there's not enough. But also we like don't use most of the land on Earth either.

Cristina: So what do they get from killing the old people?

Jack: Well, they're idiots and they think that there is a population control problem.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And if that was the case, then if you get rid of all the old people who are already going to die eventually.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: You ease some of the resources strain so they could be spread out more Evenly amongst everybody left. But again, we don't have a resource problem. We have a resource management problem.

Cristina: Definitely.

Jack: And so I get where they're coming from. But just kill the billionaires and you suddenly have a lot of resources.

Cristina: Yes. I don't promote that.

Jack: You don't promote killing the billionaires?

Cristina: I don't promote killing anyone. Not even the fat people.

Jack: That was. The virus is doing it for us.

Cristina: Exactly. But I'm not encouraging the virus. The coronavirus is made to kill poor people.

Jack: It's funny, though, because, like, the homeless people have, like, flourished in us.

Cristina: That they're flourishing. Yeah. A lot of people have become the poor homeless people because of that. Yeah.

Jack: There's been sort of a flip. People who are already homeless and poor have been put up in hotels so they wouldn't be out exposed, and thus they had better amenities. But then people who lost their jobs are the ones who replaced them on the streets. And those resources were already taken by the people who were on the streets. So the poor people kind of won, especially with free checks and s*** like that. It's the people who work. It's the middle class who got really shafted.

Cristina: Mm. So was the coronavirus for them?

Jack: It was to take out the fat people, the old people, and make the middle class poor and make the poor stable.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: It's to shake it up. The billionaires at no moment moved position.

Cristina: Nope. Everyone else said.

Jack: Everyone else said, wow.

Cristina: It was manu. It was made to make the rich richer and the poor poorer. Which is exactly what it is.

Jack: Exactly what's happening.

Cristina: It's exactly what's happening.

Jack: That is the right one.

Cristina: Maybe. Maybe it was made for that. Who knows?

Jack: It's definitely what happened if you owned a toilet paper company, a mask company, glove company.

Cristina: Lotion.

Jack: Lotion. Sanitizer.

Cristina: Yeah. In the beginning, sanitizer was.

Jack: Yeah. Not lotion. Sanitizer.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So sanitizer, any of these things you stacked, and you're probably staying stacked for a while. Like, even if they bought in bulk and they can't come and buy more.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: It doesn't matter. There's other people still buying, probably more than they need to and using it more often than they need to anyways.

Cristina: People are probably buying bulk cans, camp foods, and all that other survival list things.

Jack: Yep.

Cristina: You know, like, you're never gonna need it, but it's gonna get old.

Jack: It's gonna get old eventually.

Cristina: Eventually you're gonna end up eating it. That sucks.

Jack: On the flip side, look old. Better than not.

Cristina: Yes. Is it? We won't get you sick if it's old. Like how old?

Jack: I don't know. I have an idea.

Cristina: Because I guess, I don't know. We'll see when they need it. I mean, maybe they're right and there is an apocalypse outside right now.

Jack: In the road, they would find cans.

Cristina: And still eat it.

Jack: And still eat it.

Cristina: Yeah, it's better than that. But how do you know that's realistic?

Jack: I don't know.

Cristina: I don't.

Jack: Also, if the road ever happened, I'd kill myself.

Cristina: Exactly. That's why that's not realistic.

Jack: Like who's gonna make it that far?

Cristina: Exactly.

Jack: Intentionally, like I wanna. For what? Just f****** die, bro.

Cristina: Yeah, that story's not realistic.

Jack: No. Everybody would just kill themselves.

Cristina: Exactly. There's no point. There's nothing left. There's nothing. You just die a slow long death.

Jack: Yeah. You're just playing a game of who's the last man standing.

Cristina: For what?

Jack: For no reason. Just to be. And you can't really tell if there's somebody else lasting longer.

Cristina: Exactly. Like if you are the last person, then what? What's your reward? What do you get?

Jack: You know what's funny? Never think about this, but in reality there's probably a couple of billionaires that really did stockpile enough and have like some facilities on the ground or s*** that they could still survive off of until they actually die of old age. But we don't see those people because we're just a normal guy's life after the apocalypse.

Cristina: Yeah, but that's probably like a real thing. Yeah, yeah.

Jack: It's probably like mad people still alive. He's just not around them or doesn't know how to reach them.

Cristina: Yeah. Oh crap. People living underground. Yeah. Another conspiracy is that doctors have been silenced from letting people know that the COVID is fake.

Jack: That. That's a complicated one because we heard about that a couple of times in a couple of ways.

Cristina: But were those fake news?

Jack: I don't know. Because there were doctors themselves that said they fired me for trying to put real information.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And it happened a lot. There are 30, 40 doctors fired for like not willing to forge paperwork that said it was worse than it was. In some cases they got fired for not forging paperwork that said it wasn't as bad.

Cristina: It's hard to say. Yes, that's. Yes. But there's also crazy doctors who are like, there was that crazy one. I don't know how many doctors said this, but there was one specific that I remember that said that the mask wearing mask was bad for you. And was actually activating the covalent in you by wearing the mask.

Jack: I don't see how that would make sense.

Cristina: That was a real doctor, though. I guess so. I don't know if you could trust every doctor.

Jack: I mean, there's crazy people everywhere.

Cristina: Yes. So some doctors I like. How do you tell which one is like the crazy one or the one that's being honest about, like, hey, this. This strange thing is happening and I don't know what to do, so I'm sharing this.

Jack: I don't know, man. I don't know. It's real f***** up. Through a f***.

Cristina: So just to remind you of that.

Jack: Both sides of that. God, what is wrong with the world right now? Because everything is coming out in pairs. That's the problem. It's. Everything is so divided.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: We get both arguments at the same time. Right. So we get it's not as bad. And I tried to tell people it wasn't as bad and I got fired and they suppressed all the data that I put together. Yeah, it's way worse. And they don't want me to tell you it's way worse. And there were way more bodies and I tried to put together the data and they fired me because they didn't want me to tell anybody. It was worse. Yeah, it's like, how the f*** did both of these things happen?

Cristina: Yeah. It's different countries, though. Like, I know the way worse ones, or I think they were from like China and Russia where two of them that were like, it's way worse than what they're saying.

Jack: But then in America turned out it wasn't China. Turned out it wasn't. That was United States lying about China.

Cristina: Oh, my God.

Jack: That was us bullshitting. Oh, that one turned out that it was a hundred percent the US Making crap up.

Cristina: Okay, but what about the Russia one? Was it Russia or German or one of those countries over there?

Jack: Russia's hitting it hard right now.

Cristina: Oh, okay. But they. They're lying about how hard.

Jack: Yeah, they're pretending it's not even happening.

Cristina: Yeah. Oh, okay. So that. Yeah, yeah. And then here it's like we're same s***.

Jack: We're pretending it's not even happening. We're over it.

Cristina: Yeah, but there was a time that we were like, it's much higher than yes.

Jack: And now we swung the other way and no, it's nowhere near as bad. Yeah, we started at there's nothing happening. Then we swung to world is ending. And now we're swinging back to, no, there's nothing out there.

Cristina: Yeah, it's very confusing. We live in very confusing times. And the final one is that the coronavirus is made by the New World Order or something. I mean, I guess, like, whatever. The main bad guys of this story. Whoever it is.

Jack: Yeah, whoever. The shady shadows that run everything or whatever. Like cronies. Yeah, Satan's croony. People who just do his bidding or whatever. F***.

Cristina: And work in the government.

Jack: And religion.

Cristina: And religion. And celebrities. For some reason.

Jack: Deep State or whatever.

Cristina: Yes, Yep. Yeah, all that stuff.

Jack: I mean, because politics is Deep State. Then we got the Freemasons, which are religion. And then we have the Illuminati that are celebrities.

Cristina: Yeah. Well, all these parties are working together to make the COVID disclaimer.

Jack: The Illuminati is not involved. We take no charge and pick no signs.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: We have nothing to do with any of this.

Cristina: We have nothing to do with any of this.

Jack: Anyways.

Cristina: Anyways.

Jack: We are running out of time.

Cristina: That was great.

Jack: It's just depressing.

Cristina: It's depressing. As much fake news as there been about what? Why Covid? There's been. I mean, as much conspiracies as there are for Covid, there are also for the vaccine itself. And also before the vaccine was made, there was also a bunch of fake news about what you can take because there's no vaccine. Like bleach, like crazy stuff like that.

Jack: Which people actually drank as f****** morons.

Cristina: Yes, yes. So I understand why the scientists are worried about fake news.

Jack: Because it's dangerous for people who are too stupid, which are a lot of people. The problem is scientists are also promoting bullshit.

Cristina: Exactly.

Jack: Everybody's lying. And if you pick the side, you fell for a lie.

Cristina: That's the biggest problem, though. Everyone's lying. And even if someone is telling the truth, there's just. You're getting every side of the story and it's just too much. You can't see what's the real thing. Yeah, it's ridiculous.

Jack: That's the way the state of the freaking world, man.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Anyways, if you guys want other episodes of this nature. If you enjoyed this conversation.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: We have actually several episodes about coronavirus conspiracies and things with that.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Is there more than one of those?

Cristina: I feel like there's at least two coronavirus conspiracies. I know of how it started. I remember one about toilet paper.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: And one about 5G.

Jack: Yeah. And there's like other stuff like apocalypse scenarios and junk like that, so you can find episodes.

Cristina: We also talked about aliens. I mean, aliens. We also talked about Artificial intelligence recently in one of your episodes about the dangers.

Jack: Yes. As a way to end the world as well. That's also something. Wow. Yeah, there's a lot of pot. We talked about the apocalypse a lot. I like that. I like that. We speculate the ending of the world. Anyways, you can find all that crap on greythoughts.info on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or anywhere you get your podcasts.

Cristina: And you can reach us on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and TikTok. UsConvopod.

Jack: Yes. And remember to subscribe and raid. And please review the show and tell other people to do that too.

Cristina: And let someone who might like this show know about it.

Jack: Yes. Word of mouth. The most overpowered thing in the world. And the last thing you want is to not get the chance to tell somebody to listen to this show before the world ends. Let them know you love them and that you want to share an episode of this loving, caring, uniting podcast in.

Cristina: Case the world hasn't already ended. If it has ended, then too bad.

Jack: Yeah. You're already on the other side.

Cristina: If it hasn't, then you have 100 seconds.

Jack: Yeah. So go ahead. And it's about the amount of time that one episode takes, right?

Cristina: 100 seconds.

Jack: Yeah. It's a little more.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: No, it could be 100 minutes.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Look, you. You will get a couple of minutes into a minute and a half. Minute and a little less. A little more than half. Right. Minute and forty seconds.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: You can hear us, like, introduce the show.

Cristina: Almost. Almost.

Jack: Fair enough.

Cristina: This has been the Just Conversation podcast. Take nothing personal and thanks for listening. Bye. Then there's Saint Lydwina, who is the saint for ice skaters. At 15, she fell while ice skating and fractured her ribs. She was left disabled for the rest of her life, and now she's the saint of ice skaters.

Jack: So her lack of achievements in ice skating because of simple mistakes that led to tragic, violent and debilitating accidents resulted in a terrible skater becoming the saint of skaters.

Cristina: To make sure no other skater goes through that.

Jack: Is she the saint of the fear of ice skating?

Cristina: I don't know. I just know she's the saint of ice skaters. Maybe the fear of ice skating as well. Who knows?

Jack: Ledwina with Lidwina, the girl who couldn't skate?

Cristina: Yes. That's what she's known for.

Jack: And then you pray to her and she helps you skate without her knowing.

Cristina: Yes. Good morning. Good morning. The Just Conversation podcast is hosted by Christina Collazo and Jack Thomas, produced by Lynn Taylor and published by greatthoughts.in fox art by 0lupo and logo by Seth McAllister. With social media managed by Amber Black.

Rambling 116: Bloodsuckers

Just Conversation, BLood Sucker, Horror, Vampire, Chupacabra, Alien, Ghost, Demon, Witch, Catholic

Are all blood sucking creatures shapeshifters or is there a more sinister hidden agenda by a large global organization at play? Unpacking Bloodsuckers and their possible origins.

Continuing their investigations into shapeshifters, Cristina befriends and bribes one of them by offering the lives of several Sub-Humans in exchange for information on others of its kind. Once the beans get spilled, the secrets revealed become greater than either of our two heroes could have ever anticipated. Find out what secrets were revealed and who is behind the creation of all these creature on this episode of Just Conversation.

+Episode Details

Topics Discussed

  • The Catholic Church
  • Bloodsuckers
  • Shapeshifters
  • The Boogeyman
  • El Cuco
  • Monster Creation
  • Witches

Our Links:

Official Website - https://greythoughts.info/podcast

Twitter - https://twitter.com/JustConvoPod

Facebook - https://facebook.com/justconvopod

Instagram - https://instagram.com/justconvopod


+Transcript

Cristina: This program contains strong themes meant for a mature audience. Discretion is advised.

Jack: Going live in 5, 4.

Cristina: What does live mean?

Cristina: Welcome to Just Conversation, the show where we ground humanity's most absurd and baffling ideas in childish ways. I'm your host, Christina.

Jack: And I'm Jack.

Cristina: And if you haven't yet, remember to hit that subscribe button to. To get notified the second new episodes are released.

Jack: Yes. And also, this show is most enjoyable with a listening partner, so be sure to grab somebody and force them to listen to the show with you. There is no options in their lives.

Cristina: I thought that was the last year's thing. I thought we were doing a new thing this year.

Jack: Changed my mind.

Cristina: What, so you're gonna force people to listen to our show again?

Jack: Yes. They only have to do it once.

Cristina: Every time?

Jack: No, Just once.

Cristina: Once?

Jack: Yeah. This is mainly for new listeners.

Cristina: But how? Wait, so the new listener is gonna get a friend?

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: That will also be a new listener?

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: How would the new listener know they have to pause the show? Like, I thought it was something that they already knew to do because they were already listening?

Jack: I don't know. No, they just. Look, they're listening to the show, then they go make somebody listen.

Cristina: But then they're not a new listener.

Jack: They were when they heard this.

Cristina: Yes. Okay. And then that's it. And then the next time they hear you say it, to do that, they don't do it because they already. Then they're not a new listener. Once they've accomplished it. Once.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Once it's done. Once you're good.

Cristina: Okay. Okay. But for the whole memory thing, that's.

Jack: Every episode, or is that once that happens every episode? I guess.

Cristina: Oh, my gosh. Okay, just checking. I've been busy doing some Illuminati stuff, man.

Jack: You've been busy doing some Illuminati stuff?

Cristina: I've been investigating bloodsuckers. Like, we were talking about vampires and werewolves. I had to go look for more that must be in this family of transforming creatures that don't really have a shape, but they, you know, like, they transform and they drink blood. That's the two things. Mainly, that relates where I'm hoping that relates to all these creatures together. So I was stalking them, which stalking is more like I became friends with them and sacrificed some of our employees to get to know these guys. And I want to talk about them. The first friend I made, his name, I'm going to call him Leap upon, because his name is in German, and I don't know how to say it, it's like off hocker. But we'll call him Leap upon because that's what it means. And they call him that because he leaps upon people like on their back and they rips their throat out.

Jack: This is a bloodsucker?

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Okay.

Cristina: Yes, yes. Well, he bites into their throat to drink their blood. So yeah, alright, so my friend Leapy doesn't have an actual form, or at least he doesn't let us see it. All we know is that he can shapeshift into animals and humans. He likes to tear the throats out of people. He likes beating into people's necks. That's his favorite spot.

Jack: For what?

Cristina: For blood, for power. I don't.

Jack: So he's not eating the neck, he's drinking the neck. Drinking the neck.

Cristina: That's what I'm assuming. They compare him to a vampire. So I assume that he's drinking blood from the vamp. From the person.

Jack: Yeah. But he doesn't identify as a vampire.

Cristina: No, no he doesn't. He can't be killed. And sunlight and church bells scare him like they do vampires. I don't know what, why they have that in common, but they do.

Jack: Spells scare vampires?

Cristina: Yes. In some stories.

Jack: I am unfamiliar with this.

Cristina: Yes. And the sunlight. You know about the sunlight? Yes, yes. Well, the. The leaper, Leapy is also afraid of sunlight. He likes to walk around abandoned roads in the dark of night, of course. And he likes to transform into dogs or saddle. Ladies. I wonder if he looks like a werewolf too. Like is that dog abnormally big?

Jack: The dog he turns into?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Is the dog humanoid? Should be the question.

Cristina: Humanoid? Is that like the werewolf?

Jack: Yeah, like a big two legged hand having human eyes. Human eyes? Wolf cross looking thing with one leg.

Cristina: Missing because it's pretending to be a tail.

Jack: Not while standing upright. That's when it's running?

Cristina: Yeah, yeah.

Jack: When it's just standing upright, it's revealed itself.

Cristina: Yeah. It's crazy because whoever it's attacking on this lonely road can't see it. So how do they know? I mean, I guess some people have gotten away from it. As long as you run to a church, you'll be safe, I think.

Jack: As long as you run to a church?

Cristina: Yeah. Like you cross the line of whatever is the holy church place and the abandoned road or whatever you're traveling on. If it's chasing you down, I think it jumps on your back and it pulls you down, like gets heavier and heavier on your back. And if you make it though, it can't cross so you live.

Jack: Do you have to Be running from it or can you. Like, if you're in a car, is it going to break into the car?

Cristina: Huh?

Jack: Like, what. What extent are we looking at here?

Cristina: Yeah, I think you. You have to be walking. Think he just got to be walking this road alone.

Jack: So he's not like unbelievably fast where he could catch you in a car.

Cristina: Yeah. I wonder if there's some motorcycle accidents because he jumped on. He tried to jump on their back or whatever during that. That'd be crazy.

Jack: Like he'd need some accuracy for that.

Cristina: Maybe he has the speed of a dog. How fast is that?

Jack: Not faster than a bike.

Cristina: Not faster than a bike. Oh, how about a regular bike?

Jack: Like a bicycle? Yeah, I think, I think a bicycle could outrun a dog.

Cristina: Oh, okay. Then you're safe. Unless you're.

Jack: You gotta be like really going in though, on the bicycle.

Cristina: Oh, what?

Jack: We're talking like fast, fast, like speed bike type s***.

Cristina: Yeah. But you won't know that it's chasing you until it's on your back. So.

Jack: Yeah, you wouldn't be driving like exuberantly quick.

Cristina: Yeah. So it'll get you. And then you're just gonna have this painful thing trying to suck the blood out of your neck until you cross to the church.

Jack: Seems s*****.

Cristina: Yeah. In Belgium, there's a hellhound that also does kind of the same thing. So it could be a different form of this creature, but they give it a different name because it's in a different place. So it could still be leapy hanging out over there, but they call him something else.

Jack: So you're telling me he himself is going to these places?

Cristina: Yeah. And he turns into a hellhound who stalks the roads and does the same thing over there that he does in Germany, which is ripping out people's necks. That's his favorite thing.

Jack: Like, what are the origins of this thing?

Cristina: I think vampires.

Jack: You think it's just a vampire origin. So he's basically like a legit shapeshifter.

Cristina: Yeah. Or like, I guess it's more to do with dead people than anything of what is happening with dead people. Are they really dead?

Jack: Are dead people really dead?

Cristina: Yeah, I think that's the fear of just, what if the dead person isn't really dead? And then all these stories come out of that.

Jack: Interesting. Interesting, yes.

Cristina: Other people describe it as a zombie or a type of vampire or werewolf. We already talked about vampire, but for the zombie werewolf thing, I guess for werewolf, because it could turn into the form of a werewolf, actually. So it does I don't know. I. Yes. But yeah, in Germany, it can also turn into a werewolf. In Germany, there's another being. I think it's the same creature, is a type of. This being. It's the name for. I think anyone. Dead people, ghosts, zombies, all those things. They're called Ones who Walks Again.

Jack: Ones who Walk Again, yes.

Cristina: That's how they refer to the zombies and the ghost stuff. And they usually come to. They believe the dead person returns to the world of the living, usually to cause problems and scare people and for revenge. A lot of it's revenge stuff.

Jack: So they're basically just like unfinished business type of ghosts.

Cristina: Yes. Yes. And they also might think that the. The. What is the Leaper dude is one of those things.

Jack: So now the question here is they think it's a human who died.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And then becomes a sort of an anomalous thing.

Cristina: Or this thing could take the form of that human who died.

Jack: Interesting.

Cristina: Because it is a shapeshifter and they don't really know what it really looks like.

Jack: Fallout vibes for days.

Cristina: Fallout vibes, yeah.

Jack: Replacing people with synths that are identical.

Cristina: Yes. So it could be that. Who knows?

Jack: Interesting. So it replaces the person, essentially.

Cristina: Yeah. In parts of Germany, they also think that the dead people have telepathic powers. In the grave, they gnaw on their own clothing and that somehow drinks the lifeblood of people that they know somehow. So it's a kind of vampirey thing. But they're not really sucking blood or anything.

Jack: I don't get why they're biting the clothing.

Cristina: Their own clothing. I don't know. Because that's the only thing they could shoe on. So they shoe on their own clothes while maybe thinking about that person, and then that person starts dying.

Jack: That's weird.

Cristina: Yeah. I don't know how that happened, but yeah.

Jack: Interesting, interesting.

Cristina: And they also think that these undead people can rise out of the grave and jump on the back of people like the. The Leaper dude.

Jack: What is up with the back jumping? There's not like other things. They got one trick, that's it. There's nothing else.

Cristina: Well, they got blue sucking too.

Jack: No, that does nothing. They just. When they attack people, they always hop on their back. That's it.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: The one move.

Cristina: Yeah. It's the most. Like, you never expect it unless you do, because you heard all these stories.

Jack: And then what you're facing it. Well, it's disarmed.

Cristina: But how are you gonna face it? They'll always find your back. You can't walk backwards. And then it will just pop up on your back.

Jack: You happen to turn around as it's about to leap, but it didn't yet. And then you see it there and it freezes and it's like, I've been caught.

Cristina: There's no way. How would you know? Unless it has, like, really loud footsteps, I guess.

Jack: No, you. By chance, you were walking away, and you're like, I forgot my keys, and you turn around to go back inside, and boom, it's right there.

Cristina: I think it could move quickly. I mean, it has werewolf. It could turn into a werewolf. It could run around you and then jump on your back.

Jack: If it's a werewolf, you're hearing it.

Cristina: Yes. I don't know. Maybe it's able to predict where your back is facing it.

Jack: So what you're telling me is this creature only exists behind us.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And so, like, if you were to turn around, it wouldn't be there because it's only existent behind you.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Where you're not facing is the only place it could be.

Cristina: Mm. Unless it's in the grave that you're looking.

Jack: You can see it in the grave?

Cristina: Yeah. If it's a dead person.

Jack: No, it's just a dead person.

Cristina: Well, if you believe that dead person is also leaping out of its grave to attack people's back.

Jack: It's not, though.

Cristina: There's some dead people who do it, too.

Jack: Who. They leap out of their grave onto people's back.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Is this, like. Is there experiences about this?

Cristina: Oh, I don't know any. I don't know any. I do. I have found other experiences for other creatures, just not this one. Oh. I do know, though, that besides just carrying them to the churchyard to get rid of them off your back, you could also get rid of him, the leaper dude, by praying or by a spell. I don't know what spells or prayers gets him off your back, but the leaper kid get off your back by.

Jack: I'm sure if you go ask a priest, he'll know.

Cristina: He knows about spells.

Jack: He did. Look, Catholics made this, too. Anytime you insert religion into it and you could pray something away, Catholics made it up.

Cristina: I mean, it goes away once you get to the church, too, so.

Jack: Yeah. There's many incentives.

Cristina: Find out that the Church makes these creatures.

Jack: Yeah. There's probably a lab at the basement of the Vatican or some crap.

Cristina: Yes. Where they're keeping Jesus.

Jack: Yeah. And they're just making these creatures all the time.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: What, if anything, at some point we should go, like, free Jesus or something.

Cristina: I don't know. What? What are they protecting him with? Probably with these creatures that they're making.

Jack: Fair enough. But we have the technology.

Cristina: Our superhuman versus their superhuman. Yeah, but an interesting war. You can do it then. There's a creature called the Night Waster. It's a very strange creature. It's recognized by it holding out the thumb of one hand in the other and walking around like that, only with its left eye open.

Jack: Why?

Cristina: Because it's a weirdo. I think it's also a dead person too. But you could recognize it by. Because he's holding his thumb and what is it? His left eye is open while he's holding his one thumb in the other hand. Or something like that. He has the ability to kill family members through magic. And while in his grave he's like the cloth thing. He's a person in the grave sucking his clothes. But this one, after it eats its own clothes, it starts feeding on its own flesh. Gross. Gross. But at least it will be easy to find the one that's this creature killing your family or a person killing your family. I'm not sure if it's a creature or a person that you know. Or both. I guess your dead relative became a creature.

Jack: None of it feels like they're creatures. They.

Cristina: They just feel like dead people just sound like zombies. Like zombies. Maybe they're all zombies. But they could transform.

Jack: So that doesn't sound like any of them have transformed in these examples.

Cristina: What? The leaper dude transforms into werewolves.

Jack: Fair enough. He transforms. This other guy is just a gu. He seems like a guy. He seems like he's just a guy.

Cristina: Actually this one is just a guy. I don't know how he got here, but he's just a guy. That I thought was interesting. Alright. I made a lot of friends with shape shifting bloodsuckers and he happened to not be one. But he does suck blood. Or I guess not really because he's sucking the soul out of his family members and eating himself and eating himself.

Jack: Good times.

Cristina: And it also feeds off the. Off the bodies of other corpses. Because that's cool, I guess.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: And he also mates with women who are dead from childbirth. I don't understand mating. Like he's having children with these dead women. I guess he sounds like a creature, doesn't he? Or he's still a zombie now.

Jack: I mean, as soon as he starts mating, that goes out the window. The fact that he could mate is way off. Yeah, like that doesn't make sense at all.

Cristina: Yeah. So while he's eating his own clothes and his Own flesh. His family members are becoming are dying off, getting. Losing their life. And it's getting stronger. And then he becomes a wing dingo. Was it the Win Dingle? One of them. Those creatures that were like, you need to be strong and then you become that thing.

Jack: You're telling me the goal of this creature is to make a family get an in. Home gym workout daily until he gets shredded. And once he's shredded, he can transcend into Windingo.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: I think it was the West Shooge.

Cristina: The West Shoosh. Yeah, it's the West Shooch. It was the Westchooge. And it's possible to find this dude by the sound of sucking it makes. Because it has the thumb, I guess. Also. No, I guess that's sucking of its own clothes. Yeah. So if you hear sucking in the graveyard, it's probably the night wasps waster.

Jack: Or necrophilic b******.

Cristina: Or that. Oh, my gosh. It could be that with his dead wife.

Jack: Oh, it could just be some random straggler made it into the graveyard, dug up a recently dead body and blew him.

Cristina: Wow. And then that's how these stories were made.

Jack: Yep.

Cristina: I don't. You do not have to be bitten to become one of the night wasters. If a child was born with part of that sack thingy on his head, then you just have to feed him the sack thingy so he doesn't have to become the creature after he dies. I don't know what the sack is called. The water sack.

Jack: What?

Cristina: The thing that the baby's born with.

Jack: The placenta.

Cristina: Is it the placenta? Maybe there's a sack that's with the baby when it's growing. Okay. There's some. Some things you can do to get rid of the night waster, which is placing a chunk of earth under his chin.

Jack: Right. How would you get to him to do that?

Cristina: From hearing the sucking sound. You heard the sucking sound? You follow the sucking sound to the grave where the guy Follow the sucking.

Jack: Sound to the guy who's gonna try to kill you.

Cristina: He's dead. Or he's pretending to be asleep with his one eye open and his thumb in his hand or whatever. And you throw dirt in his. Under his chin. Or maybe you do this to every person that dies to avoid. To avoid the transformation. Yeah.

Jack: Yeah. That makes a lot more sense.

Cristina: Okay. Placing a coin or stone in their mouth also. So I guess that will stop them from chewing with a coin or stone in their mouth. Tying a handkerchief around their neck. We're placing nets and stockings inside the Grave nuts. Nuts.

Jack: Nets like tree nuts.

Cristina: Nets.

Jack: Nets. What?

Cristina: Nets like fishing nets.

Jack: Got you. And that just tangles him up and then he's screwed.

Cristina: I guess so. And the extreme ways to get rid of him is getting rid of his head, of course.

Jack: That sounds pretty familiar. That's all. The bloodsuckers have that problem going on.

Cristina: Yes. Even though he's not really a bloodsucker, but you know, whatever, he's drinking life. So I guess he counts. He's sucking on something and that's the important part. Right.

Jack: Is he a shapeshifter?

Cristina: No, he's just a dead dude. He's a zombie. You could also drive a steak in its mouth and you could fix the tongue so it won't move around. Okay, those are the extremes. But back to shape shifting creatures. There's a guy called the Chanchan. He's a sorcerer from Chile or Argentina. And he transforms into a bird. And the birds are called Shon. Shon. And he turns himself into a bird by using a magical cream on his throat that removes his head and then the head becomes the creature.

Jack: Amazing.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: I would like to know how he doesn't bleed out.

Cristina: The cream is magical.

Jack: Right?

Cristina: The magic of the cream is like, I guess, not letting his body bleed out.

Jack: Like with his head out, would we be able to see into his body?

Cristina: I imagine. No. I imagine the cream is just like covering that whole thing up. And you only see cream?

Jack: You only see cream?

Cristina: Yes. And this creature has the shape, of course, a human head with feathers and claws. Its ears become extremely large to be used as wings. Like a bird. Like a really strange, really horrifying bird.

Jack: Yes, it sounds pretty bad.

Cristina: It's a human head with feathers, claws and wings. Okay, but. Yes, but these are sorcerers. These are real people who are just deciding, I'm gonna become this thing. They do it for evil because these are evil sorcerers. Of course. It gives them the ability to drink blood from the ill and sleeping people. And I think that gives them more power. They do that for more power.

Jack: Interesting that. Only from people who are sleeping or dead. Ill. Ill people who are ill or sleeping. Fair. Yeah, that's interesting. Very vampiric, very Dracula esque. Sneak into your bed while you're knocked the f*** out, prey on you. You don't even know what happened until the morning when you just got two dots on you.

Cristina: Yeah. It's strange because it should be invisible. So I don't know how they know that it looks like a bird, but I'm guessing they found dead versions of It. And that's how they know, because it's invisible. And the only way you can tell that it's near is because it makes a cry. Toot, toot, too. If you hear that, run. No, it makes a weird sound and it's supposed to predict death of a loved one. So maybe it's hunting someone near you and that's why you hear it and then you know, oh, no, I had to watch out for my ill or sleeping lover.

Jack: That's weird, because if you hear it, there's no way you know what it is because you've never seen it. So, no. That's what you're hearing?

Cristina: Yes. You know something bad's gonna happen. I guess you at least know that much.

Jack: Do you, though? Is it more like, what the f*** was that?

Cristina: Maybe. But there's people who have caught it. There's people who have caught it somehow.

Jack: So they got proof this thing exists?

Cristina: Yes, of course. Maybe. So in order to repel this thing, there are some things you can do, which is draw the Solomon seal on the ground, laying out a waistcoat in a specific manner and reciting certain phrases or hymns. Is that religious? This is like a religious ceremony you gotta do. And then it will be repelled by you. It will force the Shunshun to leave or to fall to the ground, where it could be destroyed. Which I guess is the goal. To destroy it. Right. Unless you just want to abandon it. If you just abandoned it, it will come for revenge, though. So I would say destroy it.

Jack: It'll hunt you down if you ignore it.

Cristina: Yes. Actually, if you kill it, its friends might hunt you down. So that's a toughie. If the headless body of the sorceress is found, turning it onto its stomach prevents the Shunshun to return to it. I don't know why, but, Yes, if you put the body. Yeah, if you. I wonder how the body's laying. Is it standing or sitting? But if you place it on its stomach, the head can't go back. I don't know why. I feel like it just needs to, like, fight the right spot. Like, unless you're covering the neck somehow by laying it on its stomach. I don't know. My imagination is not very well because I can't see what's stopping the bird from going back to the neck of a person whose stomach is on the ground.

Jack: The cream is in the way.

Cristina: The cream is in the way?

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Of what?

Jack: The one that made his head come off.

Cristina: The cream is in the way. No. I don't understand.

Jack: No, Isn't the cream covering the whole thing?

Cristina: Yes, well, of the neck. That's all I know.

Jack: Right.

Cristina: The cream is in the way of the bird.

Jack: The bird is the head.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: So you're telling me the bird isn't covered in cream so I can look up and just see into the skull maybe?

Cristina: No, but I'm trying to imagine. Okay, The. The Be. The. The neck is still out while you're laying down, whether your stomach is.

Jack: But the cream is in the way.

Cristina: Do you understand? What are you talking about?

Jack: You said the cream blocks the whole area so that we can't see into the body from the top.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And the same applies to the head, theoretically.

Cristina: So the cream is in the way. And that's why laying the body on its stomach stops the bird in any position.

Jack: That bird can't come back because the cream is in the way.

Cristina: Oh, in any position. Then what's the point? Okay, whatever.

Jack: To become a permanent bird.

Cristina: Nah. You could also yell at it, come back tomorrow for more for some salt. And then the next day he'll come to you in its human form to ask for salt. And then you'll know he's the bird.

Jack: He's not really a sorcerer at that point, is he? He's really like some kind of dude stuck in a pattern.

Cristina: It sounds like a vampire counting those rice.

Jack: No, it doesn't. It sounds like you staged some, like, setup and he, like, has to participate.

Cristina: Like the vampire counting. Like he has to participate in the counting of things, I guess. Well, one time there was a case where someone did. Ground one of the birds from using while he. He did the Solomon seal thing, that. That weird chant thing. And it caused the large bird to fall out of the sky. And they. They fed the bird to the dog. And then the belly of the dog grew into the shape of a face. And that's how they knew. And then later the local grave digger said some unknown people came to bury a headless body.

Jack: Interesting.

Cristina: So it's out there. But I think I would just ask it to come back tomorrow for some salt.

Jack: And then put it in a cage.

Cristina: And then put it in a cage. Well, then his friends will come. I don't know.

Jack: Put them in a cage.

Cristina: Put them in a cage. Okay. That's huge.

Jack: Open a bird sorcerer zoo.

Cristina: Yes. See if I can learn some of their magic. Like, they have to have more magic, right?

Jack: Yep.

Cristina: Can't just be about drinking blood.

Jack: You keep promising to let them go if they teach you magic.

Cristina: Yes. Then there's Coco, who's a shapeshifter too. That's unknown, but like, whatever. The original form is unknown, but it could. There's so many stories of what it looks like. A dragon, werewolf, ghost with a skull like pumpkin head. A ghost monster. It's a ghost monster. That's what I think it is. Okay.

Jack: Why?

Cristina: I don't know. The way they describe it is very. They compare it to the Boogeyman because they scare their children with the Coco. What a name, Coco. It doesn't sound very scary, but this Coco creature lives in many, many countries, Hispanic countries, in Spain, Portugal.

Jack: Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Is it Coco for a fact? It's not Cuco.

Cristina: Oh, Cuco. It could be Cuco. I don't know. It's spelled Coco, but I think it's said in. It could have had many different spellings. Oh, El Cuco? Is that what you're talking about?

Jack: El Cuco? Yeah.

Cristina: Yes. Cuco.

Jack: Ok. As well as El Cucuy.

Cristina: El Cucuy. Yes. So you heard of this because it's the Spanish creature.

Jack: It's the literal Spanish translation of the boogeyman.

Cristina: The boogeyman. That's what I said. Okay, the boogeyman. Yes. But have you, like, when you heard about it, what did he sound like? How was he described to you?

Jack: He's basically Slenderman.

Cristina: Slenderman? Ooh.

Jack: Yeah. He's some sort of shadowy figure, a horror you could not describe. He is always in dark places. He shows up when you least suspect, usually when you're by yourself. Yeah, Basic boogeyman things. He'll s***** you up.

Cristina: Yeah. He likes to take the shapes of shadows, dark shadows. To kidnap children, specifically. Does he eat those children?

Jack: Basically hiding in the closet or under the bed?

Cristina: Oh, yeah, but. And yeah, the thing about this thing, I don't know if he sucks the blood out of the children, but he definitely eats those children. He kidnaps them and eats them. That's believable if they're bad. I think that's what the parents say. If you're. If you're bad, the cook Coco will get you. The Coco.

Jack: Yeah. The boogeyman's gonna get you.

Cristina: Yeah. The biggie, man. Yeah. So you have to be good and he won't get you. So he's a child eater and a kidnapper. It's said to be out on it. Hangs out on rooftops, looking out for misbehaving children. Like Santa Claus.

Jack: I feel like a lot of people work with Santa.

Cristina: Yeah. Sometimes. It's also described as a hairy monster that it's because it's in so many. It's weird that it's the same creature, but because it's in so many different countries, all Spanish countries, it maybe. It takes forms of different things in each country.

Jack: It is a shapeshifter, so it's regional, like that's expected.

Cristina: Yeah. One origin story of the cuco that I found, it might not be the real origin story. Like, there's probably no origin story for this guy. But one of them was that a man was sick with tuberculosis. He was looking for a cure, so he looked for a healer, and she told him the cure was drinking the blood of children and rubbing their fat on his chest. Then he started kidnapping kids and drinking their blood. So there you go. He is a blood drinker.

Jack: So if this story was real, he'd be the first person to test out adrenochrome.

Cristina: Yes, yes, yes.

Jack: And it turned him into some sort of freak of nature.

Cristina: Yeah. He walks up and down streets with a black bag looking for children. And that's. That's all I know about him. You know more about him than I do, but I guess you only know one version of him because there's so many different versions of him. But he looks like Slenderman in yours.

Jack: All the versions are more or less the same thing. They're pretty closely related.

Cristina: But you don't know what he did with those children.

Jack: I have no idea.

Cristina: Yeah, well, I'm saying he's a bloodsucker. Then there's the La Ga, who is a cousin to the French and Germanic werewolf. It's a shapeshifter from Trinidad. And Tro Bago Lagahoo. Laga who?

Jack: Interesting. And it looks like a wolf or some s***.

Cristina: No, I wish. I wish he did. But by day he's a normal man, but by night he is headless and he roams the night with a wooden coffin on its neck. And he also has chains around his neck which change sizes. And, like, one of his appendages is turned backwards, which is very. Werewolf. Maybe an arm or a leg is backward for some reason, I don't think, to hide a tail or anything. Maybe he's like a retarded werewolf.

Jack: This is actually really interesting. I've heard about something similar to that, and it's. You can actually. I think there was a movie with one of these in there.

Cristina: Really?

Jack: I think it was the 13th ghost that. There was the Jackal. It was a ghost with, like, a coffin on its head, essentially. And it's all contorted. It's the one that walks all weird and s***.

Cristina: It Was probably based on this guy.

Jack: Could definitely be interesting.

Cristina: But he could also shape shift into various animals, including horses, pigs, and goats and centaurs Or a creature that's similar to a centaur.

Jack: So pretty much anything, it seems.

Cristina: Yeah. And he's a blood sucker, but he doesn't suck the blood out of humans, which I guess is a good thing because he is horrifying. Description of him is just. I wouldn't want to see that. I really wouldn't. But he likes cows and goats.

Jack: That's cool. He's the good guy.

Cristina: He's like the Chupacabra, more or less.

Jack: Yeah. The Chupacabra isn't out there eating people.

Cristina: Yeah. But if he's eating your farm animals, you might want to kill him.

Jack: Why don't you just raise a couple of farm animals for him?

Cristina: That's cool too.

Jack: Try to get him to out his people and create a community where they protect your farm and in return, you feed them. You feed them.

Cristina: That's awesome. Yes, let's do that. But if you do want to kill him, you can beat him with a stick that has been anointed with holy water and holy oil for nine days. To kill the creature, you have to beat him with a stick that's been in holy water for nine days. That's very church related, man.

Jack: They're all church. The Catholic church designs monsters.

Cristina: Yes. And while you're beating it, it changes into other creatures like a dog, a horse, cat, pig. It even changes into a thunderous waves of water and finally disappears into a black mist. And then you dead. Then it's dead. It's very interesting. Transformations. I feel like we heard a ghost story of. Was it transformations or it was just things crossing the road after the other and it was just different.

Jack: Yeah, it was a ghost story.

Cristina: Yeah. Okay.

Jack: It was like a guy crossed the road chased by a ghost or something. An old man? No, he was just a chicken or some s***, right?

Cristina: Yeah, chicken and a dog and a cat. I don't know. It was a child story. I don't know what was happening. But yes, this creature has that same type of thing going on.

Jack: But it was a Clinton road story, I believe. No, it was a different road.

Cristina: Different road. It was a different road. Yeah. Then there's this other thing. We'll call him one foot. Well, actually, his name, I guess if you translate it, is one foot in Spanish. Pata sola. Pata sola.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Well, that's a South American monster. She lives in the jungle. She appears to men in the middle of the wildness. And she lures them into the jungle to eat them. To reveal her true form. We know her true form at least. Like she looks like a woman but she's really a one legged creature with vampire like lust for human flesh and blood. And she attacks them and devours their flesh and sucks the blood out of her victims. Very vampire.

Jack: She's like a succubus.

Cristina: Yes, but she's.

Jack: Or a siren.

Cristina: A siren.

Jack: The mermaid.

Cristina: Oh, mermaid. But she's not in the water.

Jack: Yeah, it's an out of water mermaid.

Cristina: Yeah. Do they drink blood? Oh man.

Jack: Mermaids. Kind of. Yeah.

Cristina: Succubus. No, not succubus. What was the other one?

Jack: Sirens.

Cristina: Sirens.

Jack: Sirens, Succubus, Incubus and mermaids.

Cristina: All half of those things are ghosts.

Jack: Ghosts?

Cristina: Yeah. Incubus and succubus are ghost creatures.

Jack: Those aren't ghosts.

Cristina: They. I thought they were.

Jack: No, those are monsters.

Cristina: Those are monsters. I thought those were ghosts.

Jack: I thought they were monsters.

Cristina: Really? Because I. Well from ghost shows there have been men who've been haunted by succubus.

Jack: Was it the ghost adventure guys?

Cristina: No, no, it was just people telling their ghost stories of the haunted house that they lived in or whatever.

Jack: Oh my God.

Cristina: And the way that these creatures are described are like ghosts, but stronger I guess. Stronger?

Jack: No, best case scenario, it's a demon.

Cristina: Oh yeah, like a demon. But I guess in a way it looks like a ghost because it looks like nothing. Because you can't say you see a ghost.

Jack: No, these things are visible.

Cristina: These things are visible.

Jack: You, a succubus, an incubus. Mermaid and a siren are physical things you see.

Cristina: Okay. But they're not physically in your house. Like their physical bodies hiding in your house.

Jack: Yeah, yeah, that's how it goes. In fact. Specifically for the mermaid and the siren.

Cristina: Well yes, I know those two.

Jack: A group of people see them.

Cristina: Yeah, yeah. Those are more monster like.

Jack: Right.

Cristina: While the other two I thought were more ghost. Like which. Their bodies aren't really physical.

Jack: No, I think their body. Look it up. I think their bodies are physical. Now google succubus to confirm.

Cristina: On the opposite end it says succubus here too. Female counterpart succubus.

Jack: Okay, so it's a demon, it's a.

Cristina: Physical thing, but it's not. I mean like yes, but no, because like you wake up and then it's not there, you know?

Jack: Right. It goes like this. You're at a bar, you see really hot chick. The boys also see the really hot chick. You and the boys Are like, yo, I'm gonna go flirt with that girl. Get her a drink and everything.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And you do. And you take her home and you do whatever. Except at some point you black out. You wake up, she's gone. Everybody saw her. She wasn't not there. She was physical and frightened.

Cristina: And for that guy that, that happened to, she wasn't there. She was there, but then she disappears. Like a ghost. He didn't pick her up anywhere. She was just living in his house.

Jack: He was probably dealing with some other s*** that wasn't an succubus.

Cristina: I don't know. I think they're more complicated.

Jack: It's a demon.

Cristina: Yeah. Demons could have ghostly bodies, can't they? I don't know.

Jack: I don't know.

Cristina: Like they don't physically or. They don't have to physically be in your house, do they? I don't know. Whatever. Yes. Okay, let's continue. That'll be for another episode, maybe. Who knows? Then there's the Striga, who is a vampire witch that sucks blood of infants at night while they're sleeping. And then they. They like to turn into insects to go in, to sneak into the house of the child. And to protect yourself from the shriga, you have to make a cross out of pig bone and place it at the entrance of a church on Easter Sunday so that the sugar cannot leave. But I guess you're somehow supposed to know that it's in there. What's it doing in the church? Hmm? Entrance in the church. I guess it lives in your church. Then they could be captured and killed like any other thing. But also to protect yourself from this creature, you could put a silver coin in the blood that it drank from and wrap it in clothing. And then that it protects you from the creature. Once you wrap it up, you could wear as jewelry to protect yourself from the creature.

Jack: That's a really cool way to make an amulet.

Cristina: Yes, from blood.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: I wonder if the blood stays soaked on the coin or something. Like it's magical blood now.

Jack: I mean, you wrapped it.

Cristina: You wrapped it. Yeah. Yeah. So in the legends, only the witch could cure those. She drained their blood. And if she doesn't? Oh, the way she cures people that she's bitten is by spitting in their mouth. And if she doesn't do that, they'll just get sick and die. And these witches aren't born, but they become one. Because either she is childless or is made evil by envy. And a strong belief in God could make people immune to the witch. He could protect them.

Jack: Sounds Very. How do I put it? Consistent.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Yeah, yeah, very consistent. You believe in God, you pray, you go to church. All these monsters will f*** off.

Cristina: Mm. There's something going on there.

Jack: Yeah, always. They're responsible for all the creatures. Or they got packs with all these creatures.

Cristina: They got packs. They're making these creatures.

Jack: Maybe they are the creatures.

Cristina: Maybe they are the creatures. Like the song. Those sorcerers that become birds. Maybe they're becoming all these other things. We don't know that. Then there's this bloodsuckerer in Mexico. It's like a vampire or a witch that lives with its human family. And they have to keep his secret because if it dies, someone else in the family, I think, turns into this vampire witch creature. They can change form by detaching their bodies from their legs, which they leave in the house. So strange. I think the transformation is of a goat. He needs to feed off of blood once a month or he'll die. And he wants to suck the blood of babies at night. Sucks the blood of babies.

Jack: That's actually the closest one to a vampire I've heard so far. Where not drinking blood will kill it.

Cristina: Yeah. Well, most of these creatures are female, and so I'll say she. She's born with the curse and can't avoid being this vampire creature because it's in the. I guess, the family line, which we were talking about. What if we went to a country and tried these things? What would we become? So what if we did have the blood of a werewolf and that's how we become a werewolf? We don't know that. Like, a bite helps speed up the process of becoming the thing we already had in us.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Maybe it's just easier for these vampire creatures to do it. And the victims that were killed by these creatures have bruises on their upper body. And they hunt mostly in cold and rainy weather. I don't know why specific weather, but they got rules. Maybe they're like vampires. They sound. You said like vampires, so it makes sense.

Jack: Yeah, they might just be avoiding daylight.

Cristina: Yeah, because they hunt at night too. So night, cold, and rainy weather. They fly from village to village as a turkey.

Jack: Best transformation while the vampire is over here being douchey. I'm a bat, bro. Look how cool this m*********** is. Like, I'm a gorgeous turkey.

Cristina: That's not my only bright color. That's a pretty cool one. But there's even a cooler one. It can fly as a flying fireball. A fireball?

Jack: That's pretty hardcore. I would never use the turkey form.

Cristina: You Never use the turkey form.

Jack: I will be a fireball forever. Because everybody just thinks it's a shooting star or a meteor or some s***.

Cristina: But also it likes to be a donkey. So it could scout out the victims. I guess that's the best form it takes. The donkey. You don't want to be a donkey.

Jack: Just blend into plain sight.

Cristina: Yeah. That's very sneaky. But you could tell that the animal is this creature because it has a.

Jack: Glowing aura making everything we've just discussed useless.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: A glowing turkey. That's some sort of monster.

Cristina: Yeah. And it smells like blood mad.

Jack: Impractical.

Cristina: Yes. Like, we talked also about that. Some. They're trying their best to take the shape of the forms. But some of them might not be as good as others.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: So maybe these are like, they're almost there. Just a few more tries and they'll get it. They got it. They almost got it. Like, maybe being in the bloodline helps them get better at this thing of shape shifting or whatever is happening.

Jack: But it sounds like these creatures aren't even related to the other creatures we discussed. Like these seem like whole other things. Dead people and s*** like that. Like zombies. They don't even sound like. Some of these people aren't even like fast or anything. They're just like zombies.

Cristina: They're like zombies that. But they could transform. That's the important thing.

Jack: One of them couldn't.

Cristina: Except for one of them. Yeah. He snuck in.

Jack: Interesting. They could all transform. But can they all transform to anything? Or a lot of them bound to one form. Are these their famous forms?

Cristina: I think these are their famous forms. Like the cuckoo. The coco cuckoo. The cuckoo. He doesn't have any. Like, he has so many forms. One of them was a dragon. For some reason there was like he could do whatever. Except for. For some reason it's kind of wild. What he could become. Hairy monster.

Jack: Yeah. That's pretty cool though. So they are just definitely shapeshifters at the end of the day.

Cristina: Yeah. And the first one we talked about. He turns into a werewolf. But he could also just turn into a lady. He could be sneaky if he wants to. He just feels like. I guess being a werewolf is just easier because you can run after the person.

Jack: Yeah. It must also be funner.

Cristina: Yeah, it could be funner too. Because you can't kill that creature. So that creature doesn't have a weakness to death. Like there's nothing. It's not like the vampire that you can kill it in certain ways. That one. You can't @ all. So it's just having fun?

Jack: Yeah, it's just doing whatever the h*** it wants.

Cristina: Yeah. My leaper buddy. Oh, my gosh. This is gonna be suspicious, but to enter the house, it must fly over the roof and take the shape of a cross.

Jack: To enter a house?

Cristina: Yep. To enter a house, it must fly.

Jack: Over the roof as a cross.

Cristina: Take the shape of a cross. Like, fly around in a cross, like, shape.

Jack: Oh, s***.

Cristina: Like, it's doing that. Weird, man.

Jack: At this point, like, a bunch of Catholics got together. Like, Catholics are monsters. They're literal monsters. And the symbols and crap that they teach and the prayers and s***, it's all just to benefit them.

Cristina: They're making these monsters. These monsters are the same.

Jack: They're making them. They are the monsters. They're the people who found Jesus and captured him, knowing that he has a direct link with God, crippled him so that he couldn't move, and slowly siphon his power to turn themselves into these monsters that then wreak havoc on the world.

Cristina: Yes. This is happening. What are we gonna do?

Jack: We gotta tell the QAnon guys.

Cristina: Oh, they love this. Oh, my gosh. This is. Man. If you can tell Alex Jones is about this, I know he'd love this.

Jack: Alex Jones. I love that man.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: He's my everything.

Cristina: He's your everything. Okay. And then it sneaks into the house as a fly. And when it enters the room, the house, it becomes a mist to paralyze everyone. Sounds like a vampire does that, doesn't it? Or at least it has that ability of paralyzing people.

Jack: Turning into a gas. Yeah.

Cristina: On a gas. Okay.

Jack: Became a mist.

Cristina: A mist.

Jack: Yeah. That's very vampire.

Cristina: And then once inside, she turns back into a turkey and sucks the victim's blood.

Jack: How crazy of an experience is this? A weird cloud starts leaking, like it's gas. You think you're being gassed right now? You look at your door. Oh, my God. What's happening? Is there a fire outside?

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Mist starts coming in and, like, filling up. And you're like, oh, my God, are we gonna burn death? And then the mist just starts to gather, doesn't spread out anymore. And then it starts to solidify, and boom, out comes a turkey. It's like, what the f***?

Cristina: Yes. And then she goes to the baby and she has a needle like tongue. And the tongue starts just drinking the baby's blood. And you're watching this.

Jack: Yes. In shock.

Cristina: In shock. And you're like aliens.

Jack: Yeah. At that point.

Cristina: Okay, so there's some ways to protect yourself and your baby. From this creature. If you want, you could leave sharp objects under the crib like a knife, scissors, needles, pins. That seems really dangerous for the baby, too.

Jack: It's under the crib.

Cristina: It's under. Yeah, but what if the baby decides to get out of its crib and then starts playing with these things?

Jack: Maybe you've created a serial killer.

Cristina: Making a cross out of the safety pins on your garments will help. Putting a mirror, dirty shorts, or soiled diapers near the bed will help. Only onions and garlics can ward off attacks.

Jack: Very vampirey, Very vampiry. Also, you can, in theory, j*** in your underwear and then slap it on the crib, Be like, you're safe, baby.

Cristina: Yes. And you can wrap your baby in a tortilla and tuck them into blankets and clothing. Yep. Protect yourself with tortillas.

Jack: Really?

Cristina: Yes. What tortilla?

Jack: Wow. So, like, turning your child into a taco is safe?

Cristina: Yes. Turning your child into. I feel like that would make it more craving. Like, he'll want the baby more.

Jack: It would make it more craving towards a human who wants tacos.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: Not towards a bird who's usually inside the tacos.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: It's like, no, I understand the pain. I must free this baby.

Cristina: Let's free this baby. He's normally inside the taco. Oh, the turkey. Okay, so she has memories of what it's like to be a turkey being murdered.

Jack: No. She knows that this happens, and she sympathizes her people.

Cristina: Okay, so what's really killing these babies? There's been so many cases. There was, like, there was a doctor who went through these cases to find out what happened to these babies. There was, like, 40 babies dead, and the victims didn't lose any blood. But what killed them was no oxygen. Asphyxiation killed the babies. Yeah. Most of the babies probably died by accident. Probably, yeah, because the way they were laying on the baby might have killed the baby. And then, like, I guess after. What's it called? After heaters and stuff like that, Things to warm your home happened. These things stopped happening because it was mostly during winter time when it was super cold, and then you'd want to huddle with your baby, and then that would kill your baby. But once that kind of stuff was made, you could warm up your house. You don't have to be next to your baby or try to warm your baby with a bunch of blankets. And then the blankets kill the baby, and then no more babies dying.

Jack: Yeah. It seems like most creatures were created around the time that the catholic church could just say, Random s***. And people would eat it. And as well as when situations were so crappy that people didn't want to take blame for things that they were clearly doing or scared of. And us monsters.

Cristina: Yes. Also, people had to take it because they would kill them and say, you're a witch.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: And then burn you at the stakes.

Jack: Good old Catholic church ways.

Cristina: You had to take it. Yep. So I guess that's it for now. I hope you like these stories from my friend Leaper. Is that his name? Leapy. I think I named him Leapy, but I changed it to Leaper. So there you go.

Jack: And he told you about all these creatures. So he's basically a rat.

Cristina: Yes, because I fed him some of our employees.

Jack: Fair enough. Good trade off.

Cristina: Good trade off.

Jack: That's what the subhumans are here for.

Cristina: Yep.

Jack: They are willing. They just stand by and they're like, yes, sir.

Cristina: Yeah. They didn't care. They were happy.

Jack: They'll never care. They're just here to please us.

Cristina: Yep.

Jack: Those overpowered hyper intelligence, super physically peaked monster retards.

Cristina: Yes, but they're beautiful.

Jack: Flawlessly beautiful. They're immaculate.

Cristina: It's ridiculous.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: But they're brain dead.

Jack: Anyways, we are definitely out of time here, so we'll have to hear the rest of your friend's story some other time.

Cristina: Awesome.

Jack: Yes. But if you guys like conversations of this nature, if you like listening to us talk about creatures, there's many creature episodes. Go back and catch up on all the creature episodes. Creatures of all types, all shapes and sizes. All shape shifting sizes and types.

Cristina: And bloodlusting.

Jack: Yes. So you can totally find all that good stuff on the official website, greythoughts.info or on Apple podcasts, Spotify and anywhere you get your podcast.

Cristina: And you can reach us on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and TikTok. Uscombopod.

Jack: Yes. And remember to subscribe and rate the show. And if you feel so inclined, we would adore a review and let someone.

Cristina: Who might like this show know about it.

Jack: Yes. The power of word of mouth is almighty. So if you tell somebody to kindly listen and tell them why, they'll be like, okay. And then the community grows.

Cristina: This has been the Just Conversation podcast. Take nothing personal and thanks for listening.

Jack: Bye.

Cristina: Chuck Norris could be Chucky if you wanted, though.

Jack: No. Yes, because Chuck Norris only really dwells in the realm of paradoxes.

Cristina: Yes, but that's why he wins.

Jack: He would have to paradoxically win. Yeah, that's not a real victory. That's a technicality.

Cristina: So I think that's fair.

Jack: Like in a fight, Shaggy would win. No, in a fair, non counterintuitive fight, he would win.

Cristina: Yes, I guess he would. But that doesn't make him God.

Jack: That does make him God.

Cristina: Really strong.

Jack: He could be God in a fist fight.

Cristina: He's just really strong at 1%.

Jack: What does more percent look like?

Cristina: I don't know.

Jack: Google it. What are the powers of Shaggy? Let's break this down.

Cristina: I think he has powers.

Jack: Shaggy has powers. Shaggy definitely has powers.

Cristina: Good morning. Good morning. The Just Conversation podcast is hosted by Christina Collazo and Jack Thomas, produced by Lynn Taylor and published by Great Thoughts.info art by Zero Lupo and logo by Seth McAllister with social media managed by Amber Black.

Jack: I'm Rob.

Cristina: I'm Slim.

Jack: And I'm the Slam Bagini himself, baby. Yeah. The Rob and Slim show is a weekly comedy show with an hour, hour and a half of happy horseshit followed by four half hour interviews with actors, authors and more. Scott Bale loves us and asked me a On my stomach in the bathtub. Yeah, I am. Catch us live every Wednesday, 6 to 9:30pm Eastern Standard Time on ipmnation.com forward/live2 or facebook.com forward/robinslim or listen to the Rapid Slim show on Pop B Ratoons. Baby. Yeah. I just s*** my f****** pants.

Rambling 111: Shapeshifters

The Just Conversation Podcast, Vampire, Werewolf, Werewolves, Monsters, Scary, Terror, Horror, Aliens, Alien, Abduction, Lore, Folklore

What are the odds that all the creatures throughout folklore are the same species? Comparing Vampires, Werewolves, Chupacabras and deciding whether they are all just shapeshifters.

Story:
On their hunt to capture a werewolf, the duo dive deeper into the lore, general information and what creatures might be relative to werewolves. Unbeknown to them, they’d discover some scary truths about other creatures and uncover knowledge that perhaps werewolves and their true kind never wanted humans, clones, the illuminati and garbage sub-humans to know. Find out what on this episode of Just Conversation.

(This episode contains a transcript to make it accessible to Deaf and Hard of Hearing Audiences #DeafPodcast #PodcastTranscript)

+Episode Details

Remember to leaves us a rating wherever you listen to podcast!

Topics Discussed

  • Blood Drinking Werewolves
  • Vampire Werewolves
  • Shapeshifter DNA
  • Nightstalkers
  • Vampire & Werewolf Similarities
  • How Vampires are Made
  • Counting Vampires
  • Werewolf Fairy Tales
  • Little Red Riding Hood
  • Permission To Enter

Our Links:

Official Website - https://greythoughts.info/podcast

Twitter - https://twitter.com/JustConvoPod

Facebook - https://facebook.com/justconvopod

Instagram - https://instagram.com/justconvopod



+Transcript

Jack: Is werewolf just a shapeshifter? And if so, what other creatures has that shapeshifter turned into? That and more coming up on this episode of Just Conversation.

Cristina: Warning. This program contains strong themes meant for a mature audience. Discretion is advised.

Jack: Going live in 5, 4.

Cristina: What does live mean? Welcome to Just Conversation, the show where we ground humanity's most absurd and baffling ideas in childish ways. I'm your host, Christina.

Jack: And I'm Jack.

Cristina: And if you haven't yet, remember to hit that subscribe button to get notified the second new episodes are released.

Jack: Yes. And also, this show is most enjoyable. A listening partner to share opinions and ideas on the topics we discuss. So be sure to find some body fancy and turn on something fancy that can play such a fancy pantsy show.

Cristina: We're fancy.

Jack: We're fancy.

Cristina: Yes, we're definitely. What makes something fancy?

Jack: I don't know. Anything around us is fancy.

Cristina: What?

Jack: Things around us are fancy.

Cristina: Okay, well, but they don't know what things you're talking about.

Jack: Anything.

Cristina: Anything is fancy around us. Around us?

Jack: Yes. So they play the show. Yes, they're fancy.

Cristina: Okay. Oh, we make things fancy.

Jack: Yes. Anything that's in the wave range of our voices is fancy.

Cristina: Are our ways giving them cancer? Like the 5G thing? Since those things can give cancer? What can't give cancer? Can our voices give cancer?

Jack: No.

Cristina: Are you pausing?

Jack: Not unless we want them to, no.

Cristina: Okay, well, for now, we just want them to be fancy.

Jack: Sometimes we give people cancer intentionally, but that's just for our enemies who are listening.

Cristina: What? What enemies are listening? We have enemies.

Jack: We have many enemies.

Cristina: What?

Jack: War enemies.

Cristina: War enemies. The cat people.

Jack: Yeah, sure, I guess.

Cristina: I don't know who's our enemy is. I feel like we're friends with everyone.

Jack: No.

Cristina: Yes. Our listeners consider us their best friends.

Jack: Some listeners. Some of them are our enemies.

Cristina: Oh, okay. Well, if you get cancer, you know who you are.

Jack: Actually, they have to trace their cancer back to the show.

Cristina: Oh, yeah.

Jack: And then they'll know who they are.

Cristina: And then they all know.

Jack: Until then, they have no clue who they are. They're just confused. It's like, who am I? Do I have an identity?

Cristina: What?

Jack: I just woke up listening to this show. I don't remember anything prior to this show. And then they go to the hospital to get tests and they're like, you got cancer. And they're like, ah, that's a double whammy.

Cristina: They don't know who they are and they got cancer. They think they're cancer. Then what?

Jack: Everybody who listens to the show, Their memory gets wiped of all knowledge except the show.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: But when they go to the doctor, whether or not they have cancer, they know who they are and whether they're our enemy or not. But if they have cancer, they know they're our enemy. They're like, oh, my God, that's who I am. And also, I guess that makes me the enemy.

Cristina: Yes. Oh, wow.

Jack: They don't even think they're the good guy. They're like, I'm the bad guy.

Cristina: Mmm. And this happens every time they listen to our show?

Jack: Yes. Everybody who's ever listened to the show has immediately gone to the hospital afterwards because of amnesia.

Cristina: Oh, my gosh. Are we starting something?

Jack: It's kind of like that Pokemon thing where the kids got, like, seizure. Allegedly.

Cristina: Yeah. Everyone got seizures.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: After the news broke out that everyone's getting seizures.

Jack: Yes. It's weird. Dude, that's mass hysteria. For real.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: That was in the mass hysteria episode, wasn't it? Yeah, it was, man. Yeah. Good episode.

Cristina: Yeah. Also, the vampires, when we talked about vampires and the history of, like, real.

Jack: Cases, that was all his nuns biting people and s***.

Cristina: I don't remember that. Nuns. I know. Nuns were singing.

Jack: Hold the.

Cristina: No, they were meowing.

Jack: Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

Cristina: Wait, wait, wait, wait.

Jack: Not only do I have this inkling that Christ was a vampire, but we'll address that later. We have an actual case. Religious vampires. There were nuns f****** biting people.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And you mentioned that before.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Also in the Mass of Syria episode.

Cristina: Possibly. Yes.

Jack: Bro, were those nuns vampires or werewolves?

Cristina: I don't know. I mean, you go against the Church, you become one of them again.

Jack: Holy s***. There's already. Whoa. There's a couple of crossing lines there.

Cristina: Yeah. The Church is creating monsters.

Jack: Yeah. Yeah, they are.

Cristina: Yes. I don't know, but if you remember from last time on Dragon Ball Z on Just Conversation. Well, last time when I was talking about werewolves, we were talking about two different types of werewolves. We were getting to something. To Adrenochrome.

Jack: We were getting to Adrenochrome.

Cristina: Yes. We were getting to Adrenochrome. We were getting to werewolves that turn into vampires after they die, Right? Yes. And.

Jack: Wait, werewolves turn into vampires after they die?

Cristina: Yes. When they die. For some reason, they're. How was it? Okay. When they die. When werewolves die, their human body stays a human during the daytime, but at night, they still become werewolves. But instead of just craving flesh like they normally do, they Crave blood. Yes.

Jack: So. Oh, yeah, I remember that. But does that make them? I guess it does. But that really. And I guess, like we were talking about in that episode, that breaks into the idea that they're sort of two different souls fighting for one body. Or not souls, but living things. There's two things fighting for one body and the vampire is one of those things.

Cristina: And the vampire.

Jack: But the living other thing is dead.

Cristina: Yeah, it's dead. So it's just a vampire going to a dead body at night and turning into a wolf to drink blood. Yeah, that's what's going on. Maybe. I don't know. To solve that the living dead werewolf problem, they would have to destroy the body. The werewolf sneaking into the battlefield was back in Greece in the 19th century. But in parts of Germany, Poland and northern France, dead people will come back to life to drink blood as wolves. If they were living in mortals and evil people, when evil people died, they would become werewolves.

Jack: Drink blood. So there was no. Like you need something else to make you werewolves. Just being a bad person made you a werewolf?

Cristina: Yes. After death, though.

Jack: So werewolves are zombies.

Cristina: Yes. That drink blood.

Jack: That drink bloods of vampires?

Cristina: Yes, But I don't know why. But yes. And then they will return into their human form at the daylight, like the battle, the ones in Greece, I think.

Jack: Fascinating.

Cristina: And they would need a priest to decapitate it and do an exorcism. Like, you know, when a regular demon goes into a body situation, I guess. And then the head would be thrown into a river. I don't know why, but you gotta throw that head into the river somehow.

Jack: That solves the problem.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: The murder part had nothing to do with it.

Cristina: No. You just needed that head to throw into the river.

Jack: So if the head is not in the river. Boom. Still alive.

Cristina: Yeah. Maybe it'll find its head, put it back on, and then continue on drinking blood.

Jack: So in theory, that body could still move around. It'll just be aimless.

Cristina: Yes, in theory, I guess. I don't know. Or maybe once the head is in the water, the body just can't move. It needs to know that the head is round to continue moving.

Jack: Interesting. Interesting.

Cristina: And then new things about werewolves that we didn't mention before was, you know, the normal. They're vulnerable to silver and highly resistant to injury. Except that you could cut them. I mean, I guess that's not an injury you're forcing. You're like breaking them apart to kill them. Oh, those poor people who are. Who are mistaken as werewolves. I guess it Sucks for them. It sucks.

Jack: It goes back to, you know, how do you tell if somebody's a witch? You drown them. If they're dead, they're not a witch. But if they don't drown, they are a witch. So my question is, did they ever discover a witch? Because they probably just drown. Hella m************.

Cristina: Yeah. And the werewolf thing, I guess the werewolf test of, like, if they have fur under their skin, that's proof. I don't know. Well, that's a weird proof.

Jack: Yeah, it's like, oh, I guess he wasn't a werewolf.

Cristina: How many hands were cut? And if you put silver on them, I think their skin is supposed to burn as well.

Jack: Which they've probably also never seen.

Cristina: No. What if a person's allergic to silver? Is that a possibility?

Jack: I wonder if that's a thing. That's interesting.

Cristina: Yeah. How many people allergic to silver has that happened?

Jack: But, like, their skin wouldn't burn, they just get, like, a rash?

Cristina: No, they get a rash. Yeah. But they're gonna look.

Jack: And not even immediately. Not even immediately.

Cristina: How long after?

Jack: It would take a while to have a reaction.

Cristina: Oh, well, they'll wait for that and then say, that's a burn. And in places that wolves weren't a thing, there were other things that were very similar. Like in Africa, there was the were hyena. In India, a were tiger. In South America, there were were pumas and were jaguars. And in Asian countries, they had were foxes. That's pretty cool.

Jack: That'd be cool.

Cristina: Were fox.

Jack: A were fox. It's like a little anime girl.

Cristina: How do you like? So I have to move into one of those places. I wonder if turning into those were creatures are the same as a werewolf.

Jack: Like, you gotta drink their print water.

Cristina: Yes. Or be asleep in a summer day with the sun hitting your face on a Wednesday or Friday.

Jack: Look, man, if you're gonna become a fox. Yeah. You gotta be like, in an autumn field. And it has to be like a half a moon. And it needs to be out, like in dusk when the sun is still out. So you could get hit by both, because that's around the time you'll see a fox. And that's when you get hit by both of those. And the combined power. Boom. Now you are a fox. Human person thing. A were fox.

Cristina: But what if, because I was born in a place where wolves are common, I just end up being a werewolf?

Jack: You think that'd be interesting. So let's say hypothetically, this stuff is real.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And the regional DNA is really what's making the transformation on the creatures of the area?

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: So if you went to an area where there were different creatures, would your DNA still be the DNA from your region? Because your DNA doesn't change.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: What you have is in your DNA. Just because you went somewhere else doesn't mean you'd suddenly become like a were hyena. Because you went from the US to Africa. I wish you would just become a werewolf.

Cristina: Yeah. Slim.

Jack: Interesting.

Cristina: Or were deer. I feel like it's always a dangerous animal. You can't be a were deer.

Jack: In that case it would like. That would be horrifying anyways. But in that case it would. You could be a were buffalo.

Cristina: Were. But it feels like it has to be something that eats meat.

Jack: Why? You could be a were buffalo and just beat the s*** out of somebody without eating them.

Cristina: But all those examples of all those were places had meat eating animals.

Jack: But why can't there be examples that are just something that'll beat like a were elephant? You just grow over size and everywhere you go.

Cristina: Haven't heard of it. There should be were hippos.

Jack: Were hippo. A were hippo. Like a hippo doesn't even need to eat meat. It's just gonna murder. It murders because it can just three.

Cristina: Times the size of a hippo. Oh my gosh.

Jack: Yeah, man.

Cristina: That's too like if something like that.

Jack: Bipedal hippo freak.

Cristina: Yeah, a bipedal.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: No, you would have three legs with one leg up.

Jack: Because hippos have an extra skinny short leg. You have three normal hippo sized legs and then one really skinny short leg, like abnormally short to fit the tiny, tiny, tiny tail the hippo has. And then that one leg pretends to be the hippo's tail.

Cristina: Yes. Because it's a smart hippo.

Jack: It's a smart hippo. That's so disturbing about like werewolves that they would even do that.

Cristina: Yes, but that is so disturbing. But anyways, lets talk about werewolves and vampires and the common traits of a werewolf and a vampire piece. I would love to talk about vampires. I want to compare and contrast. Well, we know that they're both creatures of the night.

Jack: Yes. Although I don't think it's exclusively creatures of the night for werewolves. There are versions of werewolves that are purebred werewolves that move in the daylight. I think they just need the full moon to transform. Or in some cases it's to transform.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Like in other cases it just permanently keeps them transformed.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So a lot of the versions of werewolf are that I'M only a werewolf as long as there's a full moon. And as soon as the full moon's gone, I'm not a werewolf.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And it needs to be night so that the light of the moon is the most dominant light in the sky. So the moon could be full and outside, but you not be a werewolf because it's not the most dominant light in the sky. You're getting sunlight combined with moonlight. You need strong moonlight without the sun in the way. In the way to turn. In other cases, you are already carrying a werewolf DNA and you could become a werewolf, but you have to kill the werewolf that turned you into a werewolf before your next full moon, or you become permanently a werewolf. Those are two different variants. And in the case of that second option, you could become a werewolf day.

Cristina: Or night if you're a baby werewolf. If you're unrelated to the main werewolf, you could do it whenever.

Jack: If you've been bitten and turned into a werewolf, you don't need the full moon to turn into a werewolf.

Cristina: All right.

Jack: You just permanently get trapped as a werewolf after the full moon.

Cristina: And then after the full moon, though, then it has to be a full moon.

Jack: Interesting. Maybe those are two things that work together because you can. I don't know why it would stop you suddenly from being able to turn. Maybe because it could be like you turn whenever, but then after the full moon. Now you turn only on the full moon. I feel like that's less productive than you turning whenever.

Cristina: Yeah, but also for the vampire. Not all stories have vampires that are weak during the day or they have to sleep during daytime. That just became the favorite over time.

Jack: But usually they're hybrids.

Cristina: Hybrids?

Jack: Yeah. They're not pure vampires.

Cristina: How can you tell?

Jack: Because pure vampires can't go out in daylight.

Cristina: Well, in some stories, I guess. But some stories, some vampires can I believe.

Jack: Usually those are the very, very old vampires. And they still get affected by the sunlight. Like it burns slowly. So they can travel through the sunlight, but they can't stay in the sunlight.

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: Yeah, there's actually. I forgot what it was called. It's a breakdown of how vampires work. Like their age ranges or something like that. Really, they're. Before a certain point, going into the sunlight turns you into stone or it ignites your skin. Actually, yeah. One turns you into stone, the younger ones, and then they crumble or ash. It turns them into ash. Then somewhere in their teens, a vampirism, they get turned into stone. Then somewhere in their mid middle age, they get a vampirism. You could be any age, but like in the middle ages of being a vampire.

Cristina: So it would be like hundreds of years pass.

Jack: Yeah, hundreds of years or something like that. Maybe like 200 years. Your skin sets on fire, but you don't die instantly the way you do younger, where you get turned into stone or ash. Then later you get. Your body sizzles, but you do not ignite. And then finally your body gradually starts heating up so you can move through.

Cristina: Sunlight but sizzle like you tan or.

Jack: No, like your body will eventually burn the way it would. Like in all of these instances, your body's still burning, but it's slower and slower each time.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: At the first case you just turn to ash. In the second case you turn to stone and then to ash, but you gradually turn to stone.

Cristina: Yeah, but these are like hundreds or like years apart from each stage.

Jack: Yes, yes. We're talking like the first one within the first hundred years. Second one, Maybe the first two, 300 years. The third one maybe like 500 years. You know, giant gaps.

Cristina: Okay, so then in both situations then they. They're mainly at night still. Werewolves and vampires.

Jack: Not werewolves.

Cristina: Vampires, not werewolves. Okay.

Jack: Vampires are mainly at night. Werewolves have some ways around the rules.

Cristina: Yeah. Especially baby you, I guess, bitten ones. That's what you're saying.

Jack: Yeah. Because there are bits born werewolves, there's also born vampires that work very differently. There's the whole trade off of when a creature is born with the DNA and when a creature is turned. Now there's all. There are some versions of each of these that don't allow for birth to happen. So you can only become. You can't be born as.

Cristina: Yes. And the way they become, though, are the same. That they have to be bitten. Yes, that it has to be through blood or saliva.

Jack: Interesting.

Cristina: And I think that's pretty much it that I could think of that they have in common, though.

Jack: But there are some crossing lines between werewolves and vampires that seem to be pretty similar.

Cristina: Yeah. Let's talk about vampires and where they come from, because we know werewolves are. Well, we really don't know much. We know that they could either be made or by gods getting revenge. Remember that? Yeah. Or wearing a furry belt.

Jack: Being a furry.

Cristina: Being a furry. Being bitten could turn you into a werewolf, of course.

Jack: Or drinking print water.

Cristina: Yep.

Jack: Or being outside in the moonlight.

Cristina: Vampires could be just evil people, people who committed suicide or witches that are coming back to life after they're dead because of. I guess evilness is bringing them back to dead from the dead. Yes. And they could Also be created by. By evil spirit or by being bitten by a vampire.

Jack: By evil spirit. Yeah. Being bitten by a vampire is normal. And what do they mean by evil spirit?

Cristina: Just like a spirit going into a dead body.

Jack: So a person who's possessed is a vampire?

Cristina: Yeah, could turn into a vampire.

Jack: So all the exorcist movies are about vampires?

Cristina: Yes, only if they suck blood. That's the important part. Right.

Jack: So vampires. A vampiric spirit.

Cristina: Yeah, a vampiric spirit will turn you into a vampire. Also, in Slavic and Chinese traditions, dead bodies that are jumped over by an animal, usually a dog or a cat, their chances of being a vampire is pretty great.

Jack: That's weird. I don't know why that's pretty weird. That's pretty weird.

Cristina: Yes. And in Russia, vampires were witches or people who had rebelled against the church.

Jack: My question is then, are they vampires who suck blood or are they describing these people as vampires? Is it like a title rather than a creature?

Cristina: I think it's a creature. I think they really believe they're going to become this creature that drinks blood after they're dead.

Jack: Okay, that's weird.

Cristina: That's weird.

Jack: I'm sure the Church made that up.

Cristina: You think the Church made that up?

Jack: Yeah, to control people into following the line.

Cristina: Mmm. But a lot of these stories came before the church, too. Like the jumping dog on the dead body predates Christianity. What, the dog jumping over a dead body? Possibly.

Jack: You think it predates Christianity? You're telling me that that myth of a animal jumping over a person and that person transforming predates Christianity? Running the world, which seems to be one of the longest running jokes in all of time.

Cristina: Do we have pet dogs before Christianity?

Jack: That doesn't mean that myth came to be.

Cristina: That's true. I don't know.

Jack: Even when the concept of werewolf came to be.

Cristina: Yeah, well, the Greek ones, that would have been pre Christianity, wouldn't it, if Zeus was turning you into a werewolf?

Jack: Is this, I guess, was turning people.

Cristina: Into werewolves just one dude for being bad?

Jack: Fair enough.

Cristina: So unless he was Zeus around when.

Jack: God was around, I'm sure they're brothers.

Cristina: Yeah. And some more weird vampire stuff that you probably did not know is that in Europe, to slow down a vampire, you would cut their tendons on their knees. Ow. The dead body. If you suspected that dead body to be a vampire, you would cut their knee.

Jack: That seems legit. But why? Oh, what's the owl for? They're dead.

Cristina: Yeah, that's true. That's true. They're dead, so who cares? But it's such a weird. No, I guess I'm still thinking about the werewolves and like how you're torturing these living people to see. But these are dead people, so it's okay.

Jack: Yeah, you just mutilated that body. It's all good.

Cristina: That's fine. And then you also would place seeds, millet, sand around the grave. Because vampires love counting things, I guess. I don't know. No, because the sesame vampire.

Jack: It's because your f****** name is the Count. Is that why the Count?

Cristina: What? Vampires have to count things. I don't know why. They just do.

Jack: That's so crazy that they have to.

Cristina: They have this obsession of counting things.

Jack: To count all the sugar grains around them. Come on, man.

Cristina: Yes. If you have a lot of. A little bit of things like sand, they just. You'll trap a vampire.

Jack: That doesn't make sense. And why is a vampire functional at all? When they're in the forest, why aren't they just counting all the rocks? Big a** holes in that f****** plant?

Cristina: Because they're not in the forest, they're in graves.

Jack: Why aren't they counting all the dead bodies and all the insects in the.

Cristina: We don't know. They didn't do that before. They had to drink blood. They counted really fast and then they went to get food.

Jack: Nah, man. There's holes here.

Cristina: Yeah, that's in Europe. But China also has the same thing where a sack. You throw a sack of rice in front of a vampire, they have to count every grain of rice.

Jack: No, I disagree. That doesn't make any sense.

Cristina: How do you know the weakness of.

Jack: A vampire is not a bag of rice?

Cristina: Yes, you slow them down that way. How did you not? Have you heard of that before?

Jack: I've heard about it. I just don't believe it.

Cristina: Yeah, how are we to judge? We haven't seen it. We haven't tried it out.

Jack: Because then it's easy to beat them.

Cristina: Well, then you have to actually attack them afterwards. I guess that would be the hard part.

Jack: Just keep throwing bags of f****** rice.

Cristina: What happens when you run out of it?

Jack: You won't. You won't.

Cristina: And we don't know how fast they can count.

Jack: Not fast enough. You just keep throwing bags of rice. Yeah, they aren't lightning. Yeah, they're fast, but not light.

Cristina: You try to lead them to a beach.

Jack: Yeah, I wonder if that. Yeah, that's it. They're done. You win.

Cristina: They're just frozen. They're counting the sand.

Jack: How could they even differentiate beyond some point? How do they know what they've Counted?

Cristina: I don't know. They just have to restart. It's a mess. It's a vampire nightmare. Yeah, that's why you don't see vampires on the beach.

Jack: How do they know, man? Like, how does a vampire exit their grave and make it out? Because there's trees maybe.

Cristina: It has to be just tiny things because all these things are really tiny.

Jack: So they're like Valley Girls and like Tokyo party girls that they just love tiny things.

Cristina: Yes. Yes they are. Why are you judging these vampires who are obsessed with tiny things and need to count them all?

Jack: Apparently. Do they also shop at the Gap? The f***?

Cristina: And to protect yourself against vampires? Well, you probably know all these things. Garlic, the Bible, crucifix, holy water and mirrors. Ward off the vampire.

Jack: I'm 95% sure the church has nothing.

Cristina: To do with that.

Jack: No, the Bible created a vampire.

Cristina: The Bible created a vampire.

Jack: I'm sure reading from the Bible is how vampires are made. It's like making holy water.

Cristina: What do you mean?

Jack: Like a passage out of the Bible into a cup or something.

Cristina: And then what? Then you turn it to holy water.

Jack: It's turned into holy water? I guess.

Cristina: I don't really know.

Jack: Boil it.

Cristina: Boil it.

Jack: You boil the h*** out of it. And then it's holy water.

Cristina: And then it's holy water.

Jack: Yeah, because you boiled the h*** out of it.

Cristina: Well, so tell me that doesn't make sense. Huh? And vampires are unable to cross sacred ground like churches and temples. And for some reason they can't cross water. I don't know if water is also sacred or they just can't swim or. Now what's going on?

Jack: Let's look at a couple of descriptions of vampires, right?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: If you're already excessively white, it's hard to call you pale per se. In the dead of night, you're just white. But if you're already dark skinned, then it's easy to say that person is pale because they are a different kind of dark skin that looks kind of like if you put a fade filter over something that they have like that kind of pale off color look.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So this goes back to the racist ideology that black people can't swim. And also saying that black people were the vampires, you're saying they were the.

Cristina: Vampires and the werewolves.

Jack: I'm saying white people made all of these up, which means the white person has to be the hero according to the white person, which means the monster had to be the non white person.

Cristina: Whoa. What? Why are you ruining these creatures?

Jack: Because white people are racist.

Cristina: Well, we Know that.

Jack: Who is it who isn't racist? Like, fair enough. Who's not racist? Anybody who's like, only the white people are racist. Like, shut up. Shut up. Had you been in that position, you'd call them vampires.

Cristina: I call them vampires.

Jack: Although the witches were also colored women.

Cristina: Weren't they just women?

Jack: They were colored women.

Cristina: They were young women. I thought, yeah, young colored women crazy.

Jack: A lot of the time.

Cristina: Or older ladies. I don't know.

Jack: Colored women a lot of the time, yes.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: That's why the voodoo priestess thing is very commonly the black woman. That all. It's coming back from the same tree of. Oh, they do magic, those witches. Those are the black women.

Cristina: Ah.

Jack: That just branches down now.

Cristina: They're werewolves, vampires and witches, which are.

Jack: All just white people coming up with different derogatory names and s*** for just ways to get black people killed.

Cristina: Okay. What? Yeah, it's crazy. That's so messed up. But anyway, vampires can't enter the house unless you invite them over.

Jack: That's a weird one.

Cristina: Yeah. And they can go come and go after that point. It's just the first time thing, which they need your permission, but once you give it to them, that's it.

Jack: Interesting. Interesting.

Cristina: I don't know why, but I don't know, I wonder.

Jack: Because it's. Let's see, things that have those same rules. There are, like, the Bible has those rules. You gotta let Jesus into your heart and give them permission. You gotta give them permission. Do you accept Christ as your savior? No. Then he can't come in. And vampires have to also do that same thing. Werewolves don't give a s***. They'll break in.

Cristina: Yeah, but the werewolf stories, they didn't seem to break into any place. They were just outside waiting for you.

Jack: Yeah, interesting, maybe.

Cristina: So maybe they can't come in.

Jack: But they don't have the capacity to communicate, to try to convince you. Like, can I come in?

Cristina: Yes. Except for that werewolf. In that story of the Little Red.

Jack: Riding Hood, she asked for permission.

Cristina: Yeah, He. To the. I think to get in the first time with the old lady, he had to be like, I'm, you know, I'm Little Red Riding Hood. You gotta let me in. And she's like, okay. And then she let him in. And then he, you know, did all.

Jack: That interesting twist on that because for the three little pigs, he also asked for permission to go in. And he said, if you're not gonna let me in, I'll knock your f****** house down.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: He can't just break in. Dude, you could Blow their house down.

Cristina: But he can't go into their door in. Maybe they have the same rule.

Jack: Holy s***. I think they have the same rules.

Cristina: Oh, snap.

Jack: They're just at least that polite about it. They're not gonna be like, hey, can I come in for a cup of dinner?

Cristina: Because they can't communicate that way.

Jack: Yeah. Interesting, interesting. So then my question is what we know that tales like these children's tales come from either warnings that adults have created for children to warn them about bads of the world without making them scared of people.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Or real events that have happened in people's that they're warning about in a more literal sense. In the case of the Three Little Piggies and Little Red Riding Hood, were those situations with real werewolves? Because in both cases they were in the forest where the werewolf hangs out.

Cristina: But they called them wolves. They were just wolves.

Jack: Of course. Of course.

Cristina: But it's to not scare the kids from werewolves, I guess.

Jack: Yeah. Because you were talking about a human talking to a wolf.

Cristina: I don't know. Yeah.

Jack: And the three Little pigs, hams, those are just white people.

Cristina: They were calling themselves little pigs. Okay.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Why didn't they pick something else?

Jack: Just a way to make a cute story, I guess. But they're talking to a werewolf or something.

Cristina: Mmm. Yeah.

Jack: And so that werewolf, they were maybe having a legit conversation with a werewolf in those stories. Like, what's the real, the groove version of it, you know? Like, is there a f****** werewolf in these situations that they're having a conversation with? In the case of Little Red Riding Hood, the werewolf can't get in because this goes back to what we're talking about. These lines are crossing heavily because there are the same rules. They kind of have the same timelines, they have the same ways of turning into one another. Are we just talking about a shapeshifter? Take many different forms, but it doesn't matter because the same rules for turning into the same rules for entering property, the same rules for defeat to some degree are all there.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: You got to remove the head of a vampire the same way you got to remove the head of a f****** werewolf.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: The bite turns you. In both cases, usually killing the one who turned you turns you back. If you do it before a certain period of time or whatever.

Cristina: So it's all the same story.

Jack: Interesting. In vampire's case, you have to kill the vampire before your bloodlust gets to you, before you have to feed.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So you kill the vampire who turned you before you feed. The way you kill the wolf who turned you before the full moon so.

Cristina: You'Re not permanently permanent.

Jack: Same way you're not permanent a vampire if you kill the other one before you drink human blood. If you drink human blood, you stay a vampire.

Cristina: So it's the same story. It's just about a different creature. But it's practice. It's practically the same creature. Maybe.

Jack: Yeah, there's some real close lines there.

Cristina: Yeah. And although, like I mentioned before, although vampires were believed to be more active at night, they were not generally considered vulnerable to the sunlight. I don't know. Like, through time they've become weaker to the sun. But originally the sun wasn't their weakness or anything. They just like to move around during the night.

Jack: It was just easier at night.

Cristina: Yeah, I guess because you can catch.

Jack: People at home, people out. You can't. How hard is it to feed outside with streets filled with people?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Especially when everybody's walking.

Cristina: But if it's the same with werewolves, like, you gotta wait for night because.

Jack: That'S the easier time. You could just, like, attack people on their own versus groups.

Cristina: Yeah. Mmm. That could be it. What? What? And the different methods of destroying a vampire. Or I guess, murder. I guess you can't really say murder because it's already dead.

Jack: It's not dead. Neither a vampire nor a zombie are dead.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: We've established this.

Cristina: But it's. The person who was. The vampire is dead, though.

Jack: Disagree.

Cristina: No. You think the person's still alive?

Jack: Yes, I think in both cases the person is alive. You're just talking about level of brain function in the case.

Cristina: I mean, the original person. Like, if a vampire takes over your body, you're not there anymore.

Jack: I don't think there's a different per. I think a vampire is like, interview with a vampire. Like, that guy remembers his past life, he remembers all of it, and he's like, man, I wish I could go back to being that.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But, like, I'm here now. I can't stop it.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: That seems real to me versus, I guess I just see to exist.

Cristina: Okay. Because that's how it sounds like, though. Like, a demon comes into your dead body.

Jack: And in the case of you being possessed and thus being a vampire. I guess. Yeah, but you turning into a vampire, that's not something else invading you. That's you who already exists. Turning. Turning into a vampire.

Cristina: Yeah, well. Okay, well, when you turn into a vampire, the things we gotta do to get rid of you is taking you through the heart and some. And through the mouth. For some reason. I don't know why the mouth, but.

Jack: The brain, maybe you're trying to hit the brain, maybe.

Cristina: And the stomach. Those are the three good spots.

Jack: So you mean, like where the heart is, the brain is, or like, organs. Vital organs. So essentially the way you'd kill a human.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Do that and you'll kill a vampire?

Cristina: Definitely. Well, yeah. Yeah, it's exactly the same.

Jack: Sounds about right. I feel like a lot of things could be killed that way.

Cristina: Also, getting rid of the head and then burning it.

Jack: Sounds about right.

Cristina: Oh, burying the head between the feet or behind the b*** or away from the body for some reason. You just got to keep that head away once you get it off the.

Jack: Body, because the body is gonna go get it the same way a werewolf would.

Cristina: But if you hide it behind its b***, can it just get it?

Jack: Not if you tie its hands in the front and you tape the head to the b***. How would he get the head if his hands are tight in front of him? You can also do it the opposite way and tie his hand behind him. And if he's a guy, you can hang his own head off of his own d***, tape it against her. So he's forever blowing himself, but he can't do anything but blow himself, but blow himself for all of eternity.

Cristina: Whoa. Revenge on that vampire. Revenge.

Jack: Also something that applies to anyone and everyone, except in most cases, those people are dead. And you just made a corpse blow itself.

Cristina: Yes. Why? Whatever. We're crazy. You can't blame us. We're crazy.

Jack: Yeah. There's something wrong with humans for sure.

Cristina: And also, pouring boiling water over the grave. What?

Jack: To, like, super make sure.

Cristina: I guess instead of burning it, you don't got fire. Use water.

Jack: Here's the thing. I think the grave, like, is the grave already covered back up?

Cristina: Huh?

Jack: Because if it's, like, there's a bunch of dirt, like, that dirt's gonna, like, cool that water down.

Cristina: We should probably do it to the body. If we're gonna burn the body, why not boil the body as well?

Jack: With, like, oil?

Cristina: With oil.

Jack: With oil, not water. Going easy.

Cristina: Yeah. Also, vampires could be shot or drowned, of course, or sprinkled by holy water.

Jack: So everything plus demon stuff. So a vampire is basically a person and could die any way you'd kill a person.

Cristina: Plus exorcism.

Jack: Plus exorcism.

Cristina: Although I feel like if you exercise a human, they might die too.

Jack: Some of the methods of exorcism would kill a normal human.

Cristina: Yes. That's why there has been cases where humans who were exercised go to court against the church because, like, I had mental problems and you destroyed me. That's been real thing that has happened, too.

Jack: Interesting.

Cristina: Yeah. And then you could also put garlic in its mouth and then shoot a bullet through the coffin.

Jack: So, like, I don't feel you need the garlic at that point. Like, you could just.

Cristina: If you just do one, it won't work.

Jack: Just shoot him. He's fine. But if he's got garlic and you shoot him, boom, you solve that problem.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Isn't the garlic what's being effective there? Why don't you just fill, like, prison style instead of filling a bag up with soap?

Cristina: And if you don't have garlic, you could use lemon. You put lemon in its mouth.

Jack: So like, maybe being a vampire is more of a, like, genetic disorder where, like, you're just allergic to a bunch of s***.

Cristina: You're just allergic to a bunch of.

Jack: You're allergic to garlic and lemons. And then they put them there and you, like, super weak and dying and can't breathe, and then they shoot you.

Cristina: Duh. Oh, I forgot to mention. Oh, my gosh. This story. To find the graves of vampires. Oh, my gosh. You need to have a virgin boy riding a virgin horse. And then the horse will get scared at the grave that the vampire is in.

Jack: Because vampires rape virgin boys and horses.

Cristina: I don't know. I just think the priest might need help to know which one's the virgin.

Jack: I do, too. I think that's exactly what's happening. I think this goes back to white people in power and the church, for whatever reason.

Cristina: But why a virgin horse? You think he needs the horse too?

Jack: Probably.

Cristina: When he can't have the boy, he'll have the horse.

Jack: No, no, no. He's gonna have the boy, but he's also gonna have the horse.

Cristina: Oh, my gosh. Also, graves with hoes over it. I guess, like, hoes are appearing on top of the grave.

Jack: That's an arm that poked out.

Cristina: I guess maybe that's what they think happened.

Jack: Interesting.

Cristina: And they're just holes there. Maybe someone's trying to actually steal that grave or something.

Jack: I think it's the other way around. I think they accidentally buried a living person who was like, I could do it.

Cristina: I can do it. I can get out, get out. Then that person suffocates and dies, but they think it's a vampire. So they're gonna put a lemon in its mouth and shoot it?

Jack: Yeah, yeah, pretty much. If they. I wonder how many times that happened. They accidentally. Like, somebody was in a coma or passed out. Or some s***. They threw him in a grave, and they. The person gains consciousness while in this hole.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And then they're trying to get out, and they're like, it's a vampire. F****** shoot it. Not Jimmy was alive. F****** kill it. It's a zombie or something.

Cristina: Nope, just shoot it. That's so crazy, taking no chances.

Jack: I think that's why it's a law or some s*** that you got to dig a shallow grave when you put somebody at the beginning.

Cristina: Really.

Jack: I think so. I'm not really sure.

Cristina: I know they have, like, bells on graves just in case they bury a person alive so you can ring that bell. I don't even know if that's a true story. That might just have been a legend. And then people just took it too seriously and were like, just in case this happens to me, I want a bell on my grave.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: But I don't know.

Jack: Maybe I'll be buried alive.

Cristina: Mm. So now that's enough vampire talks. Let's talk about other creatures that are. That can transform and drink blood. I guess that's the important thing we need that's in common with vampires and werewolves and chupacabras.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: And the first creature up is wendingos, and I. Not really sure what a wendigo look like. It's a creature that takes over a body, and that person goes mad and eats people.

Jack: Now, to my understanding, a wendingo kind of looks like a werewolf.

Cristina: I don't think so. Do they?

Jack: I do think so, but I don't. Here's the. Here's the difference. I don't think they look like it. Depictions of them look like it. Yeah, that's the problem. When dingoes are depicted, it's kind of looking like werewolf.

Cristina: Yeah. But then they go inside the human, and then the human does these acts.

Jack: I don't think the wind dingo looks like that. I think the human dingo combo looks like that.

Cristina: Oh, okay. Yes. Because there's a. The original wendigo that turns.

Jack: That's just.

Cristina: Yeah, but like a werewolf and a vampire that they have to be bitten. This thing bites, I guess, quote unquote, the. The victim, and then he turns into a win dingo and then he murders everyone.

Jack: Yes. There you go.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: So they turn to something that looks like a werewolf in depictions, in depictions.

Cristina: Okay. But from the stories, it just. It's really crazy when dingles, after being after a person is. Becomes a win dingle. They just. They have an incredible need for greed, murder, and cannibalism. Even though there might Be food around, they'll still murder.

Jack: So they're like just aggressively wrathful and violent.

Cristina: Yes. There's been like two cases about Wendingell's. One case was in 1878 where a guy named Swift Runner and his family were starving and there was emergency food 25 miles away. And for some reason, instead of the guy going to get the food, Swift Runner just killed and ate his family, which were like I think five other people. And then he eventually confessed to the crime and got executed.

Jack: But he doesn't sound like he was a win dingo. He sounds like a f****** lunatic who was clear minded.

Cristina: Probably blamed the Wendigo. Yeah, yeah. That's why I think happened. I mean it could be just a crazy guy.

Jack: Sounds like a crazy guy.

Cristina: That's what. There's the debate over this Wendingo thing. Like are these really people that. What is. Are these people? Do these people really believe that they got the spirit taking over them to kill an ether family which makes them a schizophrenic or are they lying and just. They want. They kill their family and they need.

Jack: An excuse, which is where the Wendingo comes in.

Cristina: Yeah. So I don't know, like in theory.

Jack: If you're in a place that's superstitious enough, you could get away with that.

Cristina: If you're. Yeah, I guess. But he didn't get away with that. And they've also. There was another case where just the person who takes care of the Wendingo problem got in trouble because he was killing the Wendigo, which is really. He was killing people.

Jack: So he was a serial killer.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Picked very specific people, killed them and said they were possessed by Wendingo.

Cristina: Yeah, yeah, that's. Wow.

Jack: That's a clever way. But that just goes back to the serial killer who was pretending he was hearing the voice of a dog.

Cristina: Yes, that's exactly what these cases reminded me of. Because that's what they were arguing. Like whether is he really hearing a demon talk to him saying kill these people or is he using that as excuse to kill these people?

Jack: He was the Son of Sam, right?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So they were basically doing the Son.

Cristina: Of Sam shtick before he.

Jack: Before the son. Which case. That makes the Son of Sam the. The f****** copycat killer.

Cristina: Oh, maybe. But he wasn't eating people, so it wasn't the same type of crime he was committing.

Jack: Interesting. Interesting.

Cristina: He was just shooting ladies.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: Yep.

Jack: But claiming that the reason was.

Cristina: Was because of a demon dog.

Jack: Yeah, I was hearing demon dog.

Cristina: Yep.

Jack: And thus I went ahead and did the crime.

Cristina: Yeah. So it might be the same case. I don't know. And then there's this other creature that's called the witchooge, which is a man eating creature that could also possess people. It's like an ancient giant animal in its natural form, I think. And then it goes into regular people.

Jack: Like an ancient giant animal. Like that physical creature.

Cristina: Like a spirit animal.

Jack: Forest spirit. Like Shinto.

Cristina: Yeah, like a giant spirit animal comes inside of Zelda.

Jack: Twilight Princess with the floating animal spirits that you gotta collect the gems from and keep them kind of in reality.

Cristina: I have no idea. I don't remember that. But yes. These giant spirit animals come inside you.

Jack: They come inside you they come inside you these giant spirit animals come inside.

Cristina: You youu can become. Oh, it's huge. By breaking a taboo or becoming too strong. I don't know what too strong means, but like maybe you work out too much and then you become now a man eating creature.

Jack: Out of curiosity, do you actually eat people or you beat the s*** out of them is a common trait. Beating the s*** out of them?

Cristina: No, it's eating so they don't beat.

Jack: The s*** out of people.

Cristina: No, I mean, maybe, I don't know. But it seeks to eat people.

Jack: Interesting. Have they seen people? Have they seen people possessed by this? Are there stories of people?

Cristina: There's just stories of people because it's.

Jack: Possible that the steroids of that time were causing roid rage. And that's what they mean by too strong.

Cristina: Too strong? Yeah.

Jack: Then you're having blind rages over dumb s*** and just beating the s*** out.

Cristina: Of people to death, fighting them. And then they're like, ah, he's a wetchug. Well, you want to hear about the taboos that you shouldn't break?

Jack: I guess it could be witch hudge. So long as there's a GE at the end, which Hudge. Either way it works.

Cristina: You want to hear about the taboos yet you should not break.

Jack: Taboos for what? For the witch. Huge.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: For the witch Hudge.

Cristina: Yes, go for it. There's probably a bunch, but three of them. A person that has that takes gets a picture of them with a flash. I guess that flash is a taboo. If you get a picture of you taken with a flash is one listening to music made of stretched string like a guitar and eating meat with fly eggs in it. Don't break those taboos.

Jack: And that's it. You don't become a witchage.

Cristina: Yes, that and don't become too strong.

Jack: Guess that's it for working Out?

Cristina: Yes. This creature seeks out to eat people and attempts to lure them away by being cunning. I don't know what the cunningness is.

Jack: Smart. Clever.

Cristina: No, I. I know that I don't know what they use to be cunning.

Jack: Oh.

Cristina: Like what? How do. Like, do they. If it's a child, the cunning would be like, here's candy. Come with me. I'm not gonna eat you.

Jack: So Ted Bundy was a wet judge, is he?

Cristina: Mmm. Oh, and some of these things, the true form of it is made out of ice and it's very strong and you can kill it by throwing it on campfire and you keep it there overnight and then it melts away and then you're done with the problem.

Jack: So they are ice monsters.

Cristina: Yeah. I guess you become an ice monster eventually, is what's happening. Not the true form, because the true form, I think, is the spirit creature thing.

Jack: So a wendingo and a witch are exactly the same thing? Essentially, yeah. Most likely regional derivatives of each other.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: But they all involve getting a person who turns into them.

Cristina: Yes. To turn into them. Yep.

Jack: Do they have rules for entry or anything of that nature? Do you have to, like, let them in?

Cristina: No, I think you just gotta be a really bad person. Or. I don't. The first one, I don't know. The second one, it sounds like becoming too strong.

Jack: This worked out too much. And now I'm a monster.

Cristina: Yeah. Oh. I guess the first one might be like being too greedy for some reason or it turns you into being too greedy. I'm not really sure what comes first.

Jack: Interesting.

Cristina: Are you greedy beforehand or not? I don't know. But being a weshog is considered a curse and a punishment. So I guess that is if you're bad, you're gonna be cursed and then you're gonna want to eat people. I guess some werewolf stories are like that too. It's just a curse put on you sometimes. Alright, we're running out of time. What do you think of all that information?

Jack: I think that's pretty interesting. I think that that holds makes a pretty good argument for a werewolf, vampire, Chupacabra, the Win Dingo and the Wetchudge to be kind of different people's tales of the same creature, whether it be different eras in time or different regions giving it different names, but referring to the same thing. It's sort of the God problem.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Like if you're Islamic, you say Allah. If you are Christian, you say Jehovah. But if I showed you a picture of the one true God both of, and you Some, for whatever reason, knew exactly what he looked like. Both groups would aim at the same thing. Yeah, I think it's that case.

Cristina: It could be.

Jack: I think that if everybody knew for a fact what you mean when you say vampire or wetchudge or werewolf or win dingo or chupacabra, and I brought up a single photo of a shapeshifter and you just happen to know for a fact what these creatures look like. You'd all aim at the one picture I'm holding and realize, oh, f***, we were talking about the same thing.

Cristina: Yeah. It's interesting that some shapeshifters like to be animals over human, though. The vampire is the only form that it's like. It prefers being human, I guess, in a way. Maybe the Wendigle too. I'm not sure.

Jack: Here's an interesting point that I'll make before we get out of here, which is the possibility that the intellectual level of the creature allows for a more complex transformation. So that if you can have the capacity of a person, you are a particularly intelligent shapeshifter. You can imitate a human.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Thus you turn into a vampire if you are more animalistic, but can sort of get there. Maybe all their goals is trying to get to the human where they could just blend in to the best creature to eat.

Cristina: Yes. The whole thing is to shapeshift into their meal so it can be easier for them to get closer to their meal.

Jack: Exactly.

Cristina: Except for the werewolf fails the most, I guess.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: But they are able to turn into a creature that's around their food.

Jack: Yes. So the idea is always the blend in. Not necessarily to imitate their food, but to blend into their environment so their food doesn't know they're there.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And in the case of a werewolf, they don't have the complexity to take this s*** because I guess you have to also behave the part.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: So maybe you have the capacity to become a human, but you have to be able to imitate a human brain because we're assuming you're an anomalous being. Otherwise.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: You're understand, your quote, brain, unquote, is a different thing. And so you imitate a human perfectly, then you behave like a human. If you can imitate a superhuman, you are a vampire. There are way less of that than there are werewolves. Way more werewolves. Because you can do that easier because you're not fully human looking, you're more animalistic looking. It takes less effort than becoming a human. Yeah, well, becoming a human takes less effort than looking like a vampire. So it's really about capacity.

Cristina: What? Yes.

Jack: And like a wendingo and a wet church are way down the totem pole down there with like werewolves. Werewolves, yeah, yeah, they're down there with those creatures. Yeah, same thing. While the Chupacabra is the furthest thing, it's nothing like a human.

Cristina: No.

Jack: It's notably a weird creature.

Cristina: Yeah, it looks like it's trying to be too much creatures at once, kind of.

Jack: Then so does the werewolf.

Cristina: Looks like it's just being wants to be a werewolf, doesn't it?

Jack: Well, a werewolf isn't a f****** thing. A werewolf is a creature that looks like a combination of a wolf and a human.

Cristina: Oh, okay, okay, I see.

Jack: So the idea here would be that maybe when we're talking about shape shifters, we're not just talking about one thing, although we kind of are. We're talking about sort of the difference between a Chihuahua, a Rottweiler, a greyhound. Like maybe there are different kinds of shape shifters. They're all the same general thing. Like I can call every animal. I just said a dog. Yes, but they're also different kinds of dogs. Yes. Different species within the same branch thing or not different species, different races of the same species.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So maybe there are different races within the same species of shapeshifter, which allows for more complicated transformation in the future.

Cristina: I would like to go on to that. Hopefully we'll get there eventually. Of talking about the different species of shape shifts shifters.

Jack: Interesting, interesting.

Cristina: But just get, I would like to stick to the blood drinking though.

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Because there's a million shapeshifters. Of course, yeah.

Jack: There's even animals that drink blood.

Cristina: There's animals. Oh yeah.

Jack: There's normal animals that drink blood.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: That seems to be a trait which tells us there might be creatures that exist in nature that are already sort of connected.

Jack: Two shapeshifters. They might have a branching like DNA strand or something.

Cristina: Maybe. Fascinating, interesting. Okay.

Jack: But it'll. It'll be way easier when we finally capture this werewolf we've been hunting down and we can bring that f***** in, put him in a cage, probably next to the Reptilians, Cause f*** them, send that b**** to Mars. Now that we've built that whole study facility up there. So we'll send that to Mars with the rest of the f****** things we've got up there and we'll run some experiments and find out what we're gonna do with that. Well, we find out, maybe we can get it just to turn into something that doesn't look like a werewolf, but we're closing in. Yeah, closing in. The sub humans are out there doing their job.

Cristina: Awesome.

Jack: Anyways, if you guys enjoy this topic, there are millions of this sort on the show. You can find many episodes where we're discussing things of this nature, a bunch of different types of creat. Previous, more primitive versions of this conversation. We don't touch on the same things that we touched on here, but we kind of brush around the different subject matters, including the Chupacabra, shapeshifters and things of other things and shapes like reptilians and whatnot, even alien creatures who might potentially be the Chupacabra in the first place. To find those episodes, you guys can find them on the official website, greythoughts.info or on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and anywhere you get your podcast.

Cristina: And you can reach us on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and TikTok. UsConvopod.

Jack: Yes. And remember to subscribe and rate the show. And if you feel so inclined, review the show.

Cristina: Let someone who might like the show know about it.

Jack: Yes, the power of word of mouth is the greatest power in the whole wide world. And that makes you a superhero, technically speaking.

Cristina: This has been the Just Conversation podcast. Podcast. Take nothing personal, and thanks for listening.

Jack: Bye.

Cristina: That's how they sounded like. Okay, you know how they sound like I've heard it. I don't know what's happening there. I mean, I guess that's what. Yes. I remember as a child listening to my parents.

Jack: And that's what it sounded like. Yeah, just gibberish. Like you didn't understand s***.

Cristina: Not that, like, if you're bored and you don't, you're not really paying attention, but you have to pay attention because maybe you did something bad or whatever, and they're just trying to explain something.

Jack: And you're like, somehow I doubt there was a moment in your life in which you did something bad.

Cristina: The Just Conversation podcast is hosted by Christina Collazo and Jack Thomas, produced by Lynn Taylor and published by greatthoughts.info art by 0lupo and logo by Seth McAllister with social media managed by Amber Black.

Rambling 109: Werewolf Science

The Just conversation Podcast, Werewolf, Werewolves #monsters, creatures, halloween, folklore, science, science fiction, stories, urban legend, terror, horror, fear, nature, 1800s, demons, possession, full moon

What is the science behind the stories of werewolves? What are the possible events that lead to their stories being shared over generations? Answers and theories to that on this episode.

Story:
After an episode where Calm Cristy elaborated on the intricate folklore and stories of Werewolves, Genocidal Jack decides to do an even deeper dive to see if the stories hold and scientific validity. With hopes of coming to a conclusion and maybe one day capturing their own pet werewolf, the duo unpack the origin of their stories. But what they discover about werewolves, native tribes and synthetic drugs throws their plans for a loop in ways they could not have predicted. All that and more on this episode of Just Conversation.

+Episode Details

Remember to leaves us a rating wherever you listen to podcast!

Topics Discussed

  • Werewolf Origin Story
  • Yellow Eyes
  • Monster in the Woods
  • Hauling Wolves
  • Tribal Native Outfits
  • Synthetic Drugs
  • Bath Salts
  • Rabies
  • Full Moon

Our Links:

Official Website - https://greythoughts.info/podcast

Twitter - https://twitter.com/JustConvoPod

Facebook - https://facebook.com/justconvopod

Instagram - https://instagram.com/justconvopod


+Transcripts

Jack: Where do werewolves come from? Is there an example in nature of what a werewolf could be? Or maybe a werewolf is just a collection of ideas, possibilities, stories passed through generation. So what is a werewolf? The answer to that and more coming up on this episode of Just Conversation.

Cristina: Warning. This program contains strong themes meant for a mature audience. Discretion is advised.

Jack: Going live in 5, 4.

Cristina: What does live mean?

Jack: Welcome to the Just Conversation podcast, the show where we ground humanity's most absurd and baffling ideas in childish ways. I'm your host, Jack.

Cristina: And I'm your host, Christina.

Jack: And if you haven't yet, remember to hit that subscribe button to get notified the second new episodes are released.

Cristina: And also, this show is most enjoyable with a listening partner to share opinions and ideas on topics we discuss.

Jack: Yes. So make sure to get some body pulled up nice and close and prepare to be en. Wokened. It's like the combination of enlightened and woke.

Cristina: Whoa. The next level.

Jack: The next level. It's because the woke movement is of dumbasses and the enlightened movement is of, like, self help and like, what is it called? The. The essential oils and crystals, people. And it's like, how are you supposed to communicate if you ban everything?

Cristina: I don't know. What's. Your facial expressions?

Jack: I don't even know, man. Because you're not allowed to say everything because everybody's emotions. The end. Just everybody's emotions. And it's like, all right, so if everybody's censoring themselves for everybody's emotions, everybody's being f. But you get offended by fake people because they're not being real, which is where all those. You know, if somebody's lying to you, you're being fake, then, you know, remove them from your life. But you put them there because they can't say anything. You don't let them say. So they have to be fake in the first place in order to communicate. But then you don't like them being fake because it's fake. And so you remove them from your life. Before long, you force everybody to censor themselves, but you don't like anybody because they're all being this fake person. And then you find yourself alone and kill yourself.

Cristina: And you're also depressed because you're always having to be fake.

Jack: Yes, you also. You're a hypocrite. You land as a hypocrite at the.

Cristina: End of it because, yeah, you're doing the same. You have to do the same thing for everyone else. If you expect everyone else to do the same that to you. And Yep.

Jack: Although I don't believe that. No, I don't believe any of them. Like practice what they preach.

Cristina: Well, next we'll have to censor emotions. That's the next thing.

Jack: I think the only thing. We should be censoring our emotions. There should be no f*** speech. There should be because we need to communicate. There should be emotion police because you shouldn't. The problem is we're living in a backwards society where people rely on others for how they feel. Like why can words affect you that way? What the f***? Just suck it up. Your emotions are your emotions, not anybody else's. Actions that affect people, that's a problem.

Cristina: And they, they need help. Everyone needs help.

Jack: Everybody needs help. That's crazy.

Cristina: I want to be emotion police. What do I have to do?

Jack: I don't know. There's. I mean any kind of police, I guess you just sign up, they give you a gun and a badge like a day later and they're like, go out there and kill as many as you can.

Cristina: Yeah. Anyone who shows emotion, I just shoot them.

Jack: Yeah. They're like, if they show emotion, they're getting hostile. And then you put them down.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: That's how you do it. They show emotion. The suspect is being hostile. Then you throw yourself on the floor. Officer down, I need backup. Then you pull out your gun, he's attacking and then you just shoot him a couple of times. And he was just Karen ing it out.

Cristina: Yeah. And I'm just being a soccer player.

Jack: A soccer player?

Cristina: Yeah. Just like, oh no, my ankle. Oh yeah.

Jack: Like when a soccer player barely gets touched. Like that guy who got tapped in the shoulder and then threw himself on the floor and pretended to like be super hurt.

Cristina: Yeah, those soccer moves, those are my favorite part of soccer. There's nothing better. It's so. That's even more so papyri than like any other sport. There's nothing, no drama like soccer drama.

Jack: Like it. No. They will pretend everything is the end of the world. Yes, it's so funny. But keeping on the theme of rage and anger and going hostile and cops shooting people for no reason because that's what cops do. And if you're going to be emotion police, you better be ready to shoot anybody emotional. Which means all the Karens are going to die.

Cristina: Sorry, Karen's.

Jack: They gotta. They're ruining the world anyways. As people get wokened, we can educate them on anger. Particularly like rage filled anger. No. All jokes aside, previously previously on this Conversation. You were telling us some wolf related folklore. Werewolves. Yes. And although we came to some interesting conclusions. That episode turned out unique. We landed. We stumbled on some things that I didn't think would connect, but they did.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: That was interesting. But that gave me the thought that, like, how much do we really, like, sure, we know folklore, but, like, can we make a real werewolf? Is that like, a thing? Could it. Could it be possible that there was always a real werewolf? Like, everything?

Cristina: But when you're saying make, are you talking about, like, scientists, like, Scooby Doo lab?

Jack: No, I'm saying, like, is it based on something true?

Cristina: Oh, okay.

Jack: I'm saying, like, in every circumstance, every bit of folklore is based. It's like a rumor or a stereotype. Like some part of what's happening is true somehow.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So where did a werewolf come from? There must be something in there that's truth. Something that isn't a lie.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Even when we think of some of the conclusions from that very episode, those have to be based on some manner, shape, or form of something that was real to begin with.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: And so I started to sort of look into it, trying to find out. And obviously it took me to situations from the past and situations from the present. Mixture of things sprinkled together create a pretty interesting painting of what a werewolf could have rooted from. There is a multitude of things. And one of the things I didn't know about werewolves is that they have yellow eyes.

Cristina: What?

Jack: Yeah. A lot of folklore about werewolves referenced yellow eyed beasts. Yeah. That they had almost like cat like, eye slit, but that their surrounding eye is very yellow. Like you could see bright yellow eyes.

Cristina: They look like cat eyes.

Jack: The pupil.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But the rest of the eye, the cornea, I guess, would be. Looks very, very yellow. And I couldn't zero in on anything in reality that for some reason would cause that. Except one very specific thing, which is actually pretty common. If you don't take care of yourself. And that thing is when you have an inflamed liver, when you have liver damage and it can't process things properly.

Cristina: It turns your eyes yellow.

Jack: Your eyes turn yellow.

Cristina: Oh, like the white part turns yellow or.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: Okay. That's what.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: And you looked at pictures of it?

Jack: Yeah.

Cristina: Whoa. Does it look creepy looking?

Jack: It looks pretty normal.

Cristina: Oh, so you wouldn't, in the dead of night, see someone with those yellow eyes?

Jack: They wouldn't have, like, glowing eyes. Like, that's an exaggeration. I don't know why. They'd have, like, fluorescent eyes or some s***.

Cristina: Yeah. But just those eyes wouldn't creep you out.

Jack: Yes. And if you saw those Eyes in a figure that was more or less in shadow. You would more than anything, like in any other case, see the eyes, most likely.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: And when it comes to eyes darkness, there's the stereotype of the black person in the dark. One of the few things you can see from them is their teeth and their eyes, because those are white. In the case that a dark skinned person is hanging out in the woods, teeth and eyes are what you'd see if you see teeth and yellow eyes, but they're hard to make out, you have a monster. Especially considering that most of these things go back to racist old white people from old times. So they had slaves. Slaves would escape, they would run away. And it's not an empty everything around you. There's other people. So you're running through the woods and you stumble into somebody's yard or some s***, they look your way, they can see teeth and yellow eyes, and they're scared there's a creature running through the woods. Especially if they've never seen a black person before. You're already something that they don't understand. So you're some sort of. And this is not doing anything extreme. You're malnourished, you have very little water, you have liver damage for some reason. You have yellow eyes. As a result, you're running through the woods and all they can see are your teeth and your yellow eyes. You're just escaping slave masters.

Cristina: You're a werewolf.

Jack: You're werewolf. You're some feral creature to them.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And we're just talking. You don't even have to be black. You could have just been Hispanic or some s***. You could have been Native American. And you're just dark skin enough that you disappear into particular dark light or you're hard to make out.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: If we think of Native Americans and their tribal where these tribes in the times of white people first arriving here, they still had their tribal wear in large numbers. If you come to a new land and you're not familiar with and you're still, you still miss, you believe in mystical things and a lot of fantasy based things. And you arrive from, whether it be England or Spain or Italy or Portugal or any of these conquistador infested locations, and you believe in gods and angels and demons and creatures created by monsters, you arrive in the land, you know some of the natives, but they live in nature. And in the middle of the night, you see, they're dark skinned, they're tan at minimum, and it gets darker from there. They're running around doing their thing. Maybe they're doing some ritual or something. They're in their tribal uniform and they look not the way. They don't have the normal shape of anything you could identify. They maybe have a helmet on. The helmet has weird spikes. Maybe they have the skull of a dead creature on them. Okay, so a dead cow or something that they put that on top of, like a buffalo? Yeah, anything.

Cristina: You know, just looking at like a chattel or something of it.

Jack: Yes. You're seeing something alien as f***.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And it's just a Native American with tribal gear on. They're just doing what they do, but you don't understand what they do. And it's the middle of the night, you look, maybe you're wandering, maybe, who knows, you're delivering goods from one town to another. It takes you a couple of days, which means you got to camp out in the woods and you just happen to be close to a camp and they're just walking their normal route before you see something really weird and you're like, what the f*** is that? I saw a f****** werewolf. It did not. It looked humanoid. It looked like he had a bunch of excessive hair or feathers and horns and a head that was oversized and he was way bigger than. And it's because they were wearing an outfit that was huge and fluffy and odd looking.

Cristina: What? Yeah, that could be the werewolf.

Jack: So now we're building where the stories are coming from before anything gets confirmed. We just have. Oh, I've seen them. Even if I've. If I haven't been up close. I've seen shadows and things. I know what they are. Those are werewolves. Those are a human creed, although it hasn't been a wolf yet. But you come to the United States before the United States. You come to America and you are exploring and you see these Native Americans or captives, slaves running away. You are in America. We have wolves of many different kinds.

Cristina: Yeah, this.

Jack: And they live where? The woods, the forests. And where do the Native Americans live? The deserts, the woods and the forest. So you're either seeing them with coyotes or you're seeing them with wolves. Either way.

Cristina: So they're wearing a wolf.

Jack: They could be wearing a wolf. And they're probably at peace in nature with the wolves.

Cristina: Ah, you hear like a wolf howling and then you see them and you're.

Jack: Like, there's a harmony between them and you're confusing one with the other. You hear the wolf and then you see the guy in the outfit you can't identify. It looks like some alien. It looks like a creature you can't but it's an outfit in the dark, and you can't really make out that they're wearing an outfit. You're just like, I. You could even think that's f****** Bigfoot. You don't know. You saw some crazy s***, but you heard the wolf. Now you're making associations. Now you're connecting dots, but there's nothing happening. These are just circumstances that happen to be close to one another.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: They're from the forest. The wolves are from the forest. You're walking on route to make a delivery by the force. You hear one thing, you see the other, you think it's the same thing. I heard a wolf. I know what a wolf sounds like, but then I saw a creature, and I'm already thinking wolf. But then I see that. I associate wolf to it. It's a wolf, man.

Cristina: Yeah. I'm not gonna investigate that.

Jack: Exactly. I saw Wolfman. Yeah, I heard it, then I saw it.

Cristina: Yeah. Real life werewolves.

Jack: Interesting, right? So there's definitely a psychological factor that leads to these things. There's the way rumors get started and myths begin. Is always base and grounded. There's something real going on.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: That gets twisted and turned by superstitious people and by ideologies and by narratives sometimes intentionally twisted in order to, like, think of. What's his name? Shakespeare. He writes stories about situations that aren't real to warn people about possibilities. And so that probably happened a million times. Fairy tales, a lot of the time were told because you wanted to warn somebody.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: We had a guest, our last guest before this episode, Chris Rustic, who was telling us about the banana tree, who would rape people. But it's really just a story you come up with to scare kids out of going into the woods, but not scare them away from other people. You just don't want them to be anywhere they can't be be seen where something horrible could happen.

Cristina: So saying werewolves are in the woods could scare off the kids from entering the woods?

Jack: Yes. At the beginning, it began as somebody really saw something. They don't know what they saw, but that mental association happens. But then they start twisting it because, look, I don't know what the f*** I saw, and I don't want my kids going into the woods.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So we make a story about the werewolves we saw because we did see werewolves. I saw it. I was there. I ran into town immediately afterwards. I'm like, I can't make this delivery. There's a monster in the woods. It was half man, half wolf. They tell the whole town. They tell the Kids, how long before that becomes just a tale that that town knows of, that the forest is filled with werewolves?

Cristina: And it's just to protect the kids, though, or.

Jack: It didn't begin that way. It was warning. It was like somebody saw a f****** creature in there.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Somebody saw a werewolf, and we don't know what those werewolves do.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Jump forward. Many, many, many, many years. We're in Modern Era. 2012, Miami, Florida. Some guy is on the street eating another m***********'s face.

Cristina: That's not a zombie. That wasn't the first case of a zombie.

Jack: That was the first case of a zombie. But it came from a person having bath salts, which are just a synthetic drug imitating, usually a methamphetamine or heroin. These synthetic drugs that are made to imitate, whether it be heroin or it be methamphetamines or whatever, they have very specific behaviors that happen to people. They do things that these other drugs don't. And like. Wait, what?

Cristina: What is it?

Jack: Oh, what things do they do?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Well, there's a couple of effects that they have that they create. You know, primarily the bath salt, specifically, it is a unique compound of things. Right. For short, it's called mdpv. But usually when people take these things, they tend to cause the user to go hypermanic with psychosis, and then they become highly aggressive.

Cristina: But do they take it for that?

Jack: No.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: They think they're getting high as if it were heroin or as if it were methamphetamine.

Cristina: So is this something like they're lied to that what it is or.

Jack: No, they know what it is. They just think they're going to have that reaction.

Cristina: Okay. But. Okay.

Jack: Not everybody reacts the same way.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: It's not like everyone who takes bath salts behaves the same way.

Cristina: No.

Jack: But some people do take bath salts, and. Because it's not like a science.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: It's not down to a T. It's. Everybody makes it different, and it's always tainted one way or another. People are going to react in weird ways. Exactly. So with a lot of people having these sort of very aggressive behaviors come weird sporadic brain patterns and, like, irrational tendencies that they have. They scream and they throw themselves on the floor and roll over and they tear at their chest and they tear at their legs. They scratch themselves till they bleed. They kind of go crazy, essentially. In one of these cases we saw in Miami, the guy who ate the face, he was one of two. I think the other one was in California or something who attacked an individual and kind of started Just eating a f****** person while they were still alive.

Cristina: Were they? Did they sound like an animal? Like what did they sound like?

Jack: Their screams were f****** crazy. We can hear.

Cristina: We can hear it.

Jack: Yeah. So we can hear what this individual sounds like.

Cristina: Okay, that's gonna be horrifying. I know. Is that the guy?

Jack: Yes, that's a guy on Bath Sal.

Cristina: Wow. But did they do something?

Jack: No, they're just watching him trip out on bath salts.

Cristina: Stop it.

Jack: All right, all right, I'll stop the video. Sir.

Cristina: Stay down. Stay down.

Jack: You're going to hurt yourself. Okay, so that are the sounds that a person on bath salts makes?

Cristina: What? What? Hearing that in the middle of the night. Horrifying, definitely.

Jack: Hearing that in the middle of the night is a nightmare of sorts, especially if you don't know what is happening. Now, as we know, it's been associated with cannibalistic tendencies.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Now, let's keep all of these things in mind as we go back in time to hearing weird things. And a man runs into the woods saying, I was on my delivery route and I saw a f******. I heard a howl. I saw a weird creature walking through the woods. It was a f****** werewolf.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: You know, it has yellow eyes. You saw teeth, you saw big build, which is probably just a f****** outfit of some sort. And you heard a howl. There's a whole mentality happening here.

Cristina: A picture is being made.

Jack: Yes. Now, you, in these times, don't have a doctor the way traditional doctors work. Now we're talking 1700s.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: So a doctor is a bit different of a concept. A doctor is really an alchemist, a witch doctor. And what do they do? They grab random chemicals, put them together, trying to heal. Random s***.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Usually they give you something. It's not even research. They're just like this s*** with that s***. Yeah, here's some poison. Take it. You know, it'll cure you. People are getting f****** given. What was that thing that's inside of a thermometer?

Cristina: Mercury.

Jack: Mercury. People are getting mercury. F****** cure s***. Like, come on, bro.

Cristina: Yeah, yeah.

Jack: So, like, it wasn't the smartest of practices, but let's say you have liver problems. So you have yellow eyes. Your liver isn't functional the way it should be. You go to this witch doctor, the alchemist, and he's like, I got something for you. I'm gonna throw a couple of these things together, and you're gonna take this. It's random s***. It's random. What are the odds that once in a while there was an adverse reaction that behaved the way a chemical compound like bath salts does. You can actually get close to this type of behavior with mercury poisoning.

Cristina: Really?

Jack: You get fevers, you get hallucinations, you become manic, you become aggressive. And you can get that from mercury poisoning. You become very delusional. Okay, so what stops a witch doctor from giving somebody who has a failing liver without knowing that that's the case? Some concoction that works like bath salts. Person, for whatever reason, wanders the woods and now you have a yellow person freaking the out, running out at and.

Cristina: Trying to eat them, trying to bite their faces.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: Okay.

Jack: But you're alone, walking through the woods. It's dark. You get randomly attacked by this individual. You don't get to see them. You already just heard the stories. You heard the other guy and he was a. You were like, he's a p****. He does. He's just seeing. Yeah, Imma do the delivery and imma get the money he didn't earn. And now I'm walking through the woods and then boom. I got attacked by somebody, some s*** in the middle of the night. It kind of looked human, but I couldn't really tell because it was too quick. But I know it bit me, it scratched me and then it threw itself on the floor, started screaming and scratching itself, and then ran off into the woods. What the f*** did I just see? Yeah, it was the werewolf that guy was talking about.

Cristina: No, you're gonna become one. Or if you know that's part of the story, if that's part of the story already.

Jack: Not yet, but it's gonna be. Because the guy who spends his time in the woods is exposed to particular, that puts him in a unique kind of circumstance.

Cristina: Wait, which guy?

Jack: The quote, werewolf. Oh, okay, okay, so Native Americans, people wandering, making deliveries, slaves trying to escape captivity, running through the woods. Whatever the case might be, animals have parasites and have diseases. And if you get attacked by animals, there are certain kinds of diseases that are more prominent in creatures and others enter the most dangerous thing you could have gotten at that time. That now is one of the most easily curable things you could ever get. Rabies.

Cristina: Rabies? Oh, yeah.

Jack: Now, rabies, basic things, it's transmitted through saliva, usually through a bite. If you touch saliva with rabies, you're not gonna get it. So how do you get. You either need that saliva to fall into your mouth, to be ingested somehow, or to come in contact with your blood.

Cristina: Okay, like being bitten?

Jack: Like being bitten. Now, the virus is enclosed in the saliva. That's why it travels through it. It's sort of protected by the saliva itself. And it targets the nervous system and particular brain cells.

Cristina: And what does the rabies. What is it gonna do?

Jack: Well, the rabies is going to cause muscle spasm, aggressive behavior, psychosis, hallucinations, and very particularly foaming from the mouth.

Cristina: Foaming from the mouth?

Jack: Yep.

Cristina: That's pretty horrifying. If you see that in the woods and it bites you.

Jack: Yes.

Cristina: And then just a person biting you, you will get rabies.

Jack: It would be transmitted? Yes.

Cristina: Oh, so in the story, the guy who gets bitten gets rabies.

Jack: Yes. So if we follow the picture perfectly, there might be a Native American roaming the woods. He's where the wood, where the wolves are. The guy is first, guys walking through. He hears a wolf, sees the Native American, panics, doesn't make the delivery. Somewhere in that time, the Native American gets bitten himself by some creature in the woods. They don't have a vaccine. They catch rabies. The rabies causes a series of behaviors that makes their liver fail for whatever reason. Now you got yellow eyes. You still got your outfit on. You're savage. You're crazy. You're acting like a maniac. Your tribe leader creates a alchemic concoction, gives it to you, enhances the problems you're already dealing with. Now you are extra manic, extra crazy, extra psychotic. And you're attacking yourself. And anything you see, you get cast out. You're no longer part of the village. You're a danger.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: You're running through the woods. That other guy's coming through because that other previous delivery man is a b****. Imma do the job. He's paranoid. You run out, suddenly attack them in your big fluffy outfit because you haven't taken it off. Nobody could get close enough to you. You're danger.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So you still got it. You come out looking like some crazy creature they can't identify. You don't look human because of what you're wearing, but you kind of do look human because of your general shape, except you're not making sense. You're making crazy sounds like the ones we just heard.

Cristina: And you're foaming at the mouth.

Jack: You're foaming out of the mouth. You're crawling. So it's somewhere between animalistic and not. Your higher brain functions are shutting off because of the rabies. And the hallucination are coming on because of the rabies as well as because of the poisoning, probably from mercury. You have a ton of symptoms stacking up on top of each other. And then you go and you bite the guy on Top of your struggle, you're fighting him, you're fighting yourself. You bite him, you scratch him. He panics. He manages to get out in time. He leaves the package behind. He gets back to town, he's like, I was attacked by that thing.

Cristina: Oh, no.

Jack: There is a f****** werewolf out there. You don't know that. That bite has f***** you up.

Cristina: Yep. So.

Jack: So you have the bite. This guy's been living in the woods God knows how long, going crazy. He's gonna die soon anyways because he has rabies. Your s*** gets f***** up. You start developing a fever. The wound gets infected. You start getting started, starting to hallucinate, developing fevers and developing crazy behaviors. They're, like, associated with the thing. Yeah. Becoming a werewolf, they think, dude, you got whatever that guy got.

Cristina: Yeah. Then their solution to hunt down that guy.

Jack: No. Their solution is we gotta give you some s*** to cure you.

Cristina: Oh.

Jack: But in those times, you go to nat to the means, you know, back to alchemy. So you give this person something that basically accelerates their behavior and behaves like bath salts. On top of the fact that the rabies was already causing a series of symptoms that are very crazy. Animalistic psychosis, hallucination.

Cristina: So he goes through the same thing the other guy is going through times two.

Jack: Yeah, I guess literally exactly what the other guy's going through. You're going through the symptoms of rabies plus the symptoms of, essentially, bath salts put together. And they're watching you slowly become animalistic.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: You're becoming a beast to them.

Cristina: Didn't they stab you in the forehead to see if you're a werewolf?

Jack: No, probably. A lot of the times they probably just ended up killing these people. Now, there are a couple of things that could enhance this narrative. It depends on who gets it. There's actually a condition called hypotrichosis, which is the growth of excessive body hair. And it could grow not just everywhere on your body, but it includes your face.

Cristina: Yeah. So you could have seen people. Yeah. That look like. They kind of look like wolf people. Yeah. Yeah. Like what you'd imagine, like in a corny werewolf movie. They kind of look like that.

Jack: Yeah, you could have. Yeah, exactly. Like. Like wolf man or some s***.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So you could have this condition and go through all the same symptoms. I just said you actually don't even have to go through s***. You could have been attacked by a wolf and seen a man with this condition walking through the woods.

Cristina: Yeah. Well, even if he didn't attack you, just seeing this man through the woods Is probably frightening enough.

Jack: Yeah, fair enough. But in order to get the condition in which we see somebody get infected and then become, then we must consider that the person that they saw who had hypertrichosis was a person who also had rabies. So maybe this guy in the woods has rabies, has hypertrichosis. He doesn't. He looks deformed to you, Harry. Everywhere, you can't really tell. Runs out he has rabies. He's crazy. Comes in, he attacks you. He bites you, freaks out, runs off into the woods. You swear that was a wolf man. You go back home, then you're starting to freak out. You're starting to have symptoms. The local alchemist comes and he gives you your toxic poison that's gonna make you worse than that guy who only had rabies. But now you're freaking out quicker and sooner and behaving like a psychopath. And they swear you're becoming a werewolf. Yeah, yeah.

Cristina: Yes, Yes, I could see that.

Jack: Now, there are specific circumstances that are very interesting relative to the story. And in the case of the woods, the brightest nights in the woods are full moons, because the moon is reflecting the most light back down to earth. Meaning you can see things in the woods, most likely during a full moon than any other time of the month. Meaning anything you'd probably already see anyways if you could. Yeah, you're just way more aware of during a full moon. And if there's people normally roaming the woods but you can't see them, maybe they live in the woods.

Cristina: Yeah, you're more likely to see them in the full moon.

Jack: Yep. Full moon comes through and you're like, they're out only during the full moon. Not really. They're always there.

Cristina: That's where the whole full moon thing comes from as well. Transforming during a full moon.

Jack: Yes, yes. It's just that that one is entirely circumstantial that that's happening. So the we can assume that the first delivery guy probably was making that delivery close to ordering a full moon.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And then that's why he saw what he saw. He heard the wolf looking into the woods. He saw a figure roaming while the other guy had less visibility. The full moon is gone. The delivery still has to be made. It's been a couple of days. We need to get this out there. People are too scared. I'm the brave one. I'll go do it. But now it's way darker. You have way less moonlight.

Cristina: Then you get surprised.

Jack: Then you get surprised.

Cristina: Okay, now you have.

Jack: With less visibility. You don't know what's happening, how long.

Cristina: That you're sick for and when you're at your worst. And then it just happens to be a full moon when you're getting really bad.

Jack: Yeah. Not only, only that, the possibility that you run off before any of that. Like they don't see you become hairy, they see you run off into the same woods they're accusing people of being werewolves in. But that place already has wolves. If by any chance wolves are hungry, you roam into the woods. One, they're killing you. Second, they're not leaving just because they ate you. So people are gonna be like became a werewolf. I can hear him out there.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: So you ran off into the woods because you're crazy and irrational. Got eaten by wolves. But the number of wolves are still there.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: So they're just associating the wolves they're seeing with oh, one of them is him.

Cristina: Yes. They're gonna think one of them are you unless they burn the body. I think they have to burn the body and then that wolf you will die too.

Jack: But that's way in the future after these stories become more prominent and everybody knows. So this is around the face that building solutions for the werewolf. We can't have them adding to the werewolves in the forest because it's going to make it impossible for us to travel if it's just packed with werewolves. So we got to dispose of anybody who's infected. Yes, that's where that solution comes in. Because it becomes a problem if everybody who goes out either never comes back. Which means they got killed or they became one of them.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And that also creates the circumstance where you are traveling in large caravans. So you build large groups, you no longer make deliveries as individuals. But wolves stay away from groups larger than their own because they don't want to be the prey. So when there's a ton of people together, the wolves aren't coming out to play. They're gonna f****** hide. Same thing happens with native tribes. They don't know these f****** white skinned people coming through. If it's just one of them and there's a f*** ton you, that's cool. But if they're roaming together with gun and f****** carriages, you're not f****** with that.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So in large groups they're safer. And then caravans form and they start traveling like that instead. So people only see werewolves when they cannot confirm that it is in fact not.

Cristina: So when you're alone, when you're.

Jack: Yeah, when there's either less of you.

Cristina: Or you're alone to actually investigate or yes.

Jack: When you're too scared to think clearly.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: That's when you're more likely to see a werewolf. And again, it's just an alignment of situations. A person with this condition could run outside, get rabies, behave like an animal. It could have been a slave that got away. They have dark skin in any of these cases. Any of them could have had liver damage, creating the yellow eyes. In the case of any dark skinned individual, whether it be the native or the slave, could have. You can see their teeth in the dark, even if their skin is dark. If it was a native, they have, using any of their tribal wear, they have large outfits that make them look disproportionate but still humanoid. There are many, many, many. And the woods equals wolves instinctively.

Cristina: Yeah. That's the biggest thing though for the werewolves is just you're surrounded by wolves.

Jack: Yeah, yeah, you're definitely surrounded by wolves. And that creates a pretty vivid picture for people. And the solutions that come as time goes by are just all a product of this. So we have individuals believing, just experimenting, essentially. You gotta try to cure them, you gotta try to kill them, you gotta try to. You do everything you can. This is where we bring in the scientists of the times. Which probably led to a lot of torture.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Because we think of like the Salem witch trials when the things they did there, this is no different, this is just a new, a new foe to them. You know, some new circuit circumstances. They got to learn to navigate.

Cristina: There were strange things we talked about that they do. Like the stabbing on the forehead.

Jack: Yep.

Cristina: We're cutting the skin to see if there's fur behind the skin.

Jack: That as well. Especially if it's somebody with a hypertrichosis. But they wouldn't have the fur inside, they would have it outside, which is.

Cristina: Yeah. So I don't think there'll be any tests. You. That person's a werewolf.

Jack: That person's a werewolf. Yeah.

Cristina: Test for that.

Jack: That person is definitely a werewolf. But this brings in another interesting point. This is unrelated to all those things, but related to the entire idea that there is a condition which makes a person believe that they are a shapeshifter. It's called clinical lisanthropy. And people with this condition, it's a psychological affliction which causes delusions of one having been or currently being a shapeshifter most commonly associated with werewolves.

Cristina: But that means that they also. There are some that have different animals in mind.

Jack: Yes. But now let's reassociate this with the story you hear about the Werewolf. Nobody thinks anything about it. The story flies through the town. Oh, he talking. Oh, no, that guy's crazy. He's always talking nonsense like that. You don't have to believe him. But then the second guy comes and he's like, I saw it. I was attacked by it. And then he, quote, turns into it, unquote.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Now the fear is in the town. There's f****** werewolves out there. Two different people in two different circumstances have seen it. One of them was attacked by it. And somebody can develop this condition out of fear. The trauma alone could make them believe.

Cristina: That they're aware that they're werewolf.

Jack: So they'll think I either got bitten at some point and I don't know, or something along those lines. And then they start freaking out. And then they start showing weird behaviors that they think are what a werewolf would do, then causing other people to panic.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Now this leads us into a circumstance where we have somebody who is not transformed but claiming to be. Probably even claiming to have gotten bitten.

Cristina: Or maybe he drank that wolf water.

Jack: Well, that's a weird one. But you don't have a full moon yet, and that's usually when you see them. This person hasn't transformed and there hasn't been a full moon yet. Now you start making these sort of unnecessary associations of there hasn't been a full moon, they're bitten, they haven't turned, and that's the only time we see them. Do they only turn during full moons?

Cristina: Oh, okay, yeah.

Jack: You're starting to connect all the dots. So what? The people who catalog these things. Things, they start connecting random f****** dots. And it's like the first sighting during a moon during full moon. Second and third sightings during full moon. But the attack happened during a regular night, meaning the full moon turned them. And then they had. They were already this in the woods, just roaming aimlessly so they afterwards couldn't go back. They turned during the full moon, which is why we see more of them then. And then they're just out there stuck in this form.

Cristina: Okay, and then. But then why isn't this one like.

Jack: Because there's no full moon yet. That's where the panic starts. That's probably why they are more likely. We got to figure the salute, we got to solve the problem before the full moon. Or kill them.

Cristina: And then they end up killing.

Jack: Then they end up killing them. This is where the experimentation phases come in, where they end up stabbing somebody in the f****** head.

Cristina: Burning them alive.

Jack: Burning them alive and things of that nature.

Cristina: Where does the silver come from just a random torture tool that just got on, like, catch.

Jack: That's a weird one, right?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Now, in thinking about this whole shapeshifter thing, I started digging into that, trying to find out if there are any creatures in nature that shapeshift that have the ability to shapeshift. To my disappointment, there is no land creature that could do it. The closest thing is a frog that changes its color at will and some reptiles.

Cristina: Yeah, but what about butterflies? I mean, a caterpillar turning into a butterfly, that's pretty shape shifting.

Jack: No, I mean like actively changing its shape. Okay, that's your butterfly. Your butterfly, yeah. Saying like swamping from one to the other. And the only examples of this in nature are cephalopods, which include octopuses, squids, cuttlefish, and nautilus.

Cristina: So they're all very similar.

Jack: Yeah, they're all pretty, pretty similar. They imitate their environment. They change their body shape by aligning because they're boneless. They get kind of like assort themselves in weird ways and they all have the capacity to change color.

Cristina: That helps. I guess that helps.

Jack: Yeah. But there doesn't seem to be any examples of this in nature other than those things. There doesn't seem to be land versions of these creatures.

Cristina: There's no Boo. That's so sad.

Jack: Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's definitely problematic because there is the lacking of where the original idea of a person turning into it come from. Because the best we can do is assume somebody saw a wolf or heard a wolf and then saw a person.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: It makes more sense if he saw somebody with hypertrichosis. So you hear a wolf and then you see maybe a Native American wandering the woods. And you can tell them very easily, but they're covered in fur, including their face. And you're like, that's what I saw. Heard howling. That's a wolf, man. Whatever the f*** you know.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So I don't entirely have any other path there than that because there is no shape shifting in nature, per se.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But that brings us to an interesting detail though, which is at the end of your episode, we got to the conclusion that it's completely possible that a werewolf and a vampire are similar and a not just similar, but probably the same creature.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: We're talking about a creature that either drinks blood or eats people. In every one of these instances, the werewolf, it took us getting to the story of somebody seeing bodies at war that were drained of blood. The vampires are commonly discussed as showing up in the middle of nowhere and biting somebody.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: And the chupacabra very similarly goes and drains animals that it can of blood.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Doing like looking into this, the, the most interesting connecting line here was lysanthropy, which makes people believe that they are a shapeshifter. And that's fascinating because it's common most commonly for a werewolf.

Cristina: That's very strange that it's most commonly for a werewolf.

Jack: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Most commonly that they believe they're like half dog or something. But at no moment does it prevent them from thinking they're becoming a different type of dog or creature. Four legged creature. They're turning into some other s***, maybe even a bat sometimes. Who knows what they think they're turning into. It's the fact that these people believe they're turning into something.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: And that's a common thread between all those things that I found particularly interesting that they could all root back to this condition and rumors of this condition.

Cristina: It could be all on this. Wait, do you mean like vampires and chupacabras could somehow.

Jack: If they. If it's not all real. But they are all so similar. It's either the regional differences of everything. If we think the difference between a Sasquatch, Bigfoot and the Yeti, it's like the same creature. You're just talking about different places.

Cristina: Yeah. You know, in some places though, instead of werewolf, there's like were hyena or were, you know, other creatures.

Jack: Yes, yes. I'm thinking that a werewolf to the west is a vampire to Europe the same way that a Chupacabra is to the southwest. I'm thinking it's regional and they're talking about the same thing every time. The stories were because of the culture.

Cristina: And the area depends on what animals around them.

Jack: Yes, that's a big influencer, what they're likely to see. Why is it that the west is so prominent with werewolves, but wolves are so prominent in the west?

Cristina: Because they're scared of wolves. Exactly.

Jack: It's in the area you are where the thing came to be. So there's a wolf man because you're surrounded by wolves. But in the south there are other creatures. You live by jungles, you live by deserts, you live in very specific circumstances. So you're gonna have some not wolf kind of dog like thing happening over there. Sometimes they describe it even being like a little dinosaur, which is probably just a f****** lizard of some sort.

Cristina: They describe it as a dinosaur?

Jack: Yeah, like a little dinosaur. The chupacara. That looks.

Cristina: Oh, okay. Yes, yes.

Jack: Yeah. So it's probably just some sort of lizard of which they have f*** tons.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: Because jungle's everywhere.

Cristina: Yeah. Whatever they're afraid of.

Jack: Whatever they're afraid of. Whatever's in your region is most likely what your big bad monster is made of.

Cristina: Yeah. And people like before, though, I think it helped them explain serial killers with werewolves. Of the idea of, like, how could a human murder all these people?

Jack: Well, that's actually interesting, the possibility that it's a way to tell a story without making people inherently evil. Because we have a tendency of thinking we're superior, then we have to keep that idea moving forward. So even if we might know it was a person, we don't want our kids to know what's a person. So we make up a story and we tell them the story to explain things away.

Cristina: And we might also believe these stories because we don't want to believe we could. We're capable of doing something like that.

Jack: Here's where the twist of information that I mentioned at the beginning of the episode comes in.

Cristina: In what?

Jack: Because somebody makes up the fairy tale.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: But how long before. How many generations go by before you don't know where it came from? And it's just a story of something that did happen. And the person who said it probably even had that in mind. They come. They just tell it like it's real.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Then a couple of generations down, nobody knows where it came from. They just know it's a story about a series of events. Not that it's a fairy tale. Then you have this creature is real because these many people experienced it at these times and it's somewhere. But you gotta be careful. But really it's just a bunch of psychopathic murderers or tribe sacrificing people or some s***.

Cristina: Yeah. That's crazy. What if though? Well, now I wonder if there was also, like, besides blaming murderers as werewolves, maybe cannibals.

Jack: I definitely think that's a big one. In times when total crucial survival was needed. Anybody who's starving. Like there was a lot of cannibalism back then.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So for survival sake.

Cristina: But once that's over and they're still eating, then.

Jack: But also not just that. Like you could just be killed by a pack of wolves.

Cristina: Yes.

Jack: You could just have been murdered by random pack of wolves while you're were making your f******. There was never anything. It was just wolves.

Cristina: But you find your dead body covered in fur or something.

Jack: Yeah. But people are like, you know, I can handle wolves, but can you handle a werewolf?

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: So it could also be a tactic of getting people's stupidity in check oh.

Cristina: But you know, people still believe in werewolves, right? There are people who believe it.

Jack: What, today?

Cristina: Yeah. Like there was recently a dog or I guess a dog, a creature that they couldn't tell what the creature was, so they needed to take a DNA test of it because they didn't know what it was. I have the picture of it if you want to look at it.

Jack: Sure.

Cristina: This is the creature. And some people thought it was a dire wolf. I guess that's like an ancient wolf.

Jack: Yes, that's a very old wolf.

Cristina: I guess, maybe. But the DNA results was that it was a deformed female gray wolf. Deformed.

Jack: That's interesting.

Cristina: Yeah. Because it has oddly long gray fur, oversized claws and extra large head, which made them. Like there's something weird about this dead dog thing.

Jack: Like it's not like the others.

Cristina: Yeah, yeah. So that's why they were really. That's why they needed the DNA test because it just. It's just something off about this dead creature.

Jack: Interesting, interesting. Is it like larger than usual?

Cristina: Yeah, it's larger than usual. So. But its legs were too short also to be a wolf or a dog. They described it as. So I don't know, like everything else was big except their legs. So it was a really deformed looking wolf dog thing.

Jack: Interesting. I wonder what could have caused this mutation that made it that way. Maybe it had like cerebral palsy or some form of genetic disorder that caused it to be. Did. Did they ever see it alive?

Cristina: I don't think so. I think they found the dead because.

Jack: There'S a bunch of disorders that cause physical defects as well as some of them also cause sort of mental defects. So they could have probably told whether this had some human type of. Really. Because there's animals who've had mental retardation and there's animals who've had cerebral palsy and autism and things of that nature. So they could have perhaps been able to tell if it was alive and they could have seen its behavior.

Cristina: Maybe they. It was alive and they got too scared and decided, you gotta kill it before it kills me.

Jack: People panic.

Cristina: Yeah. It could be a panicky situation.

Jack: Yeah. This is what I found related to werewolves and the origin story of what, where it could have come from or what might have perpetuated the folklore in the first place. Like where did these stories really originate? It. It was probably a collection of circumstances because the probability that anything of this nature is real seems unlikely. Yeah, it seems highly unlikely that a werewolf would be real. It's like all the evidence is painting Pointing towards a collection of events sort of lining up in the right order.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But not like any singular thing could have all of these things all together in one instance. I think it's just circumstantial evidence and superstitious people putting two and two together on top of mixtures of drugs and diseases and fears. Fears. Weird timing. A bunch of put together equals what we know as a werewolf.

Cristina: Yeah. The conclusion is that vampires are cooler than werewolves, though.

Jack: No. The conclusion is the only circumstance that could make a werewolf be real by any means is that it's not a werewolf. The only possible solution for there being a werewolf. It seems like a vampire and a chupacabra are a million times more likely than a werewolf could be. Because a chupacabra is not just considered a creature. It's considered a creature that was probably made in a lab. That seems way more likely. And a vampire could just be a cannibalistic human. Human. Which is also something else.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: But the werewolf circumstances. Iffy. It's hard to come across. And it seems like the only way that a werewolf could be is if the other two are also the same thing. If we have a bit of a shape shifter going on, then it could also assume the form of a wolf man or a wolf.

Cristina: But it's hard to prove anything about shape shifting.

Jack: It's hard to prove anything about shape shifting because there's zero evidence in that direction.

Cristina: No. Maybe they're just so sneaky about it.

Jack: How do you prove something is even shifted into a shape?

Cristina: Yeah. I don't know.

Jack: It just looks like something else. But. Yeah. So that's basically what's out there. That's. The possibilities are there's either no werewolf and an alignment of stars led to the stories being born.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: Or people trying to explain things away or warn people without scaring them about other people. Made up folklore and fairy tales.

Cristina: Yeah.

Jack: Or f****** shapeshifter. That's it. You're either a shapeshifter, You're a product of a fairy tale that somebody was just using to warn people, or a very specific alignment of events, including drugs and diseases and too many things. Yeah. That one's the least likely is the possibility that it's real.

Cristina: Yeah. Yeah.

Jack: A vampire in a chupacabra. A million times more real than the possibility of a werewolf. A werewolf is just very unlikely.

Cristina: Mm.

Jack: So that's pretty much what it is. There is no chance that's rooming. Anyways, if you guys enjoyed this, if you guys agree with that, that leave us a Message.

Cristina: If you don't leave us a message.

Jack: Yeah, either way, just tell us what you think about these things. Tell us what you think about werewolves and is. Is it a vampire? Chupacabra? Shapeshifty thingy? Is it an alignment of the stars? Is it a story, a fairy tale? Or do you believe maybe there are werewolves? And I'm up. So let us know. Anyways, you can find the podcast on the official website greatthoughts.info on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and anywhere you get your podcast.

Cristina: And you can reach us on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and Tick Tock at just Convopod.

Jack: Yes, and remember to subscribe and rate the show. Give us some stars of any amount. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 9, 10, 30, 50, 100. 150 f****** stars. However many stars you think we deserve. And review if you feel something so inclined.

Cristina: And let someone who might like this show know about it.

Jack: Yes, the power of word of mouth. You guys know. Tell people about the show. Tell them, hey, we just proved your crazy theory about werewolves wrong. Bob, you're talking about that werewolf in the woods. You're an idiot. Listen to this show. That proves you wrong. Or Bob, these people say it not, but you got photographic proof of a werewolf. Send it to them. Please do that, Bob.

Cristina: Send us the videos. This has been the Just Conversation podcast. Take nothing personal and thanks for listening.

Jack: Bye.

Cristina: Okay, I'm hanged. So I died to this person.

Jack: But then, oh my God.

Cristina: Come back to listen to a newer episode. You're like, oh my God, she's still alive.

Jack: Hans, bro. Like that.

Cristina: Shocking though, didn't they? Well, it was in one movie I think where they thought his girl died. But then she wasn't dead. She just forgot her memories. But then bro, they do this. Converted her from the bad guy to the good guy anyway. And I don't even know if she gained her memories back.

Jack: I don't. Look, I don't even understand.

Cristina: She a new person who just. I don't fell in love with him.

Jack: Understand why this works. Wasn't a in movie reveal. They showed us this. What could be left inside that movie that's gonna blow our Brian.

Cristina: He's gonna come back.

Jack: He's gonna come back and it isn't even gonna be like his brother look alike. We're just gonna have Paul Walker in the movie. I like. What else could possibly happen?

Cristina: What is the point of showing us that? I don't know. And then it's crazy. Good morning.

Jack: Dub a dub. Dub dub.

Cristina: Good morning. The Just Conversation podcast is hosted by Christina Colazo and Jack Thomas, produced by Lynn Taylor and published by Great Thoughts info, art by Zero Lupo and logo by Seth McAllister with social media managed by Amber Black.

Rambling 108: Werewolf Folklore

Werewolf, THe Just Conversation Podcast, Horror, Scary, Vampire, Mytical

What are the real stories about werewolves and where do they come from? Werewolves and the Folklore surrounding their mystery is discussed.

Story:
The duo begins a new case about werewolves and they begin with the folklore and tales surrounding them. From origins to methods of disposing of them. But diving deep takes the duo down rabbits holes they never expected to go. The connections they discover reveal the truth of werewolves rests on a different mythological creature entirely. The question is, how many other creatures are just this one? All that and more on this episode of Just Conversation.

+Episode Details

Remember to leaves us a rating wherever you listen to podcast!

Topics Discussed

  • Abilities of the 7th Son
  • Werewolf Features
  • Talking Dogs
  • Becoming a Werewolf
  • Curing Werewolf Syndrome
  • Werewolf War
  • Killing Werewolves
  • White Man’s Folklore
  • Vampire Werewolves
  • Scolding Werewolves
  • Adrenochrome
  • Shapeshifters
  • Chupacabra

Our Links:

Official Website - https://greythoughts.info/podcast

Twitter - https://twitter.com/JustConvoPod

Facebook - https://facebook.com/justconvopod

Instagram - https://instagram.com/justconvopod

Rambling 107: Fun Halloween Activities

Halloween, The Just Conversation Podcast, Radio, Show, Spooky, Serial Killers

What’s the darkest thing that’s ever happened on Halloween? Our Halloween Special is filled with scary stories of horror and death!

Story:
The duo plan an exciting Halloween night with a list of fun activities to participate in. They discuss Halloween decorations, the best kinds of candy for children, exciting sleep overs and maybe even putting the toolbox to some use. But things take a dark turn, as all Halloween things do, and the stones they turn over are more terrifying than they could have ever imagined. Find out how on this episode of Just Conversation.

+Episode Details

Remember to leaves us a rating wherever you listen to podcast!

Art by @Zero_Lupo on Instagram

Topics Discussed

  • Second Full Moon
  • Halloween Fears
  • Smuggling Drugs
  • Kids on LSD
  • Decorative Corpses
  • Santa Thief
  • Body Part Collecting
  • Zombie Virus on Halloween
  • Fun Halloween Activities
  • Toolbox Killers
  • Serial Killers

Our Links:

Official Website - https://greythoughts.info/podcast

Twitter - https://twitter.com/JustConvoPod

Facebook - https://facebook.com/justconvopod

Instagram - https://instagram.com/justconvopod

Rambling 90: Haunted Roads P3

Haunted Roads, The Just Conversation Podcast, Forest, Haunted, Woods, Creepy, PAranormal, Ghosts, Scary, Fear, Horror, Phantom

Are Clinton Road hauntings a paranormal problem or a physics problem? Resolving Jack’s Clinton Road haunting experience from ten years back by comparing it to similar cases reported by others.

Still taking shelter on Zombie island hidden in a Toilet Paper Castle, the duo decide to dive deeper into Jack’s experiences ten years ago, finally arriving at several different conclusions that might prove to be the answer to the conundrum of Clinton Road and it’s extremely high degree of paranormal activity.

+ Episode Details

Remember to leaves us a rating wherever you listen to podcasts!

Topics Discussed

  • Anticipating Fear
  • Time Slips
  • Nonexistent Locations
  • Vanishing Cave
  • In The Tall Grass
  • Haunted Woods
  • Time Bubbles
  • Overlapping Timelines
  • The Matrix Glitch

Official Website - https://greythoughts.info/podcast

Twitter - https://twitter.com/JustConvoPod

Facebook - https://facebook.com/justconvopod

Instagram - https://instagram.com/justconvopod