Rambling 270: Enoch the Honorary
/
Is Enoch a Necromancer? Is he The Master Necromancer? Did he solely create the Philosopher’s Stone? The Duo deep dive into Enoch, the earliest individual they could track who’s ever used the name/title of Hermes Trismegistus. The answers that are discovered and the questions that are asked become an instant game changer.
+Episode Details
- The Book of Genesis
- Close Relationship with Jehovah
- The Oldest Recorded Human
- “Translation”
- The Book of Enoch
- The Philosopher’s Stone
- The Man Who Knew Yawe
Official Website - https://greythoughts.info/podcast
Twitter - https://twitter.com/JustConvoPod
Facebook - https://facebook.com/justconvopod
Instagram - https://instagram.com/justconvopod
+Transcript
Cristina: Warning. This program contains strong themes meant for a mature audience. Discretion is advised.
Jack: Going live in 5, 4.
Cristina: What does live mean?
Jack: Welcome to the Rambling Podcast. I'm your host, Jack.
Cristina: And I'm your host, Christina.
Jack: And this is the show where we ground humanity's most absurd and baffling ideas. And today we continue the infinitely ever spiraling thing that never ends in any kind of manner, shape, or form, but continues to fall. The. The infinite rabbit hole that we have fallen into that somehow began at unicorns and went through. So much.
Cristina: So much. Yeah.
Jack: Yeah, so much.
Cristina: But now we're on to necromancers. Or we're beyond that.
Jack: No, we're still trying to hunt down this necromancer.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: We're trying to find out.
Cristina: We're.
Jack: Okay, we're sure. We were trying to find out if the teacher necromancer we were looking for was Hermes. Yes. But now we're unclear on who or what Hermes really is. Like, yes, he's a human, but, like, is Hermes one guy is Hermes. Multiple people?
Cristina: Yeah. Okay, so we're still on Hermes.
Jack: So we're still on Hermes. The idea is ultimately to find the answer to that question out, which I believe I actually have acquired. I believe I have found the answer to whether Hermes Trismegistus is actually the. The individual. And if that means it's one or many.
Cristina: You have all those answers?
Jack: I have all those answers.
Cristina: Okay, how do you start?
Jack: I come to you with nothing but answers. Okay, so let's begin back in the Holy Bible.
Cristina: Wow. Okay.
Jack: Enoch is a biblical figure and he is mentioned in the Book of Genesis, particularly described as the great grandfather of Noah and the son of Jared. Sweet. Who cares?
Cristina: Jared's not important.
Jack: He is, but not as important as Noah.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: Enoch personally knew Jehovah. Interesting language that is in the Bible. He personally knew Jehovah. Three statements that are made in this Bible that are very. Their own beliefs are so contradicting the very logic here. But I'm gonna tell you about three different things that are said in the Bible, okay. That contradict the very logic of Jehovah being some other thing. Now, first is, these are all statements from within the Bible. This is what they're conveying in their words. He personally knew Jehovah. That's 1. 2. He had a close relationship with Jehovah. Not a homoerotic relationship. Just like they were close. They were close in the way ancient bros were holding hands.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: And this could all be metaphoric until you get to the third one, which is they Used to literally take walks together according to the Bible.
Cristina: That also makes sense with holding hands. I can see that it's pretty gay, but gay men, friendships holding hands. It's nothing gay about a man and a man holding hands together.
Jack: It's weird that it is gay, but it's not gay when women do it. Right. And it's such a. Like, it's so programmed into us to see it that way, but it's so gay to see it that way.
Cristina: It is pretty. I mean.
Jack: I mean, it's not to see it that way. It's just gay to see it.
Cristina: It's.
Jack: But it's. Because it's not inherently.
Cristina: It's. Yeah, it's places where men can hold other men's.
Jack: Yeah, there's actually. Yeah, there's actually places around the world. It's ab. Absolutely normal. It has more to do with a lot of these. More macho places.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: And the US and the western culture, we're very detached from contact in general. I mean, we kick our children out of our homes.
Cristina: Harsh.
Jack: Like, okay, you're 18. Go live, go get out, go buy a house. Meanwhile, the rest of the world is out there living extended families because it makes sense. And we're like, no, we need to hoard more. And you're in the way of that.
Cristina: Well, we're doing a lot wrong, but. And where are we?
Jack: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Cristina: Okay. God and him holding hands.
Jack: Yeah, go to. Yeah, exactly, exactly. Enoch and God holding hands. Now, interesting enough, we didn't think about this, but this sort of dates Enoch because he's literally hanging out with Jehovah. So we're talking 12,000 years ago to 14,000 years ago.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: And this makes him about 12,000 years older than Hermes. If he is in the 14,000 year.
Cristina: Gap, where's Hermes at?
Jack: Hermes. Happened about Hermes Trismegistus as described walking in the hallways. Yeah. Happened about two, 300 years ago.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: And this would have been clonking him at about 12 to 14,000 years ago. If Enoch is in fact Hermes.
Cristina: Okay. Or if the first one of them. Yeah.
Jack: If he. If he's Hermes or one of them.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: Because that. Again, this is complicated. There is a line that is mentioned that kind of confuses the logic of this, which is it makes it sound like Hermes is in fact, it's unclear as to whether Hermes is one individual or many. That is what we're trying to solve because of that complicated sentence. Now, where were we? Translation. Weird word that comes up. This one is f****** my head. At age 365.
Cristina: His age.
Jack: Yes. Okay, so he's already had to achieve immortality by this point. He discovers how. This is literally in the Bible, bro. Enoch discovers how to translate himself.
Cristina: What does that mean?
Jack: Into heaven.
Cristina: Into Heaven, the word. He can teleport. He can. He can do that thing. He's a necromancer.
Jack: Okay, yes, totally. The Bible is talking about the Bible. The Holy Bible is using translation as a word. It's discussing it like he is made of characters. Like he is software.
Cristina: Weird.
Jack: Okay, the Bible.
Cristina: Yeah. A hiccup.
Jack: They forgot to remove it. They didn't turn it into a different word. It said translation in the Bible.
Cristina: We're on the. That's where. In the Matrix.
Jack: Yeah. Weird.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: And he discovered how to do that very important following sentence. So the entire thing I wrote is. At age 365, Enoch discovered how to translate himself directly into heaven, which means he learned how to get to. That's what the Bible says. But he can get to the f******.
Cristina: To Elfhame is heaven. Elfame. Yeah. I was thinking because of Enoch. I mean, not Enoch. Jehovah. That just meant he was able to access the. That world where they live.
Jack: But he's not. Jehovah isn't from Elfham. Jehovah is an Elysian.
Cristina: Yeah, that's what I mean. He went to the Elysian world because that's also takes a trance.
Jack: Yeah, but Jehovah isn't where he's trans. Oh, no. You got to listen to the entire thing.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: The interruption there is what confused you. Let me explain what the entirety of what I was writing was. At age 365, Enoch discovered how to translate himself directly into heaven without experiencing death. This is in the Bible. This was accomplished with a colleague of his named Jehovah, a guy that he's with now. This third part is from the Apocryphal. The apoc. The apocryph, whatever the crap. The other esoteric knowledge books, the one that Enoch wrote. Yes. The ones that aren't considered canon to his mention. Over here is where we get that. The mention of Jehovah. As a colleague, I'm suddenly aware of why he was removed.
Cristina: Okay, that makes sense. They were the best of friends.
Jack: They were the best of friends. Hermes and Jehovah.
Cristina: We're just scientists.
Jack: A lot like Szin and Eloi.
Cristina: Yep. Okay. We found his.
Jack: The question is then, was Hermes with them in the garden? Keep in mind that this guy could be anywhere and people just don't talk about him. That's part of his whole shtick.
Cristina: Hermes or Hermes.
Jack: And they'll talk about him under any other name, usually never Hermes.
Cristina: Okay, so he might be called something else on that team.
Jack: He might be somebody else on that team.
Cristina: So is it one guy, though? Does this prove it's just one dude?
Jack: No. I also have another really important thing to tell you. Really important.
Cristina: Mm.
Jack: I didn't have enough time to look into this because I can't find anything into it. And I tried. I tried. And I'm going to do more work on this. Specifically.
Cristina: You have something to tell me, but you can't really tell me?
Jack: No, I'm gonna tell you. I just can't dive deeper into it after I tell you. That's the problem.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: He. Hermes. The depictions of him are with a robe, usually a black robe, very, you know, appropriate for the time. Assuming kind of like a Zoroastrian male with a. With a kind of, like, head scarf thing happening and robes and black. Usually walked around with a staff that had a skull thing with a part of his whole. Yeah. Part of his whole, like, goth strict thing, you know?
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: But there was one piece that I only found out about recently that only happened when I saw him on a tarot card. And then I looked it up. His visual representation of what people think he looks like includes everything I said with one extra detail around his waist. He has a snake wrapped around him.
Cristina: What? Do you have this photo.
Jack: I can definitely show it to you.
Cristina: He has. Okay. Magician. Oh, the magician. Oh, that makes sense.
Jack: The magician. Oh, but look at him with the snake wrapped around him.
Cristina: That is kind of hard to see, but okay.
Jack: Easy to miss.
Cristina: Okay. Whoa. Magician has a snake around him and.
Jack: He has a little alchemy thing next to him. Just throwing that out there. But yes, Hermes with the appropriate.
Cristina: He has. Is there any. Is there any mention of the snake anywhere?
Jack: What did I tell you before?
Cristina: I told you about this? I know, I know. You said that was so. It's. It's crazy. You have to find out. Okay, I know, I know. That's.
Jack: That's where I didn't realize how blind I was.
Cristina: Too blinded and too blinded by the image. It's crazy.
Jack: I told you. Who's the crazy one? Hermes has a Naga. Yeah. Or based on that image, at least people depict them with it.
Cristina: Yes. So there's gotta be someone else he's hanging out with.
Jack: Yep. Besides, now let's dive deeper into Enoch. Right. In the Book of Enoch, Enoch is recorded speaking with Uriel, Gabriel, and Michael, three Elysians, all from the Garden of Eden's research team with the express purpose of exchanging information, knowledge, and insight. Okay. He is said to be among. In the book, he is said to be among the few beings who can see into h*** and heaven. This falls in line with being a necromancer. Yep. Being able to just not to look in and just know. This is exactly what being a necromancer falls with. In line perfectly. See? Said to be the only individual at the time of the telling or who could enter and exit heaven and h*** without having to first die. This falls in line with what we talked about earlier.
Cristina: But they do die. They just. They die, but they don't die because they come back. Is that why they're not saying that he dies?
Jack: I suppose. I suppose it's more that you're not actually dying. It's a metamorphosis of sorts, and it sends you somewhere else.
Cristina: Yeah. But then when they describe Jesus, they think he died and he went up to heaven. But even though they physically saw.
Jack: But keep in mind, there's two different things happening here with Jesus. There's a bunch of narrative manipulation taking place.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: That's altering the living out of it. It's less Morse happening. It's less so happening with Enoch because.
Cristina: They just removed it.
Jack: They just removed it. Ignored a lot of the other details. We could just find a bunch of the. In there.
Cristina: Mm.
Jack: But with Jesus, it was meticulously altered in every possible angle.
Cristina: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay.
Jack: Additionally, he's literally described as inexplicably entering and having and dining with celestials, entering heaven and dining with celestials and casually roaming the depth of h***, encountering the wicked souls.
Cristina: But what do you think he's really doing with the heaven part? You really think he's going to the real world?
Jack: I think he's entering Elfim. I think he has a way to, like, pop up on your screen, and that's the equivalent to leaving or taking over a robot and focusing on this side. Although I'm sure he could simultaneously be over there as an AI or whatever the crap is happening.
Cristina: It's very strange because it seemed like we saw or we don't really know what happened to the other people that left. It just seemed like they left and that. That.
Jack: Yeah, like they stopped being here. And that's weird, right? Because it's inconsistent.
Cristina: Jesus, we have no. We. It feels like he's still here and like he's working in the background somehow.
Jack: Yes. And I would argue they're all doing that. And we know because if you think of more recent individuals like St. Nicholas, we're more aware of. They're still working, you know, So I.
Cristina: Didn'T think like, if you're better at.
Jack: It, you're more in the shadows.
Cristina: But you think so the. The God.
Jack: Are they the Illuminati? That's crazy, bro.
Cristina: That's complicated. But the necromancers, the other ones, they can go into Alpha?
Jack: Yes, presumably.
Cristina: Okay, because I thought they can only go there to travel through easily. That's what I saw. Not actually SO two hang out there.
Jack: I thought so too.
Cristina: He's having dinner. Or whatever that appeared.
Jack: Oh s***. I didn't consider what that literally meant.
Cristina: Yeah, I don't know.
Jack: But like, how is he dining with them?
Cristina: Mm.
Jack: Unless they are also just another level.
Cristina: I don't know what that means.
Jack: The Bible literally talked about it like a program.
Cristina: Well, they talk about the getting there, but what's he actually doing when he's there? We have no idea.
Jack: Yeah, because maybe he's not exiting the overall thing. Maybe he's going to yet another layer. Yeah, maybe this is that kind of domino effect of the many. You know, the matrix that is just one on top of the other, on top of the other, on top of the other. And it doesn't matter is a billion of them. It's more likely you're in the illusion than you are in reality type of situation.
Cristina: Gosh, so complicated. Okay, for sure. Wow. He's just eating dinner there.
Jack: Yep. Abilities. Things that we know Enoch personally can do.
Cristina: Talk to the dead. I don't know.
Jack: That sounds absurd. It's the largest list we've come across yet. Thus sort of reassuring the further back we go. The Enoch has the ability to see all events of the future and alter events long before their encounter. That already sounds. Sounds like God just talking.
Cristina: Just saying that doesn't make any sense.
Jack: According to the freaking Bible, bro.
Cristina: So then did he do Jesus? Is this his evil plan? I don't understand. He can see. Like what?
Jack: I don't know. I guess there's also a seeming detachment from these individuals that they don't really interact with much. They just kind of do their own thing. Think about it. They're all established and then what? They just.
Cristina: He was close friends with a guy.
Jack: Working on Jesus and totally removed from it. He sounds like a Naga himself. Like he's just there. Oh, you need my help? Sure, whatever, dude. I don't care.
Cristina: Maybe find out. No, he can't be a Naga.
Jack: Oh no, because he has a Naga.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: Can enter and exit elf fame and the shadow Realm effortlessly said to be able to communicate directly with beings of Elfhame and gain insight without having to leave. Earthrealm, believed to be the most powerful alchemist, could create the philosopher's stone. Now, this is a very important line. It made it here because I couldn't put it anywhere else because I didn't have a lot of room to break this down any farther. But it's the most important piece of this information we're gonna come across. This next line comes from a medieval text that claims to be taken from a Zoroastrian text that claims to have been a direct mention from Aristotle, that claims to have been a note from Greek mythology that dates all the way back to Enoch. Again.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: All right.
Cristina: That's very complicated.
Jack: Yeah, yeah, yeah. This bounced a lot before it got to where it was going. Because there's no initial point. You have to kind of follow it from where it is now. There's no other line that would kind of hint to you that this is even relevant information anywhere else. So it is believed, according to this medieval text that pointed to all the other sources that slowly kind of confirmed it collectively, that Enoch. This is the. The answer to the question right here, by the way.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: It is believed that Enoch perfected the philosopher stone's creation with the addition of the Hermetic seal. The magnum opus was not his. No, the Hermetic seal was. Enoch is Hermes. And Enoch didn't solely create the philosopher's stone. No, but we know this because something predated him by a lot. Which means until Enoch, AKA as established in that Hermes, until he showed up.
Cristina: It wasn't perfect, which I guess would be Adam. And then he helped make Eve.
Jack: No, no, because that was too long ago. He's with Jehovah, not with Eloi.
Cristina: Okay. Okay. I thought Eve was much younger than Adam.
Jack: For some reason, she is 50,000 years, but that's still 150,000.
Cristina: Oh, my gosh. These timelines. Okay.
Jack: Yes. But there is one individual that's absolutely overpowered that we still theorize, required a third stone. And we just read a line that said Enoch literally knew Jehovah, the Elysian leader of the research team, the Garden of Eden. And they made. What?
Cristina: What? Who? Jesus.
Jack: Jesus.
Cristina: He helped make Jesus.
Jack: He helped make Jesus.
Cristina: He knew that. I'm so confused, because he could see everything. Why would he do it?
Jack: He was uninvested. He was uninvolved. It means nothing to him.
Cristina: That's so crazy. They had such a close relationship. It makes no sense. I guess he. Yeah. He must not felt anything. He's like, science bro.
Jack: Yeah, science bro. Like, I can't. Maybe there's a code. I can't. I can't tell you the future. Yeah, I'm not allowed to. We could be homies and I could help you and whatever, but I'm not. I'm not allowed to warn you.
Cristina: That's insane, because they sound super close. Yeah, it sounds like they were not saying nothing because he must have known.
Jack: He must have known.
Cristina: Or like maybe he warned and they still were. Like Nala's.
Jack: But then we look at what Jesus is, and maybe he did tell him and this is still part of the plan. Keep in mind, there's one part of this that's crazy. There's one part of this that's crazy. And we began with this a long time ago. We discarded it jokingly, but we began. And it's now coming back into view. We joked about it and it wasn't even considered seriously. But keep in mind that there. This all comes from research that began at loi. Has there been a plan the whole time? That's still unfolding. AKA the perfect plan.
Cristina: But perfect human. What's the point?
Jack: I don't know what the plan is. I just know that this is part of the plan.
Cristina: So you think Jesus is still part of the plan?
Jack: I don't know. I'm just like. All of this connected so seamlessly from beginning to end, all these pieces fall together.
Cristina: He knows and he knows. Like, it's still fine. Even if it might scare whatever might be happening. It's still. Yeah, like, it's still. Yeah. Okay. Okay.
Jack: So it's like. Oh, crap. You have the next step. Oh, good. Okay, gamers. There's a game called Outer Wilds.
Cristina: Maybe. I feel like. I think Outer Wild sounds right.
Jack: Yeah, I think so. It's a game where you. It's a puzzle story game. And in that there is the knowledge that they're gonna destroy the universe. But in the pursuit of science, they sort of have to, because. What's the next step?
Cristina: Oh, my God.
Jack: You know, what's the next step? We gotta push it. We gotta push it further. I was thinking about this conversation about billionaires. Billionaires work the same way. You know, you begin with the simple idea of. I says, you know, I want to make a company that works, but you're ambitious and once the company works, what do I do now?
Cristina: Make another company.
Jack: Make another company. Well, Now I got 30 companies making companies sucks.
Cristina: What?
Jack: Well, I need a super mega bigger company that's Going to run that and make other. It's going to breed companies. I'm going to stop buying companies and make companies out of nowhere, just random f****** companies. But I got all the companies. And what happens? Well, the argument that I was having led to, well, these are the people who sort of become ultimately the shady individuals who run the world. Right? Because you're just trying. You're so ambitious, you got to go to the next thing. But what's after a company, okay, Politicians, you got a little sketchier now. You're a little more behind walls, but. Okay, what comes after that? Little by little now, you know, the higher up you are, you could see it a little better. You can see the next. You can see the next up a little better. But all the way from down here. That's too high up. How do we see it?
Cristina: What's the up there thing?
Jack: The next step?
Cristina: Okay, you first.
Jack: It was companies. That was many companies, and it was super mega companies. And it was eventually.
Cristina: It's children's blood somehow.
Jack: Somehow. But this not. Yeah, I guess in this scenario, that would lead to children's blood. But literally, in the case of Jehovah and in the case of Hermes, in the case of all these individuals, maybe it's not even that they are different parts. Maybe it's a unit. Maybe Hermes had to be Hermes. And there was always a Hermes, because there's another pattern that seems to always form. They all have a f****** Naga. What the f***? They all have a Naga. And they're all sort of working towards kind of sort of the same more or less thing. Right. What the f*** is that? They're all kind of sort of doing the same thing for no reason.
Cristina: Mm.
Jack: We're all kind of sort of doing the same thing. Yeah. Even now we're still doing it.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: We're all kind of sort of doing the same thing, kind of aiming at this. At this thing that we couldn't. None of us can name. I'm sure somebody can, though.
Cristina: Yeah. This other life that we're creating right now is AI, though.
Jack: I don't know. I don't know. But it's all part of the on moving. And there's shadier, bigger, greater forces also, but those forces are also just another part of this kind of infinitely larger machine. And that again, Jehovah and Hermes were friends, but because they had to be. Because it was part of this thing that had to happen.
Cristina: It had to happen. Yeah.
Jack: Because literally Susan and Eloi were. Because literally Yaldabaoth brought them together. Yaldabaoth Literally said, go find my son. Yes, go, go. Start working together or something.
Cristina: Yes.
Jack: Figure things out. You need to meet him.
Cristina: Mad bromance, but mad science.
Jack: Mad science.
Cristina: But what's the end goal?
Jack: What's the end goal? That's the only question we have. No, we've never even been close.
Cristina: Not even.
Jack: Not even close. S***'s ridonkulous.
Cristina: But if Jesus is involved, what does that mean? There's too many still questions about what's currently or what's going to happen. I guess.
Jack: Yeah, it's. Yeah, it's like. It's too fuzzy. It's too fuzzy. It's unknown. But it's mind blowing that just this line provides so much information.
Cristina: So it is one dude. Did you solve that problem? You said you were gonna answer that. I don't know if I answered that.
Jack: Yes, this answers that.
Cristina: It is one dude.
Jack: It is one dude. Because Hermes is Enoch. Enoch perfected the philosopher's stone by adding the additional step, the Hermetic seal.
Cristina: Mm.
Jack: The Hermetic seal. Named after Hermes.
Cristina: Okay. Okay. Tada. Amazing.
Jack: So it's always been the same guy?
Cristina: It is. Okay.
Jack: Immortality is a m***.
Cristina: Mm.
Jack: Now, other things I found relative to his abilities. He had the ability. We've read this about necromancers before, but this is something that Enoch could do. So just to confirm farther. This is why I put this after that line. Because now it's just too obvious. He could drag beings in and out of H*** and Elfame.
Cristina: He's the word drag beings.
Jack: Yeah. He could like, literally go in and pull them across without them having to die for both Elfame, essentially. So heaven and for h***. So the shadow realm.
Cristina: That's pretty crazy. So he's op. He could drag various.
Jack: Well, this is an interesting. Actually, I read that wrong. He could drag beings from Earthrealm into the shadow realm, and he could drag beings from the shadow realm into Earthrealm. So between Earthrealm and between the shadow realm. Because the next line is the one that's about Elfame, which is he could trap beings from Elfame in either the shadow realm or the Earth Realm.
Cristina: How? It was fairy trees.
Jack: How it was literally described was, is that he can stop souls from returning to heaven.
Cristina: Ah, Cherry.
Jack: He's making sure he can make fairy trees.
Cristina: Interesting. He can stop there. Okay.
Jack: He can stop souls and angels.
Cristina: Yep. Whoa. And angels.
Jack: You can stop souls and angels from getting to heaven.
Cristina: How does that even make sense?
Jack: Okay, additional points. Enoch was known for frequently teaching youths the lessons he'd learned and the disciplines he'd acquired through his travels and his exceptionally long life. This is reading from medieval texts.
Cristina: Okay. Which makes sense because like the current Hermes or the one in. Where is it? Greece.
Jack: Yeah.
Cristina: He's just teaching people.
Jack: He's just teaching people. Which falls in line with what these people are talking about, Enoch, thus tying those two individuals together. We're really calculating this guy. He might be the only individual which we have at two points this far apart other than Loi, that we could be like, that is really the same dude. Because the furthest distance before then we had were the St. Patrick and. And St. Nicholas.
Cristina: Oh.
Jack: Which seemed to be relatively active in these times. And still back then. That's 2000. Ish. A little less than that time period. And the other was Jehovah himself. That clocks in at 12,000 years ago, 14,000 years ago, 6,000 years ago, and then again at some point like 4,000 years ago. But this now has Hermes as the longest, other than he's now second place, longest living. Third, if we consider Lilith. Oh. Because it would be Loi clocking in at 3.5 million years, then Lilith clocking in at, weirdly enough, like a hundred and fifty thousand years ago, and then landing again at twelve thousand years ago. And then. Well, actually LOI would be 3.5 million, then 150,000 than 100,000. And then we don't hear from him. Lilith would be 150,000. 100,000. I guess she actually has the largest gap because Lilith jumps from 100,000 all the way to 12,000 years ago. That's an 88,000 year gap.
Cristina: That is a crazy gap.
Jack: She has the second longest behind. Yeah, for sure. Because Loi has millions. Then it's Lilith. So she might be worth looking for because she's touching.
Cristina: She's a necromancer now. Like, we don't. We haven't even thought about that.
Jack: No. Because she's a. A gin.
Cristina: Oh, yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Okay.
Jack: There's something weird about her. There's something. But also sizzle seems to have been like, around bro.
Cristina: Yeah. It doesn't seem like gins have life like we have life. Like they're. They don't have the same. They could probably live forever just naturally because their world is so different from ours.
Jack: Interesting. And that's why necromancers must connect to that.
Cristina: To live forever.
Jack: Yeah.
Cristina: To live as long. I don't know. Like if they can live forever.
Jack: Yeah. I have no idea.
Cristina: But they can live very long.
Jack: Yeah, exactly. Especially with Hermes now. He doesn't seem to be clocking in as long as somebody like Lilith or.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: Or Eloi, but he's still coming in at. That's pretty. A hefty 14, 000 years. Yeah, some. Pulling in some strong numbers. You're around here longer than Jesus, my dude.
Cristina: Whoa.
Jack: Jesus by like, a while. Yeah, you know, by a while.
Cristina: And then we hear him. More recent than Jesus, too.
Jack: We hear him. We clock him at 14, and at 12. We then clock him at 2,300, and then we clock him in at about 200, and then we clock him in at about 700, and then there's no mention of any other individual going by the name of Hermes again. Okay, so he must be dead or going by a different name, which. That means he'll just pop up again because that's a huge gap of time. In every one of those instances, he just dips, vanishes, pops up somewhere else.
Cristina: But always Hermes. No, no, but the nickname is given to him eventually. Is that what's happening?
Jack: So an interesting fact about the name. The name was given to him by Yahweh.
Cristina: What?
Jack: As an honorary Elysian title.
Cristina: It's a title.
Jack: Now, I Obviously, I always. Correct. Based on the knowledge we know. So let's rephrase this. As it's stated, he is given this title by God as stated Yahweh, written at that instant. Yahweh. You know, he's written differently all the time. Written Yahweh in this instance, which we know is Jehovah's Father, by the way, which dates Hermes even farther.
Cristina: Oh, my gosh. How is that possible?
Jack: And we don't know how far back that day. Something.
Cristina: Then how does man. He has to have been involved with the other book that came before. What is it? The. The thing. That thing. The. The. The first step before the seal.
Jack: The magnum opus.
Cristina: Yes. Like, even if he didn't write it, he was probably involved in it somehow. If he's that ancient.
Jack: Well, no, because. Because he's human. Therefore, he's from the realm that the first instant made El. Yaldabaoth made the Garden by killing the people in. Well, he made the Forest of Shadows by killing the people of El Fame in there and thus creating the Earth. Yeah. With the Isle of Man being the opposite side and sort of the birthplace of the Earth realm.
Cristina: Mm.
Jack: And thus Yaldabaoth made the first steps.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: He would have to. Okay, now, he didn't know he did. But he did.
Cristina: But he wrote the book.
Jack: I don't know if he. Hermes, wrote the book. Yes.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: And he wrote the magnum opus. He wrote it down. Keep in mind, when Zosimos found it, people were attributing it to him as well, calling him the father of alchemy. But now we know that was Hermes.
Cristina: Okay, that's what I was wondering.
Jack: And we know that Zosimos was telling them that even in the notes, it was stating that it was discovered.
Cristina: Okay?
Jack: Not created. So whoever wrote the notes also discovered it.
Cristina: Yes.
Jack: And now we could just confirm, based on this information, Hermes wrote the notes that Zosimus discovered and that the Elysians had it with them because they were so close to Hermes, that when they left. Because where did Zosimos find the magnum opus?
Cristina: Their old home.
Jack: At their old home of the shores of the Persian Gulf oasis.
Cristina: Oh, my gosh. Okay.
Jack: All these f****** dots connect in such a web.
Cristina: Pretty.
Jack: Makes sense, but it makes sense. So Hermes wrote it. And here we have Zosimus literally telling everybody not only did I not make it, the guy who I found this from didn't make it.
Cristina: No.
Jack: And they're all like, oh, no, you're the father of alchemy. But really, it was Hermes. But really, Hermes studied. What? He saw something else do the original. He didn't see the original do it, but he must have seen either. Loi. But I think that's too long ago. But we're bridging something interesting, and I think this is where the next step goes. If he is the first necromancer, he is the godfather of necromancy, the creator of necromancy, and the teacher of the only possible three we can confirm in a possible fourth, then Lilith is who we have to focus on, because she is the only person who would fit in the time frame and the only person who would have seen the stone from within. The first point and the second point. If Jehovah has stones and we see him going to get the fruit to recreate them, and then Eloi actually had them at the time that they made the Stone of Adam and the Stone of Eve, then these two individual moments are unrelated. But there is one person that's related to both moments and the other person that would have maybe crossed paths because. Because necromancy somehow takes you through that world would have been Hermes going to the shadow realm and crossing paths with Lilith, who no longer associates with Jehovah. But no, she then does associate with Jehovah. So does she introduce Hermes to Jehovah?
Cristina: I don't know. She tricks them, though, doesn't she, to use the stone herself.
Jack: She did that with Eloi.
Cristina: Oh, okay. So confusing. Okay. And then they let her back in.
Jack: Jehovah had no problem with her.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: And again, it's weird because I don't know if Hermes interact with Eloi at all. We have two now individuals, now that we think about it. We have Hermes and Lilith, who interacted with two different Loi. Loi. Loi and Yahweh. Loi.
Cristina: Oh, that's weird. That's very weird. But what does it mean to the timeline?
Jack: I don't know what does it mean to the timeline? But we know it was a name given to him.
Cristina: Hermes. Yes.
Jack: Title Enoch was the name given to him by Yahweh. By God. Yahweh, as an honorary saint.
Cristina: Oh, Enoch was.
Jack: Enoch is the name given to Hermes.
Cristina: Oh, I thought it was Hermes.
Jack: No, no, no, no, no.
Cristina: Okay, okay.
Jack: Enoch is the biblical name given by Yahweh the Elysian. This is their type of way of speaking.
Cristina: Okay. They gave him the title Enoch. Okay.
Jack: They gave him the title Enoch, but he was Hermes. Yeah.
Cristina: And then he was still Hermes when he was teaching at the school.
Jack: He was always Hermes because he's always Hermes. His name the only. Keep in mind, Enoch doesn't have last name. Weird. So is that his first name or is that his last name? Because her mistress Magistus has a first and last name.
Cristina: Weird.
Jack: Okay, that sounds like a person versus this title Enoch.
Cristina: I guess. I guess.
Jack: Fascinating, right?
Cristina: Yeah. He's got more abilities. Or that's all the abilities. All the important abilities.
Jack: Yeah. I already went through his abilities. The abilities ended when we were talking about. Oh, no, never mind. There was one extra one I totally spun out after I told you that he could trap beings from Alfim. There was one more.
Cristina: What is that?
Jack: This is probably the most important thing.
Cristina: That I told you were just gonna skip.
Jack: I was totally gonna forget about this. I got distracted. This is a weird one, because this language, I didn't even know how to translate it. So we're gonna talk about it. But we know what the h*** it means. But I didn't want to mess it up. I wanted to just put it as it is, and then we're gonna make the obvious conclusion on this one. He could. I don't know why drag was so often used here, but he could drag untainted souls to h***. That's such obvious language that I am. Like, what? Because you're violating everything we know now.
Cristina: Taking good people into. Taking good, innocent people into h***. That's what he said.
Jack: He can take untainted souls to H*** yeah. Now, drag was used, but I'm sure it doesn't literally mean that. I'm sure that this was showing up in these texts. These are biblical texts. That's why they're showing up this way. As opposed to what's probably happening, which is what we know that others have done. Which is like the Judge, he can make a way for people to go.
Cristina: Through the shadow realm.
Jack: The shadow realm without ever having consumed any adrenochrome. That's a whole other level of overpowered.
Cristina: Yes.
Jack: And the Judge saw a rift somewhere. Yeah, just a hole.
Cristina: So you can just. He. You could probably just see these rifts.
Jack: Well, what was that rift to begin with? We never talked about it. That's just a hole.
Cristina: Yeah. I don't know.
Jack: This is the hole connecting to the shadow realm. It's a gambin, A code somehow. And you could just step through a place where you'd have to go through a whole process to die first and then get into.
Cristina: Can sense these holes or something. Maybe. Or is it them? Or make them.
Jack: Keep in mind. They could just slip to themselves. Why aren't they just. Are they literally just messing with the fabric? They could just suck whatever.
Cristina: That is crazy. That's too powerful. I mean, they're already Dr.
Jack: Strange. Dr. Strange everywhere. Just whatever I want.
Cristina: That's. That's. Negro mantors are ridiculous.
Jack: Yeah.
Cristina: This.
Jack: It seems like there's no limit to.
Cristina: How exaggerated they are messing with time. But he can also see the future. He can see everything. He can do he. How's he not a God?
Jack: This sounds like he's a God.
Cristina: Crazy.
Jack: This also explains why he would be so removed from giving a crap. Additional details. Hermeticism is attributed purely to Hermes Trismegistus. That's an important weird thing that is not attributed to anybody else. Hermeticism is attributed as having been written by Hermes Trismegistus, which is.
Cristina: He's just explaining how the world reality works.
Jack: How reality works. And it goes in two parts. And there is said to be a third part which used to be one of the two parts which would be the hard part. And the secret part. Right now there's the hard part and a simplified part.
Cristina: There was a secret part.
Jack: Well, the secret part is what nobody gets taught. Like how to be an echo master, presumably.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: Old magic. Exactly.
Cristina: Yes. Which I guess would be. The secret part is learning how to use those things that you just.
Jack: Yes, exactly. How to use those parts.
Cristina: Interesting.
Jack: Because the rules were you have to learn and understand this stuff. Presumably what he meant by the tools, by the technologies and the philosophies of the three realms is really truly understanding hermeticism.
Cristina: Yes.
Jack: And that would then give you the tools that he could then provide the last piece to you.
Cristina: That's crazy. I like it. I like it.
Jack: And it seems that he works this way a lot because again, he found some. He's an innovator. He finds a system and he adds something to make it better.
Cristina: That's amazing.
Jack: That's amazing.
Cristina: It really is. It's really cool.
Jack: The only three individuals we can honestly, truthfully and factually confirm to, most likely based on all this information, be his students. Because they don't fall under, it seems, his name. And it seems their motives don't line up with his whole I' ma teach.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: And their locations don't line up with his, and their behavior don't line up with his. They don't go by his name. No. But there's nothing tying them. At least location would have done that, if nothing else. But not even.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: So this by default. And because they don't seem as overpowered, it seems that St. Patrick, St. Nicholas and Merlin, all three are lower grade necromancers. Students of.
Cristina: Still pretty powerful.
Jack: Still overpowered, all of them.
Cristina: But yeah, nothing compared to him. Yeah.
Jack: At least in scale. More powerful than Elysians by just default.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: Which is crazy because we calculate Elysian power on the Kardashev scale for how exaggerated they are.
Cristina: They the same? Is one above the other or.
Jack: That's interesting because I would argue Jesus is above the other three. But I don't know where Jesus stands next to Hermes, because now we have a true question of power. Right? Where do those two individuals stand next to each other? It's hard to compare crap from Alfame. It doesn't make sense in sentences like how the h*** am I going to compare? Like a human from the real world and an AI. Like what the f*** am I talking about? But now Jesus versus Hermes, we're talking the same level, more or less.
Cristina: Yeah, it feels like it.
Jack: And Jesus's humanity allows him to be the necromancer. Use the abilities he could have maybe gathered the same way Hermes did.
Cristina: He has to be more powerful. He has to be. He's. I forgot, he's a. He's not just human.
Jack: If it wasn't for. If it wasn't for the fact that we hear from Hermes about 300, 200, 300, and about 700 years after the death of Christ. If it wasn't for that reason, I would have assumed that, like Glycon, Hermes became Jesus. Jesus as part of the process. This was the next step for him. I can't disprove it. This is the theory I was trying to work with because it was working in my mind, but it in my quest. I disproved it because I clocked Hermes at different points, conflicting with Jesus's points.
Cristina: So crazy. But okay, it's not that crazy. So they're not the same.
Jack: No, because we can clock also Hermes and Jesus being mentioned beyond the death of Jesus, which, yes, too bad for you Christians. Jesus is mentioned in other texts after his death in other places quite a while later. If you guys didn't know, you can go look that up. But they. They kind of ran together in different locations at the same time with absolutely different purposes, thus confirming individuality. Yeah.
Cristina: Awesome. Okay.
Jack: Yeah, I was working towards an awesome idea. I was like, totally.
Cristina: This is pretty awesome.
Jack: It's starting to look this way, man.
Cristina: It was. It makes sense. I see. But.
Jack: But no, it's not.
Cristina: Okay. So we still don't know who's the most powerful.
Jack: We don't know who's the most powerful. Now, there is an additional note to make here and we will close on this last bit piece, which is it's possible that if you look at how stories of vampires go, they seem to be very related to Jesus, very related to the whole blood drinking, the whole this, the whole that. But if you really look at stories of Dracula, the ancient vampire, different to all the other vampires, the focus is entirely different. It's less about the blood drinking, it's more about all his other abilities. His ability to just stare at you and hypnotize you. The fact that he's infinitely old in an unfathomable fashion. The fact that he's so intelligent and so wise, and the fact that other vampires are just vampires, but he seems to have abilities and powers.
Cristina: They're like zombies. More the other vampires, they're like animals. Wild animals.
Jack: No, I mean sophisticated vampires. If we consider only all the sophisticated vampires. Not vampires around Dracula.
Cristina: Oh, okay.
Jack: Because you're talking about his bat children. Yeah, they're animals.
Cristina: Okay. Yeah, yeah.
Jack: That was his experience.
Cristina: He could turn into wild animals. Not just bats, but like dogs and.
Jack: But now think of even in those stories, what's happening? What was he trying to do even with his children. Perfect. It. The story was the same. The point is the same because I think the narrative is the same. Keep in mind Dracula isn't the first instance of vampire. It's just the one that told the best story. So we're most familiar with it.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: But Dracula is still based on the elder vampire. And that's a story that's always been around. And the elder vampire is essentially all the characteristics.
Cristina: Like. Are you saying Jesus might also be trying to do what these other people. Because we don't know what he's trying to.
Jack: We don't know. I don't know what Jesus trying to do do. I'm just saying that the stories of Dracula, a vampirism, but specifically Dracula, might be inspired by Hermes, not Jesus. Because the other sophisticated vampires are inspired by Jesus. Yes, the one original, but the one that's about him being ancient and very private and dark and secretive. And you don't know anything about him. And him just looking at you and you just hypnotized. And these vampires not. He makes this. Them look stupid. He could, you know, magic and tricks and poof and whatever. And it's like that's a whole different focus than the ones that, oh, I just got powers. I'm faster and stronger and I could bite you. Like two different ball games. Even if they're both technically vampires.
Cristina: Yeah. So Dracula might be Dracula might be Hermes.
Jack: Yeah, Dracula's. Dracula's literally just the elder vampire. And the elder vampire is an ancient Celtic story.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: About an ancient vampire. It was ancient back then when it was told about an ancient vampire, Hermes. It was just about that kind of guy.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: Maybe specifically him or somebody else who found another way using what we're listening to in that dialogue. Vampire. We know how they got there, but would. At that point they wouldn't be. But then that's crazy because if the elder vampire story is not literally Hermes, then I just randomly talking crazy, concluded that there's maybe another not good version of Hermes that isn't Hermes. That might have actually been the true inspiration behind.
Cristina: I don't.
Jack: The elder vampire story.
Cristina: That's not Jesus.
Jack: It's not Jesus. I guess Jesus would be the most likely than. Yeah, he would be more likely than Hermes. Because Hermes doesn't seem like in the blood that way. Other than the murder part.
Cristina: Well, that could be in the blood. I mean, people disappear around him.
Jack: Yeah, but Dracula drinks blood, so maybe.
Cristina: Their guess on what's he doing with all these bodies. Jesus drinks blood, but the bodies lose blood either way.
Jack: Yes.
Cristina: To make the stones. Yeah. There's bodies with no blood.
Jack: There's drains.
Cristina: They can be like, how did that happen? They're not going to conclude.
Jack: Oh yeah, you find a bunch of. But hitting it so on the nose is probably because they were right and because the situation. They saw it. They could have guessed anything. They were right. So they didn't guess the right answer. They saw the right answer. That's why they were right. Which means Jesus, not Hermes. Right. Because Jesus would be the one trying to get in the homies of Jesus. So I think the elder vampire would be that. I don't think they would just conclude incorrectly the right answer.
Cristina: Isn't that what you're saying, if it's Jesus?
Jack: No, I'm saying that they would have literally just seen and been talking about Jesus.
Cristina: Oh, okay.
Jack: So they knew. Not they guessed and thus got it right, but rather they knew the right answer. Okay, they weren't guessing. You said they guessed the right answer.
Cristina: Well, they. No, they weren't guessing the right answer because they were wrong. If they were guessing he was biting them, but Hermes wasn't biting them because he was using their blood to make a stone. Not to.
Jack: Oh, yeah, but they would have been guessing the other guy's story. Yeah, that's what I was getting. Yeah, yeah, that's what I was trying to get to. They would have been guessing the other guy's correct story for that same situation.
Cristina: Okay.
Jack: Thus meaning that other guy's story that matches the already existing description.
Cristina: Okay. So it has to be Jesus.
Jack: Yeah, it's probably the right one. So I was probably wrong. I made that note thinking it made sense, but in talking about it, I have convinced myself out of it, and now it makes. Because Hermes is not associated with drinking blood.
Cristina: No.
Jack: Jesus is literally trying to convince individuals to do that. Not for nefarious reasons necessarily, but his method involved it.
Cristina: Yes, for sure. There's got to be some. Something there. Yeah. So he's not. He's not Dracula.
Jack: Oh, he's not Dracula. I was excited about that one, too. D***.
Cristina: No, I'm not. I'm not happy about that. I wish. I wish, but I wish he was.
Jack: Well, Jesus was. It's fine. Hermes. Apparently many people and apparently old as h*** and apparently new Yahweh. Which means look more into Hermes because.
Cristina: Maybe somehow we can get a mention, connect to Lilith.
Jack: We got to see if he can connect to Lilith and if he can connect to Yahweh. Interesting.
Cristina: We might have something. Yeah.
Jack: Following Hermes down the rabbit hole now.
Cristina: Yeah.
Jack: All right, if you guys have any additional information to give us on any of this stuff, feel free to shoot that our way on our socials at just convop. That is on TikTok on X on Facebook, on Instagram and remember to subscribe.
Cristina: Subscribe, rate and review the show.
Jack: Yes. And word of mouth. Tell everybody that we are unraveling the truths of the universe.
Cristina: This has been the Rambling podcast. Take nothing personal and thanks for listening.
Jack: Bye, Sam.
Cristina: Good morning. Good morning. The podcast is hosted by Christina Collazo and Jack Thomas, produced by Lynn Taylor and published by Great Thoughts.info art by Zero Lupo and logo by Seth McAllister. With social media managed by Amber Black.